Kyle Report post Posted November 20, 2009 Throws http://www.youtube.com/user/LaetabilisCantata#p/u/1/iOE9x0u83co Fatal CounterHits http://www.youtube.com/user/LaetabilisCantata#p/u/2/fGlrNSNmD4g Solo Carl: 6A, SJ.C, J.2C, J.C, Jump Cancel, J.C, J.2C, Allegreto = 2688DMG CH 6A, IAD, J.2C, Alle~can, SJ.B, J.C Jump Cancel, J.C, J.2C, Allegreto = 2617DMG CORNER ONLY: CH 6A, IAD, J.2C, Alle~can, J.2C, Alle~can, SJ.C, J.2C, J.C, Jump Cancel, J.B, Allegreto = 2724DMG CORNER ONLY: CH 6A, IAD, J.2C, Alle~can, 5C, SJ.C, J.2C, J.C, Jump Cancel, J.C, Allegreto = 2855DMG FCH J.B, 66, J.2C, Alle~can, J.2C, Alle~can, SJ.B, J.C, J.B, Jump Cancel, J.B, Allegreto = 3492DMG FCH J.B, 66, 5C, SJ.C, J.2C, J.C, Jump Cancel, J.C, J.2C, Allegreto = 3625DMG AirDash, J.B, J.C, 5B,2B, 3C, IAD, J.2C, Alle~can, 5C, SJ.C, J.2C, J.C, Jump Cancel, J.B, Allegreto = 3616DMG AirDash, J.B, J.C, 5B, 2B, 6B, Cantible, RC, J.2C, J.B, J.C, 5B, 2B, 3C, IAD, J.2C, Alle~can, 6A, SJ.B = 3312DMG So, Solo Carl should only spend tension when baiting burst While opponent is in FC, Carl can still do 2C, A-Vivace, 2C. 5B (BLOCKED), 632146C, RC, 66, 6C(CHARGE), 22]D[, 6C (UB), 5B, 2B, 3C, J.2C, Alle~can, 2]D[, 5C, J.C, 8]D[ (2HIts), 5C, J.B, Allegreto, 8]D[, IAD, J.2C, J.B, 2]B[ (Gains 50% Heat), 5C, 632146C, 8]D[ (During super flash). The 5C, 632146C does not combo, but this particular set-up gives DMG off off every action the opponent does, with a very few exceptions. (Haku can forward tech & counter the 8]D[, Rachel can forward tech & 8-wind)... The 2]D[ loop The timing will only be reliable for de/reactivate after an 8D. 2D loop set ups include, but aren't limited to: 2A > 2B > 3C > IAD Allecan > 5C > j.B > 8D whatever > 5B > 2B > 2D release > 6B > RC > 5B > 2D hit Allecan > 5B > 5C > 6D > j.C > 2B > 3C > j.2C Allecan > 2D 6A > sj.B > Allegretto > 8D blocked sandwich pressure > vivace A > 4D hit > vivace A > forward dash > opponent crosses over > 5B > sj.B > Allegretto > 8D CON throw > 2D > j.2C Allecan (more to be included, I'm at work, and trying to do this off the top of my head. Kyle, add more if you can.) off of any 8D set up, you're going to IAD j.2C+2D release at about Nirvana's chest level. You can let her deactivate after the 8D and reactivate during IAD. In most cases, you're going to get two reps with j.C and one with j.B. After j.2C 2D release, it's j.C 2D, don't mash this out. Something about this can make nothing come out at all, plus it's smart to know timings for your inputs anyway. You may think you'll have more of a chance to get the right input, but this has caused more problems for me than good. Learn the timing. Once 2D hits, you're either going to be on the same side as when you started, or your opponent will have bounced over you, no matter. Same side: Backdash, repeat. Setup > j.2C 8D > backdash > 9j.2C 2D release > j.C 2D hit > backdash > 9j.2C 2D release > j.B 2D hit... If your opponent bounces over you, it's because your jC 2D hit a little high, but this isn't a problem. I would say backdash, and then keep walking. Yes, just hold 4 and D. If they did bounce behind you, you will backdash and walk back to your original side and continue normally. If you don't walk nirvana with you though, the backdash and walk back will have put you out of range for the next 2D to hit, so when re adjusting that set up, remember: you're basically moving the whole set up a little bit further back. This included your opponents higher bounce back, you walking back, and nirvana walking with you. All three must be positioned correctly for you to continue/pick up your combo. After backdash, just hold 4D, like I said. You'll be moving the set up closer again. Use 9jump and j.1C release 1D for this rep. Yes, 1D. This moves nirvana SLIGHTLY during your j.1C animation, and makes sure that she's in range if you're not sure