"Quicker" Rise...

[Mike Z]

So if you Quick Rise (Down+any button while on the floor), you get up but aren't invincible. You can't cancel this to movement, blocking, or jumping, but you can cancel to attacks very early on in the animation. (Frame data says 13f or so, but it feels a lot faster than that.)
However, if you cancel it to 4+A~B or 4+B~A, which is just an attack which you kara to Barrier, and then you can let go and immediately be able to move/jump/etc. It's a ton faster than Quick Recovery ("neutral tech"), and has come in handy a lot since I've been trying it out. The downside is you aren't invincible during the Quick Rise frames, but you're also not stuck on the floor and it's a good mindgame escape.

[edit so Supa doesn't have to reply]: "Oh yeah, I've been doing this since the game came out, doncherknow..."

(It'd be nice if there were a thread I could just post this in, instead of making a topic...)

[Supa]

I'm too busy trying to figure out how to reliably do jumping block backdash 214A with Noel reliably...
I like that one.

No idea about this one. Video?

[MisoSowee]

jesus that's a lot of hand movement. I can see that becoming a pro tactic but at the same time not.... seems godly though. wake-up jab! :D

[Blade]

I...I get punished by Neutral tech way too much. I have to try this!

[MisoSowee]

I...I get punished by Neutral tech way too much. I have to try this!

neutral tech is completely safe though :psyduck:

[Supa]

neutral tech is completely safe though :psyduck:

You mean excluding what happens if your opponent is waiting on you to neutral tech so they can trap you in their next string while you're helplessly immobile?

Ya, completely safe.

[MisoSowee]

You mean excluding what happens if your opponent is waiting on you to neutral tech so they can trap you in their next string while you're helplessly immobile?

Ya, completely safe.

well. that's different. :psyduck:
he shoulda specified he was being tech-trapped lol

[WUT]

I love quick rise. It throws off so many people that Try to use a meaty on reaction to a quick recover. While 13f is feasible to react to, it's quite difficult. This "mindgame" also allows for both rolling techs to become a little more useful as well, since they're practically worthless if you're even remotely near the corner.

Moral of the story: mix up whether you quick recover or quick rise more. It helps. If they otg to be safe you can easily tech during the followup and escape.

[geist]

I'm too busy trying to figure out how to reliably do jumping block backdash 214A with Noel reliably...
I like that one.


what?

[Senovit]

Pretty cool teching system dudes.

[BANGER]

Pretty cool teching system dudes.

You mean "bro," right?
Like
"Cool teching system, bro"

[Senovit]

I try not to spout too many memes in one day, it's bad for my indigestion.

[ZhePrime]

Interesting. Throwing some more unpredictability into your game always helps.
I'll experiment and see how it works out.

[BANGER]

I'm too busy trying to figure out how to reliably do jumping block backdash 214A with Noel reliably...
I like that one.

No idea about this one. Video?

Seconded for video.
As I visualize it, you go into quick rise and attack with 4A then cancel into barrier then do whatever it was you needed to do i.e. jump etc.?

I've been needing something quicker than neutral tech these days.

[HurricaneDennis]

Seconded for video.
As I visualize it, you go into quick rise and attack with 4A then cancel into barrier then do whatever it was you needed to do i.e. jump etc.?

I've been needing something quicker than neutral tech these days.

yeah, pretty much. i don't know what a video will show you...

[Supa]

what?

MikeZ explained the whole bug earlier with Tager vs Bang.

Noel can definitely do it against Tager all day. You can reproduce it pretty easily with Noel vs Noel. Have the first Noel jump and block, second Noel 6C. First Noel will 44214A on during stop. You'll see the 214A go right through the second hit of 6C.


yeah, pretty much. i don't know what a video will show you...

Who doesn't want MikeZ videos?

For something this precise, I'd like a comparison to make sure I'm not just waggling the stick with fast inputs for no gain.

[Mike Z]

Yeah, it only buys you like, 5f over normal Quick Rise, which is why I said it wasn't that awesome...but I can't record cuz I have no cap card.

And actually it's a billion times more useful for Tager because his Quick Rise is broken.

[dragontamer]

Yeah, it only buys you like, 5f over normal Quick Rise, which is why I said it wasn't that awesome...but I can't record cuz I have no cap card.

And actually it's a billion times more useful for Tager because his Quick Rise is broken.

I always successfully use a meaty on Tager's Wakeup.

And by "Successful meaty", I mean I eat a Genesic Emerald Tager Buster.

