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Bandit Revolver

Ragna Critique and Self-Improvement Thread

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Hi everyone from Dustloop!

First time poster, long time reader here. Not that I can grasp many things that you guys talk about, I'm very interested in all the discussions here. I was wondering if I could get a bit of advice from more experienced players. To briefly introduce myself and my history in fighting games, I'd consider myself a very basic player of BB. I used to play a lot of GGXXAC, but not to the point of being at all tournament quality. My main was HOS in that game, so it seems natural that I would be attracted to Ragna in this one. My style is high pressure offensive.

This is a match of mine that I played last night. Unfortunately I do not have a capture card so I had to prop my laptop up on some books and point it at the TV. Also, because it's capturing audio from the onboard mic, you can hear other things from the room (like my 2 month old daughter!). Also, I am ranked 3 and the Nu was ranked 11.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PpSQL-IzixQ

Any advice on what I should work on to take it to the next level? I do enjoy watching long combos but in my experience with practice mode, the easiest high damage combo to do is a very basic: 5C, 5DD, 214B, 214D. It's easier to setup with 5B before the 5C, but that drops the damage output by at least 20% in total. I prefer less hit combos with more damage output. Flash < Damage. I realize my style is boring. :vbang:

Hoping to join the community and be a active poster. Please, if you guys/gals have any advice it would be awesome. :keke:

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I'll name a couple of things to improve on. First of all, you need to consider why sometimes damage isn't everything. Sure, it's nice to get more damage by starting a combo with 5C instead of 5B, but there's a reason that's not always the best idea. You have to take into account the properties of the 2 moves. 5B may scale the damage more and have slightly less range, but it's faster than 5C and recovers much quicker if it misses. Also if the opponent blocks, it's easier to confirm whether or not to finish your combo if you start from an extra move. If you KNOW 5C is going to hit, go ahead and start with that. But if you're just fishing for a hit, I would say 5B is a safer option. You're running in blindly a lot. If you were fighting a better v-13 player, that would be getting you killed. Have you heard of dash breaking? It's doing a barrier block/faultless defense while running. It's a safer way of approaching the opponent cause you can block instantly from running. It was also in GG. Also doing too many special moves in random situations. They may have worked well enough on that player, but better ones will be punishing you for that stuff. It seems like you aren't paying attention to what your opponent is doing, and are more focused on rushing the hell out of her with no regard to your own safety. Try to think and react rather than guess and pray most the time. You should go in training to get comfortable with Ragna's normals and try improving your combos(the ones in the combo thread)/execution. Ones that end in 22C are almost always preferable as I understand it, cause it sets you up nicely for a reset/mix up. Hope that helps :eng101:

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Ah thank you for the reply! I wasn't expecting so much detail in a response. :yaaay: Yes, that's something I've noticed a lot recently after watching the combo videos. Although I prefer more compact combos (4-6 hit) that do more damage, the initial hit takes a lot longer to connect and is much easier to react to. I realize this is basic of basics in terms of reasoning but it makes a lot of sense as to why people use longer combos to make up for the damage lost when you have to start a combo off with *A or *B. This is true. I assume that by rushing in I'm applying pressure and reducing focus on my opponent's end. It tends to work against my friends in GG but playing online is a whole new game in terms of skill level. I also watched a few Nu matches after reading this and see the difference in ability between that person I faced in the video and higher level Nu players. The person I was fighting wasn't always pushing me outside of my reach, where it seems the basics of Nu should be all about ranged pokes. I rarely faultless defend in GG, mostly cause I hated how it killed off my tension that I'd prefer used for supers. I had completely missed the fact that it's a different bar this time around so it's far more of an option than before. Especially with how different it is to build up supers (can't get any free meter from whiffed moves or dashes). The special moves randomly thrown out are mostly cause I understand that with Ragna, because he has not nearly any of the reach of other characters, he always has to be his opponent's face. Watching the Blu-Ray, it showed that the 214A or 214B as well as 632146D are great ways to close distance. It is punishable though, as I have experienced. I was reading the Nu vs. Ragna thread and instant jump dashing seems to be more viable. Combined with the dash breaking you mentioned, it seems a lot safer. I am definitely not reactive, though it may be the reason why my win % is straddling 40%. Hehe, I think that might be something that just comes with experience and learning what types of moves others can use. Taking a step back to watch myself does make a difference in how I run directly into punishment a lot of times. Back to training mode! :) Thanks for the tips, do you happen to have any videos of yourself? I try to not model my play style after others and learn on my own but if I could visually digest what you're advising me, it'd be a lot more help.