she walked far enough. This is only a slight movement for her, but helps for added security. We don't want our opponent to tech here, ever. follow up > j.2C Allegretto > 8D for this is the same, but you want to hit the j.2C a little higher than before, preferably moving nirvana a little closer, as well, with the use of 7jump or 7D input. This is for two hit 8D ender. I usually see it done/get it to work myself by not backdashing for the ender. It helps to stay almost directly under the opponent, then 7j.2C[D] > 214C7]D[. This will hopefully get them to hit the back of 8D, and bounce once more onto the outer shockwave (2nd hit.) It is safe to de/reactivate nirvana here, and the timing of that is completely up to you. I usually see reactivation done right before the jump, or during the j.2C, but this is player preference. I'll post the whole loop, complete with 3 reps, off of a 2A. This will be the most you can get from 2A, so you're not going to have the option of volante or 4D loops. (I say this, because I fear multiple 2D loops off of moves that prorate well will soon become obsolete, and will be replaced with 8D, Volante, and 4D reps, for optimum damage.) Since you can't get those reps off of 2A, here is the optimum 2A starter version. I'll try and make the notation as detailed as possible. 2A > 2B > 3C > 22D > IAD j.2C Allecan > j.B > j.C > 8D & Deactivate > [D] j.2C + 2]D[ > j.C > 2D hit (adjust spacing if needed)> j.2C+2D Release > j.C > 2D hit (adjust spacing if needed)> j.2C+2D Release > j.B > 2D Hit (readjust spacing, stay almost under opponent this time) (Deactivate) > 7j.2C (slightly higher) > j.2C[D] (Nivana reactivation) > 214C7]D[. A few more details to add onto Kyle/Zong's break down. -8]D[ & 2]D[ both have (2) different hit effects. 2]D[ hits grounded(opponent too close to the floor) opponent, they launch pretty high 2]D[ hits aerial opponent, they launch MASSIVELY high 8]D[ hits twice simultaneously, no launch, the opponent just falls to the floor 8]D[ hits stagger, launch much higher In order to do the 2]D[ loops combos, you must get the aerial 2]D[ launch & the 8]D[ staggered hits or release 8]D[ much sooner such that the opponent hits the projectile meaty. The appropriate starters really depend on the spacing of Nirvana/opponent. Here's what I find successful: SUMMON COMBO...2B, 3C, 22]D[, IAD, J.2C, Alle~can, J.B, J.C, 8]D[ (staggered hits), deactivate, reactivate, J.2C... OPPONENT FAR AWAY NO SUMMON...6A, SJ.B, Allegreto, 8]D[ (Staggered), IAD, J.2C, J.C, 2]D[... SUMMON COMBO, NIRVANA MUST CONTINUOUSLY WALK BACKWARDS...2B, 3C, 22]D[, IAD, J.2C, Alle~can, J.B, Allegreto, 8]D[ (Hits staggered), deactivate, IAD, Reactivate, J.2C, J.C, 2]D[... Lastly, for the actual inputs. -J.2C is input BEFORE 2]D[ is input -Listen for a rhythm. 1,2,3,wait, 4 7-jump, J.1C, 1]D[, wait, [C] Character specific grounded BnB's While striving to preserve Nirvana's health, limit my opponent defensive options and keep them grounded, I have come up with these BnB. Wether you choose to use 6C or cantible RC to force them standing is up to the player. Here's a break down of character classes too. FatAss: Tager, Ada BigAss: Haku-men, Hazama, Jin, Litchi, Noel, Lambda#11, Mu#12 Weird & fun: Arakune, Ragna, Tao Shitty: Bang, Carl, Makoto, Rachel, Tsubaki Carl vs Arakune: Standing: 5B, 6B, SSJ.2C, Alle~can... Crouching: 5B, 6B, J.2C, Alle~can... Carl vs Ada: Standing: J.B, J.C, J.B (toward or backwards) Carl vs Bang: Standing: 5B, 5C, 6]D[, J.2C, J.B, J.C... Crouching: 5B, 6B, J.2C, Alle~can... Carl vs Carl: Standing: 5B, 5C, 6]D[, J.2C, J.B, J.C... Crouching: 5B, 6B, J.2C, Alle~can... Carl vs Haku-men: Standing: 5B, 6B, J.B, J.C, J.B, 5B, 6B, J.B, J.C, J.B... Crouching: 5B, 6B, J.2C, Alle~can... Carl vs Hazama: Standing: 5B, 6B, J.B, J.C, J.B, 5B, 6B, J.B, J.C, J.B... Crouching: 5B, 