How are your reflexes

[Graque]

I'm new to the game so sorry if this is obvious.  But I was practicing blocking mixups in training mode and I realized that the random playback feature could be used to quantify my reflexes.

 

For instance, against Ky I set two of the three slots to A below, and one to B:

• A: low, (small pause), low
• B: low -> greed sever

Then I set it to random playback.  I was surprised, but I couldn't block greed sever.  I'm a bad player, but I thought I had blocked greed sever before on reaction.  I guess I had just gotten lucky or used option-select timing.

 

So apparently I can't block Ky's greed sever (19-22F), but I on the other hand I can block his dust (28F).  I can also block Leo's dust (25F), but not his stance overhead (18F).  So apparently my reflexes are between 20 and 25F.

 

I was going to try other moves to try to narrow down the range, but then I realized that I could just change the input lag setting and see how much I could increase it before I couldn't block any more.  It seems for non-dust overheads I need about 23-25F, but for dusts I can react a bit quicker, perhaps closer to 20F, presumably because of the big red marker.

 

Anyway, does this methodology make sense?  Has anyone else tried this?  I think I'm slow, but I'm curious what other people find.  Has anyone spent a lot of time training and improved their reflexes?  (I just tried for about 20 minutes with Greed Sever.)

[Blade]

To me at least, there are two kinds of reflexes:

 

---The kind you think about. (The same kind others WANT you to think about)

---The kind you don't think about. (What you actually do in most neutral situations)

 

I know in the past I've done dumb posts like "reflexes/reaction time are overrated" which people used as a signature, but really... my meaning behind that has to do with the idea that human reaction time isn't as great as we'd like it to be on a regular basis.

 

In a matchup versus a Ky who is a habitual Greed Sever user, a player will eventually "get it in his head" that blocking high is the best thing to do.

 

In a matchup versus a Ky who uses Greed Sever sparingly, you're going to have a harder time getting a read on their mind game, since there are other ways to score that overhead besides GS (j.H or j.S or 5D for example)

 

In a matchup versus a Ky user who "uses GS a lot" but actually STOPS using it, the player can actually "condition" the other player to expect a high and go for a low... these are the hardest players to fight against in my opinion, the types who get inside your head.

 

It gets even worse when you consider other characters like Millia or I-No who are specifically tailored to open up your defenses so that you literally can NOT block their attacks for very long without getting punished for being too defensive.

 

About the only compensation for reflexes (at least in Guilty Gear) that I've seen is Option Selecting, since that allows you to get away with resorting to one input over another, if the situation forces you in to either/or.  Purple and Red Roman Cancels also REALLY helps slow the opponent down!

 

Worse comes to worst, you can always go for Dead Angles and Burst and change the pace of the match.

 

It's better to get used to a matchup and just start expecting certain tactics.

[Graque]

I agree with everything you said.  I think I've read somewhere that the time it takes a human to react to a single is roughly proportional to the log of the number of states which require different processing.  To put it differently, the bigger the surprisal of what your opponent does, the longer it'll take you to react.  So knowing your opponent's tendencies will make your reflexes much quicker.

 

However, surely it's still useful to know what you can respond to "on reaction" and what absolutely requires you to make a read.  For instance, I learned that it's pointless for me to try to block Leo's stance overhead on reaction.  If a Leo is mixing up lows and overheads, I shouldn't beat myself up over not blocking well---instead I should think about how to avoid that situation to begin with, or use other tools (backdash, option selects, dead angle as you mention, whatever).

 

On the other hand, blocking a dust doesn't require a hard read.  If I'm continually getting blown up by Ky's dust, maybe then I do need to just keep a better eye out for dusts, and just practice blocking them.

[TheRealBobMan]

@Graque:  What you're saying is true about reaction time being proportional to the amount of stimuli you have to account for, and you're also true about surprise playing a factor in reaction time.  However, on defense you want to learn to reduce the amount of things you have to account for to improve your ability to react.  While it's easy to exploit, there's a reason people say to "block low and look for the overhead".

 

Leo is actually a good example.  In stance he actually doesn't have very good high/low mixup.  He has crossup options that really help his mixup options, and he's pretty good about frame trapping to keep you blocking, but he has a fast low and 1 fast overhead.  He can't throw you in stance, and his other overhead that staggers on block is so slow that you can still deal with it on reaction without much problem*.  If all you have to watch for is the 18f overhead, it's actually well within your ability to block on reaction every time since you can simply block low until you see the single overhead start.

 

 

*It becomes a problem when Leo has meter.  He can YRC before the hit in order to block, to prevent you from using reaction BS or reaction Gold Burst, which are really easy to get away with.  Besides that, it's easy to block the stomp on reaction and it's only +3 for him if you mash out at max speed so you're fine. However, if he has meter to RC it's now a combo starter even on block so you have to get out of the way or hit him.  Reaction BS works, but if he has the meter he can bait with YRC.

[Blade]

"Blocking Low and waiting for an overhead" only works when players AREN'T constantly IADing in your face and doing crazy unblockables/crossup unblockables, mashing normals, or tech traps OR baiting bursts.  Ugh the disrespect is palpable!  Some days the safest thing to do is to avoid attacks altogether, airdash away, or not tech at all!

 

If you think you get blown up during Ky's standing Dust... just wait until he YRC's it! Ugh.

 

Just the other day I was fighting an especially annoying player who knew all the right ways to open up my defense, so I was always one step behind his mixups and the minute I caught wind of what he was doing, he'd do something else...

 

My only answer to beating him came from becoming more aggressive then he was being and shut down his options instead of thinking defensively so much.

[Circuitous]

Graque, I appreciate your willingness to start a new topic and all, but we really don't need to open the reaction times can of worms again.