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you missed the part where ragna has a incredibly fast long range poke... 5B, that is safe and a lot of times dash in 5B is faster to come out then Hells Fang. Also the "longer" combos do more damage, significantly more. I think the largest damage amount you can get with out going above 6 hits is probably 2.5K maybe 3.0K (with out the use of tension). Learning the longer chains will net you 3.4K for free easily and more like 4.0K if you land a good setup. These chains also frequently start with 5B and so are safe, and fast to connect with. Long story short saying you prefer compact combos is just like saying "I like to not take advantage of my charecter's ability to output damage" sorry if you wanna play well you'll have to learn to do them

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you missed the part where ragna has a incredibly fast long range poke... 5B, that is safe and a lot of times dash in 5B is faster to come out then Hells Fang.

Also the "longer" combos do more damage, significantly more. I think the largest damage amount you can get with out going above 6 hits is probably 2.5K maybe 3.0K (with out the use of tension). Learning the longer chains will net you 3.4K for free easily and more like 4.0K if you land a good setup. These chains also frequently start with 5B and so are safe, and fast to connect with.

Long story short saying you prefer compact combos is just like saying "I like to not take advantage of my charecter's ability to output damage" sorry if you wanna play well you'll have to learn to do them

Bingo.

I've noticed that canceling in the air has some pretty gracious results as far as long combos that do massive damage go;

Friend of mine who mains Ragna took me down halfway in one combo (I was playing Nu) and he didn't break a sweat... curse that low defense of Nu's!

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Yeah, I'm trying to work on that a little better. Being that pretty much any time the round starts I instantly 214A, I can't seem to time the dash properly to get the first hit when I try to do the dash 5B. It'll come with time. I was playing with practice mode a lot more tonight after reading these posts and although I like ground combos, I guess I never really did many air combos in GG without doing the dust launcher. It's kinda weird to not pop them up with a dedicated button. These are what I could come up with. Air dash, 5C, 5D, 6A, 6D, 6D, 623D, 236C, (wait a little bit) 214C. (8 hits) 6C, high jump towards, air throw, air dash, 5C, 5D, 623D, 236C, (wait a little bit) 214C. (9 hits) These seem kinda flashy but do pretty good damage and are very much out of my normal style, but pretty good. I think they're kinda incomplete though. I can't seem to get the timing right for the 22C after these 2 combos, but I assume with time I'll figure it out. I can't seem to figure out what can come after a 22C or what to do before my 6C in the second combo (instead of just dashing in). I also tried to combine the 2 combos and do a: Air dash, 5C, 5D, 6A, 6D, 6D, air throw... but it almost never connects because of tech, and if it does connect, I seem to be unable to air dash afterwards. Air dash, 5C, 5D, 6A, air throw... always connects to the throw, but still am unable to air dash after to continue it.

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okay, so here is what you should do, go into training mode and just practice this: 6A, Jump Cancel, j5C, j5D, double jump cancel, j5C, j5D, 623 D, 236C, 214C untill you can do it pretty much perfectly every time. Then try: 5B,5C,5D (2 hits), dash cancel, 6A, Jump Cancel, j5C, j5D, double jump cancel, j5C, j5D, 623d, 236c, 214c as far as your questions: after a 22C, if it is early is a combo (under about 6 hits), you can link a 5B,5C, Hell's Fang + follow up if it is late in a combo just dash in afterward and go for a mix up. After a hit 6C, you can either high jump and then do 5c,5d,jc,5c,5d, Inferno Divider.... or you can buffer in a Gauntlet Hades, then do a delayed follow up, land, and d 5B, D inferno divider... any combo with a throw in it, isn't a real combo because it is pretty easy to tech a throw in the middle of a combo, don't count that as a combo. basically what I'm trying to say is, you need to learn to do the first two combos I listed, doing those will develop your skill enough to let you learn the really powerful stuff, and those combos are very good and applicable and very practical bread and butter combos. They arn't flashy or considered very difficult, people bust out stuff that is way more difficult even at an intermediate level. ....basically it takes practice for most of us to do this stuff (I have to grind out combos in training mode for hours before I can do them reliably) So grind those combos and you'll be well on your way to playing better that and don't throw out Hell's fang randomly :-D

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sorry for being a noob

How do you start a combo with air dash ?

Air dash, 5C, 5D, 6A, 6D, 6D, air throw

I can answer this one!

Jump by pressing up on the d pad.

While in mid-air, press the d pad 2 times in the direction of the opponent corresponding to where you are on the screen.

In your quote, you want to do the 5C, 5D part of the combo before hitting the ground. Once landing, you then continue with the 6A, 6D, 6D, air throw portion.

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well the only advice i could give to you with Ragna while playing in a tournament is to keep your cool by that i mean don't screw block strings over by going into hells fang or something like that cuz you got the jitters or something try to do combos

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Well the biggest thing I can give you tips on is what I screw up on. Learn to capitalize on your pokes. Sometimes I'm trying to play a defensive game and I connect with a 5B when I wasn't expecting to do it and don't follow up with a combo. Basically if you can get those free hits in all the time without thinking it will help you out a bunch.