[Senovit]

I lol'd.

[Makoto Camaro]

cool shoes mike

[Mr. Ryu]

I always successfully use a meaty on Tager's Wakeup.

And by "Successful meaty", I mean I eat a Genesic Emerald Tager Buster.

Hah


I should try this out. Didn't even know there was a quick rise. o_O

[Keo-bas]

This tool is highly underrated and rarely seen but those who use it are master of defending (exaggerating). I cant tell how many time I've watch mach videos and all I see are emergency techs (neutral tech) situations that's not favorable.

I found so many success with this tool and I think its over all more reliable than emergency tech. Of course its with its fault and all tech should be alternated use according to the situation desire.

[ZONG_one]

You mean excluding what happens if your opponent is waiting on you to neutral tech so they can trap you in their next string while you're helplessly immobile?

Ya, completely safe.

Lol learn2block?

[njmamm]

Could someone post a vid of this? I don't completely understand how I'm supposed to do it and how it's supposed to look like.

[MashButtons]

Step 1: Be knocked to the ground.
Step 2: Hold down as you recover. Recover with A, B, or C.
Step 3: Your character quickly gets off the ground with no white flash.

Nobody should need a video for this.

[Brother Mojo]

Step 1: Be knocked to the ground.
Step 2: Hold down as you recover. Recover with A, B, or C.
Step 3: Your character quickly gets off the ground with no white flash.

Nobody should need a video for this.That's quick rise. "Quicker" rise is more complicated.

Step 1: Be knocked to the ground.
Step 2: Hold down as you recover. Recover with A, B, or C.
Step 3: ~13 frames after your character starts to recover, press and hold 4A.
Step 4: 1 frame after that (or close to it), press B, then quickly release both A+B
Step 5: Your character barrier blocks briefly, stopping incoming attacks earlier than would normally be possible with a quick rise, and if no attacks come, recovers faster overall than if you had just used a normal quick rise.

(The order with which you press A and B may be reversed. Also, 1A/B may be used if you expect a low attack.)

It's actually quite tricky.

[njmamm]

Wait, so do u c the 4a come out? and do u do that whole kara thing just b/c u can't do it directly?
Also, idk how long 13 frames is supposed to last... -_-"

[kenja0]

1/4 of a second.

It's also grab invincible as you rise. So if you hate Bang or Tager's command grabs, do this to throw them off because there isn't any visual or audible cue. Also, if Tager is jumping 720C, Quick Rise will give you enough time for you to jump.

[njmamm]

Hmm...I see...
Well, I guess I'll try. I just hope I'm doing it right... -_-"

[Osuna]

1/4 of a second.

It's also grab invincible as you rise. So if you hate Bang or Tager's command grabs, do this to throw them off because there isn't any visual or audible cue. Also, if Tager is jumping 720C, Quick Rise will give you enough time for you to jump.Neutral tech gives you enough time to jump too. Not that special, especially since if they were to go for a throw during the quick rise time frame it would have missed the neutral tech anyway. Maybe if someone was trying to psychic punish a roll with a throw, which at least tager can punish on reaction I think.

So yeah not sure how to best apply throw invincibility.

[kenja0]

Well say Tager does a 720:
-If he lets go during the invincibility, he doesn't hit.
-If he lets go after the wakeup, he doesn't hit because the opponent can jump it.

Not that hard to time, right? It's very hard to time a counter to quick teching because no cues AND people have conditioned themselves to time counters against neutral/roll.

I'd use it moreso than other techs unless the opponent is on the ground, next to me.

[Dacidbro]

Who the fuck necros a thread that's 10 months old just to post "this works well"? O_o

[Brother Mojo]

Wait, so do u c the 4a come out? and do u do that whole kara thing just b/c u can't do it directly?
Also, idk how long 13 frames is supposed to last... -_-"You do the kara cancel thing because indeed you can't cancel quick get up into barrier, but you can into a jab which can then be kara'd into a barrier.

If you do it ideally, you only see the first frame of the 4A/B's startup, so generally you won't really see it at all.

[TheGreatReptar]

Who the fuck necros a thread that's 10 months old just to post "this works well"? O_o

I dunno, but I appreciate them doing it as I didn't see this thread before. Time to practice p-linking some more in SSFIV so I can do this stuff when CS comes out.

[Keo-bas]

Who the fuck necros a thread that's 10 months old just to post "this works well"? O_o

I posted this out because out of all the match videos I seen, wether from battle chariot, Mikado, UFO or what ever well known tournaments I've yet to seen this technique use. I doubt it's because player think it sucks but rather most don't know about it. I can understand how most wouldn't know because this a defensive technique and they always go notice.

