On reversal wakeup backdash

[Reki]

As someone that has been playing FGs for more than a decade, I realized how much I underestimated backdashing. I also learned only recently that reversal DP and blitz can 100% work against meaty attacks and projectiles. Though I can deal with DPs and blitz because safe jump or blitzback or bait with potemkin. But then I realized just last night from the wiki that backdashes have a 1f startup AND they can be used like a reversal wakeup to fuck up my meaties.

As I'm writing this, I suddenly remember getting repeatedly bodied by a friend using dizzy in reload / slash that likes to backdash on wakeup every time.

So what's the standard procedure to hardcounter this with pot? I remember in SF, people would option select low hard kicks while jumping in to cover backdashes (so backdashes work the same in sf, too?). I practiced a bit with OS 2D then I realized that it doesn't work on all characters so I'm assuming that you have to learn OSs against all characters? Also, how do people hard counter it from a safe jump?

[TheRealBobMan]

There are a couple of ways.  Most characters can mash 5P/2P and it'll work out, but it's not the greatest idea against someone with a good backdash like Pot.  In a situation like that most characters also have the option of feinting the safe jump into low and instead doing a low airdash into overhead (which can let you also catch the backdash).  Another option is to use a move with a lot of active frames.  Pot can probably use 6K and 6H for this, though 6H was probably a better option in older games (Slidehead trap on block, murder on CH if they were mashing 2P thinking you'd throw, still really hurt on regular hit).  Trishula is really active, though you probably have better options.

 

You can also just wait on oki (from a throw-safe range).  Buffer a Potemkin Buster and then sit there.

 

Did they DP/Super?  Block > punish.

Did they backdash?  PB the recovery.

Did they BS?  PB the recovery.

Did they push a button?  PB.

Did they jump?  Heat Knuckle / 2H / HPB / Airthrow

Did they wakeup Gold Burst?  Airthrow

 

Pot's 2P is active for 4 frames, and recovers for 6.  If you did 2P > PB as a tick throw setup, and they happened to backdash the 2P, you're still going to tag most characters without even having to react, just based on the average backdash invul duration.  On that note, 2P > 6H is a good trap to try to catch people backdashing your PB, assuming you also condition with 2P > Heat Knuckle to encourage them not to jump.

 

Megafist is also active for a really long time, and since you can use the forward version you can catch backdashes that aren't in the corner pretty easily too.  I think Pot gets to combo off of CH Megafist even if they don't backdash?

[Destin]

Backdashes are usually air state in recovery, so if you can throw out a late 5p or S to take them to the air for a heat extend, that's probably the best bet.

 

But you are playing pot, do not fear the reversal backdash, embrace your destiny.  Pot's is easily the best in the game!

[Reki]

Thanks, guys. I was able to lab last night and yeah, an OS 2P snags people off the air. OS potbust also worked on elphelt but the timing is probably character specific. I'm documenting everything I did last night and I'll all more characters then I'll post it on the pot forums.
 

[Blade]

Can someone maybe explain how someone like Bedman can deal with Potemkin's backdash+buster?

[Destin]

OS deva B?

[Nyaa]

Pot is only (only!) invulnerable for 20 of the 21 frames the backdash is active, so any attack that's active when his backdash ends will hit him cleanly.

[LockedAndClush]

I don't know how far is it just my opponent's Potemkin being bad, but with most characters I just stay right out of Pot's throw range on wakeup and if he backdashes, rush him down with rapid 2P's or other whiff-cancelable normal. If you time it right, you have 3 frames to hit him in if he tries Buster (1 after backdash invul ends, two for Buster startup). I don't know if it will work with Bedman, also I never experimented much with what options Pot has if he, for example, IB's the 2P, but it worked for me against one or two Potemkin players.

Also, it might be throwable if you get unlucky and happen to not have your hitbox out on the last frame of the backdash. I should experiment with this a little bit.

[ChaseRLewis]

As someone that has been playing FGs for more than a decade, I realized how much I underestimated backdashing. I also learned only recently that reversal DP and blitz can 100% work against meaty attacks and projectiles. Though I can deal with DPs and blitz because safe jump or blitzback or bait with potemkin. But then I realized just last night from the wiki that backdashes have a 1f startup AND they can be used like a reversal wakeup to fuck up my meaties.

As I'm writing this, I suddenly remember getting repeatedly bodied by a friend using dizzy in reload / slash that likes to backdash on wakeup every time.

So what's the standard procedure to hardcounter this with pot? I remember in SF, people would option select low hard kicks while jumping in to cover backdashes (so backdashes work the same in sf, too?). I practiced a bit with OS 2D then I realized that it doesn't work on all characters so I'm assuming that you have to learn OSs against all characters? Also, how do people hard counter it from a safe jump?

 

Hm a hard read for Pot is 6HS you see FAB do this occassionally to try to make them stay in place and he'll go into AEGIS with followup sometimes if it hits. If Pot got a decent combo before that is very likely stun and death off 1 hard read. However, because of Pots poor knockdowns except 2D you won't always get this very meaty so it can lose to other things, but the moment you get your opponent afraid of 6HS and not spamming backdash you gain a lot of scary options for them and the mind games really get interesting.

[Reki]

Hm a hard read for Pot is 6HS you see FAB do this occassionally

I'm having difficulty understanding FAB's main choice of 6H against backdashes. I played around with it and I realized that it never connects because it's so telegraphed. You can just block after the backdash. Comparing this to an OS 2P to pick up airborne opponents or that guaranteed OS pot bust if you get the timing down is pretty odd. But then again he's FAB, what do?

[Destin]

You throw the 6h out early.