do you think the gg community would be bigger with rollback netcode?

[LockedAndClush]

On topic of streamlining and loosening the inputs:

Let's remember Persona, that has probably the most lenient inputs I ever saw and doesn't even feature a SINGLE DP or half-circle. There are like three characters that use charge motions in the entire game IIRC, the rest is just quarter-circles and button combinations. Dashing in Ultimax is so easy I could do it with just my thumb, both ways. Even with a name as big and beloved as Persona 4 the game just couldn't pull in and hold the players for the competitive aspect.

The anime/ASW fighters/whatever you want to call them community is considered by most outsiders to bandwagon to the newest release every time it happens. Over the last year people played BBCP and moved to Ultimax, and then dropped Ultimax to play GG, and a lot of players will now turn away from GG to play CPEX, and we all know it's true - I did this myself here and there. No one "from the outside" wants to dedicate countless hours to GG only to watch everyone around move on to a different game barely by the time they learned anything.

[sren]

1) Very debatable.  IMO links are much harder to really get down than chain based combo systems.

in SF links kinda rather static, quite plenty of links also in GG.  like Dust loops, IAD combos or basic Ram stuff like dash up P after Daruo.  guess Plink based 1F links sorta become 3F window links.  have u seen how some ppl complain about havin' a 2F reversal window?

[Nobus3r1]

I completely disagree.  Guilty Gear is definitely a game where you can rely on fundamentals and still win.  Supers are not necessary, long combos are not necessary.  Simple gatling combos are very effective with almost all characters.  Like any other good game, there's plenty of room to grow and if you're very far behind the person you're fighting you'll get destroyed, but smart play with pokes, sweeps, and throws goes a very, very long way in this series, and now that YRCs don't have timing restrictions and BS exists there's even less room for execution complaints.

Ironically, I think the SF series is making fundamentals less and less important as it goes on.

Actually after watching the streams for the last few majors it really seems, as much as it pains me to say this, that the game that emphasizes solid neutral play (at least at the start of the match) is UMvC3 because that game has largely evolved into first person to fuck up loses.  This results in a heavy focus on clean movement combined with a very cautious probing style of play at least until X-Factor enters the equation...

 

in SF links kinda rather static, quite plenty of links also in GG.  like Dust loops, IAD combos or basic Ram stuff like dash up P after Daruo.  guess Plink based 1F links sorta become 3F window links.  have u seen how some ppl complain about havin' a 2F reversal window?

I'm pretty sure you can never more than double your chance for hitting your link; i.e. 2 chances to hit a one frame link.  You can either plink which will result in getting the higher priority of your inputs on consecutive frames, you can blink (back/select button plink) which is basically a more reliable and versatile plink resulting from a "hilarious" programming error where you'll get whatever button was pressed in conjunction with the back button on consecutive frames or you can double tap in which case you basically get input, nothing then input again over a three frame time period.  Also SFIV links are nothing resembling static as you a) may need to be able to (depending on the characters involved) instantly diagnose if the character you where hitting was standing or crouching in order to do the correct combo AND b) recognize instantly when counter-hits occur due to the way that they change the frame advantage on hit which varies by the strength of the move that counter-hit but which isn't always the same for all characters AND c) knowledge of character specific links which has gotten much, much worse with USFIV.  So no, I wouldn't call how links function within USFIV particularly static or hell, depending on the situation, even particularly consistent.

 

I guess my last point on links with USFIV vs. GGXrd is that if you don't want to deal with links in Xrd you can probably either find a character that doesn't have to deal with them or a character which has fairly lenient links.  There is not a single character in USFIV that isn't reliant on links for their combos.  There are even a few characters in USFIV whose most basic hit-confirmable combos involve multiple 1f links.

 

I have seen people complain about a 2f reversal window.  I am personally fine with a small reversal window.  I am also thankful that relative to the meter investment that there aren't any invincible reversals in Xrd (at least none that come to mind) that on their own represent a high percentage output relative to the characters BnBs; e.g. in USFIV Decapre's BnB does ~200 damage but her best reversal does 160 damage or ~80% of the damage she gets for actually hit confirming.  Combine that with the lenient reversal window in that game and...yeah...

[Rele]

I've seen people who complain about Xrd's 2f reversal window but they seem to be perfectly fine with having to grind 1f links in SF4 (which, in case you don't have them down, will most likely get "punished" by dp mashing). Erm...

[GSD-SPL]

whoa WHAT

How can you have a community when you have to hit diagonals? RIP XRD, you tried.

[sren]

 

I'm pretty sure you can never more than double your chance for hitting your link; i.e. 2 chances to hit a one frame link.  You can either plink which will result in getting the higher priority of your inputs on consecutive frames, you can blink (back/select button plink) which is basically a more reliable and versatile plink resulting from a "hilarious" programming error where you'll get whatever button was pressed in conjunction with the back button on consecutive frames or you can double tap in which case you basically get input, nothing then input again over a three frame time period. 

would say plinkin' gives 1F links a 3F window cuz in SF4 engine any of the 2 followin' combinations grants a   input in frame - x - in which case targetin' the inputs on a 3 frame window might suffice.  no idea how accurate of a description it is though (technically double tappin' + select/back plinkin' might be able to give 3 consecutive inputs within 3 frames, probably not much practical viability though)  

 

3rd frame                                             

2nd frame  (x)             

1st frame