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Wow it seems I found the elitist spelling bee champ. Anyway I have been playing and I am just trying to get down the bnb combos and trying to stay aggresive, trying not to Hell's fang during block strings which is a really bad habit of mine. How should I react to Barrier Blocks?

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make sure to toss out a c at the end of a barrierd block string so it pushes them far away enough to have trouble punishing you. Another big tourny problem i have is the jitters, i usually get those and my entire playstyle gets screwed over, those last thoughts of wondering if you have stuff down well enough can really hurt your ability to play.

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Well I have a thing that when I enter play where people are watching me I go into my muscle memory and shit gets done. I entered Street Fighter 4 tournament when it first came out and I played Abel for a week and I found myself just completely owning til I made it to finals and lost to a Viper player. Anyway aside from that I feel that I still kinda don't understand fully what I am doing in this game. I never really was good at GG and this game is no KOF at all. I am just afraid of just throwing away rounds for stupid mistakes.

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unfortunatley most of us do make stupid mistakes when we enter a tournament for a game we're just startin to get down, its the only way to learn from them and understand the game more. i'd say keep practicin hard, and go in there knowing what you know, and you'll probably come out of it knowing a lot more

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okay, so here is what you should do, go into training mode and just practice this:

6A, Jump Cancel, j5C, j5D, double jump cancel, j5C, j5D, 623 D, 236C, 214C

untill you can do it pretty much perfectly every time. Then try:

5B,5C,5D (2 hits), dash cancel, 6A, Jump Cancel, j5C, j5D, double jump cancel, j5C, j5D, 623d, 236c, 214c

This is some of the best advice i've seen on this forum, I've been doing ok with the ground BnB stuff but air combos are like doing advanced physics or something.

Also this has been a great thread in general and thanks to all the contributors and the OP lots of great tips for another dedicated Ragna Newb. :toot:

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does anyone else have a hard time with the 5b, 5c, 5d (2 hit), dash, 6a.... combo. Whenever I dash forward, Ragna stops dashing automatically after a little bit and I don't get why. Does this happen to anyone else? i know you can follow with the dash real quick and still get the opponent before he stops, but why does he stop and not do his normal really fast forward dash running all you want.

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does anyone else have a hard time with the 5b, 5c, 5d (2 hit), dash, 6a.... combo. Whenever I dash forward, Ragna stops dashing automatically after a little bit and I don't get why. Does this happen to anyone else? i know you can follow with the dash real quick and still get the opponent before he stops, but why does he stop and not do his normal really fast forward dash running all you want.

Yes, when you dash cancel the 5D, it does a short dash, instead of his normal dash that you can hold. At least in my case, the best way to practice this combo is by avoiding to mash the inputs, and just get the timing down.

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Yes, when you dash cancel the 5D, it does a short dash, instead of his normal dash that you can hold. At least in my case, the best way to practice this combo is by avoiding to mash the inputs, and just get the timing down.

thanks, I was just making sure my controller was good. Figured it was a gameplay thing, but wanted to be safe. And after practicing it for a while, I'm able to get the 6a to connect.

i can do a lot of the air combos, but I have a hard time running the 5b, 5c, 5d (2 hit), dash, 6a, j, jc, jd, jc ,JD, inferno divider, 236c, 214c to finish to completion.

Usually my second drive attack in the air misses because my character is too low (I capitalized it in the chain). I just need to practice it more.

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Usually my second drive attack in the air misses because my character is too low (I capitalized it in the chain). I just need to practice it more.

Actually that's just because of how many hits you're doing before the 6A (or something along those lines). If you've done a longer combo before a launch you usually have to settle for j.C, j.D (JC), j.D, ID.

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You can always settle for just 5C > 5D > 66 6A etc. You'll be closer for the 6A and you can get more damage with your air combos. I think you still have to omit the second j.C though.

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You can to a jumpcancel with a "high-jump" (hold down for a moment during the 6A hit and than do a regular jumpcancel, will get you a high jc) if you have a hard time hitting them with the second j.C, the attack doesn't hit cuse the enemy is to high in relation to you (the j.D is kind of an uppercut and does usually hit anyway). Against Rachel/Carl you almost always have to highjump cancel to hit with the (j.C j.D)x2 263D 236C 214C air BnB. This is also usable when starting off a combo with 4B+C, do the throw, 66 6A highjc (j.C j.D)x2 263D 236C 214C for massive (about 3,4k) damage. Oh, just so that there wont be any questions about that, you should jumpcancel the first j.D. From what I've experienced as a Ragna player you really wanna be able to do a highjump cancel from 6A and 5C. And Rachel is a bitch.

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As another player new to Blazblue (played for about a week now) I've found this thread VERY Helpful. It's much appreciated that you guys are taking the time out to help us newbies along. After a lot of deliberation and experimenting with different characters I've decided to 'main' Ragna until I feel like I'm completely comfortable with him and the rest of the general BB game mechanics. The information here and in the other threads have been tons of help. 3x cheers for dustloop =)

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