Though I have to admit that I don't have very strong competition. I must admit I had great success with this tool. Its piratically is the quickies way to recover, of course it's not with out its own flaw. And no one should completely rely on it but add it to thier wake up game arsenal so they won't create predictable scenarios.

[souseta]

this may catch them people by surprise the first time, but I think once you do it once, they can just do some normals while you even still in the ground and you are still forced to block it or you will get hit while you are barrier-ing
not 100% sure, but this is my hypothesis.

[smooshman]

honestly I've only ever quick rised when the enemy is far away.

[Osuna]

Well say Tager does a 720:
-If he lets go during the invincibility, he doesn't hit.
-If he lets go after the wakeup, he doesn't hit because the opponent can jump it.

Not that hard to time, right? It's very hard to time a counter to quick teching because no cues AND people have conditioned themselves to time counters against neutral/roll.

I'd use it moreso than other techs unless the opponent is on the ground, next to me.On the ground next to you. Like throw range. Again the throw invulnerability isn't very key.

I'm not sure what the 720 example has to do with anything. The same is true for neutral tech.

[Keo-bas]

this may catch them people by surprise the first time, but I think once you do it once, they can just do some normals while you even still in the ground and you are still forced to block it or you will get hit while you are barrier-ing
not 100% sure, but this is my hypothesis.

I'm confident in saying that BB developer approached wake up scenario with rock paper scissors mentality but with few wild cards added (depending on character traits). It's a situation revolving around anticipations and hypothesis thinking.

I'll try my best to break in down.

Like how scientist approaches trial solution with hypothesis, player normally do the same.

The trial I will be referring to is Blazblue's "Knockdown" status that capable of wake up tech. (their are some situation where one can ONLY emergency tech or receive OTG attacks but were going to exclude these from the trial)

Like other trial we work on an absolute foundation and develop many hypothesis base on that trial.

Here are the possible action in knockdown state.

emergency Tech AKA "Nuetral tech.: Nature: definitive stun escape
This tech is the quickest activated tech due to commands only consisting a button press. The known properties are are over all body invincibility but in return restrains your from doing reversal due longest recovery frames it has. I think the essence of this option is to escape meatys,invalid combo's, or anything that can keep you stun but with neutral status.

The next set are wake up tools. they are not considered techs because although their purpose is about escaping a stun state, they are more of mixup that you'll first have you gamble a longer state state of stun ( about a second) for wake up benefits which can be both escape from knockdown stun status and countering . ( I say countering because your wake up choice will be use to counter an action that your opponent has the initiate state)

Nuetral wake up AKA "Quick rise". Nature= Speedy Recovery
Following conditions of wake up, this requires you to input down and a button to activate. The known properties of this command is although vulnerable to attacks ( as to all wake ups) this one has the least amount of recovery frames from knockdown status and invulnerable to throws during the command. I think the essence of this choice is to regain neutral status as quick as possible, even though emergency tech has the fastest activation rate, neutral wake up has the fastest recovery which forces your opponent to act quickly as well. Instead of those who like to set up by waiting for activation signal of other wake up or emergency tech. (quick rise has none)

Back roll wake up AKA "retreating wake up* nature=Passive Defensive
Following the same condition as Neutral wake ups, this one requires a back press and button to activate. The known property of this one is that you will regain invincibility for duration of the roll and recover space away from your opponent. I think the essence of this command is to create many safe guards from a tactical standpoint. With timing one can avoid most of your enemy attacks, and even though reversal are impossible due to recovery frames. (not enough time to unleash an attack) you cancel it out with barrier to build even more safeguards. Thus creating a passive defensive nature with the ability to be defensive but not assertive.


Forward roll wake up AKA "advancing wake up" Nature= Aggressive Defensive
Following the conditions of wake up, this command requires you to press forward and a button. The known property of this move is similar to back roll except it has less invincibility than than the back roll how ever it closes in the space between you and your opponent. Due to the tactical nature of rolls forward roll has the ability to cross up you opponents attack by getting behind him. (how ever they can use this to their advantage as well) I think the essence of this move is to regain neutral status but also to disoriented your opponents as well. (which will force most opponent to be defensive in the confusion) You sacrifice more safe guards to retain more of an offensive momentum. Which is why I consider the nature of this command Aggressive defensive.


Each tool should be used collectively from each player for their own desires.