6B, J.2C, Alle~can... Carl vs Jin: Standing: 5B, 6B, J.B, J.C, J.B, 5B, 6B, J.B, J.C, J.B... Crouching: 5B, 6B, J.2C, Alle~can... Carl vs Litchi: Standing: 5B, 6B, J.B, J.C, J.B, 5B, 6B, J.B, J.C, J.B... Crouching: 5B, 6B, J.2C, Alle~can... Carl vs Makoto: Standing: 5B, 5C, 6]D[, J.2C, J.B, J.C... Crouching: 5B, 6B, J.2C, Alle~can... Carl vs Noel: Standing: 5B, 6B, J.B, J.C, J.B, 5B, 6B, J.B, J.C, J.B... Crouching: 5B, 6B, J.2C, Alle~can... Carl vs Rachel: Standing: 5B, 5C, 6]D[, J.2C, J.B, J.C... Crouching: 5B, 6B, J.2C, Alle~can... Carl vs Ragna: Standing: 5B, 6B, SSj.2C, Alle~can Crouching: 5B, 6B, J.2C, Alle~can... Carl vs Tager: Standing: 5B, 6B, J.2C, J.B, J.C, JumpCancel, J.2C, J.B, J.C, 5B... Standing: Airdash, J.A, J.A, J.A, J.2C, J.A, J.A, J.2C, J.A, J.A, J.2C, Alle~can, 5B Crouching: 5B, 6B, J.2C, Alle~can... Carl vs Taokaka: Standing: 5B, 6B, J.A, J.2C, Alle~can, 2B, 6B, J.A, J.2C, Alle~can... Crouching: 5B, 6B, J.2C, Alle~can... Carl vs Tsubaki: Standing: 5B, 5C, 6]D[, J.2C, J.B, J.C... Crouching: 5B, 6B, J.2C, Alle~can... Carl vs Lambda#11: Standing: 5B, 6B, J.B, J.C, J.B, 5B, 6B, J.B, J.C, J.B... Crouching: 5B, 6B, J.2C, Alle~can... Carl vs Mu#12: Standing: 5B, 6B, J.B, J.C, J.B, 5B, 6B, J.B, J.C, J.B... Crouching: 5B, 6B, J.2C, Alle~can... Ideally, every combo will end in 5B followed by some sort of mix-up. I prefer to use the first (4) options as they continuously leave my opponent in a grounded hitstun. 5B, IAD, J.2C, Alle~can, 5B, 6B, 6]D[. A-Vivace, 5B... 5B, 5C, 63214]D[, Break low/overhead stuff 5B, 5C, 3]D[, Late Air dash, J.B, J.C, 5B 5B, 5C, 6]D[, Late airdash, J.A, J.A, J.A, J2.C, J.B, 3]D[, 5B... 5B, 6B, A-Vivace, 4]D[, A-Vivace, 66, 5B, J.B, Allegreto, 8]D[, IAD, J.2C, J.C, 2]D[... 5B, 6B, 8]D[ (to punish opponent jumps & backdashes) etc. A mix-up I was trying desperately to implement was 5B, 5C, ConAnima, A-Vivace, BREAK, J.B, J.C, J.B. This is a fuzzy guard against:Carl, Ragna, Tager, Haku-men, Hazama, Jin, Litchi, Noel, Lambda#11, Mu#12. This does not work unless the opponent dedicates them self to guard low. Low blocking after ConAnima BREAK does force standing and can be used as a fuzzy, BUT, the opponent can jump/attack/stand block without additional recovery. In MOST CASES the opponent will be mashing them buttons. =( FROM ZOOGS Okay guys here we are. One of the reasons there hasn't been a consolidate list of Carl + Nirvana combos is because he has way too many options and freedoms in his combos (especially when we're talking about his juggle combos). There really are no BnB's when it comes to Carl unless we're talking about solo combos. Another reason is because his combos are so darn obnoxious to type out and describe the many nuances you have to do to make them work. Any juggle combo you see either in a video or typed out in any post in the Carl threads are merely one's own preference for that particular situation. Look at any of the awesome Carls in AutonomousR's Youtube Channel and you'll see that they don't all do the same combos. You may see the same moves but the order may vary as well. So when I post these combos and you practice them you may find a variant that is easier, or does more damage, or both. That's fine. There are so many nuances to understand about how the combo system works. Basically I and other Carl players figure these things out by practicing these combos. Only then you'll understand how I developed (or copied) these combos and you'll eventually find yourself making up your own combos from various scenerios. [D] means you're holding down Drive ]D[ means you're releasing the Drive button. If you see his symbol consecutively then assume that you should be holding down the Drive button by the time you reach the next ]D[. N-Nirvana's position O-The opponent's position C-Carl's position ex: CON means the opponent is sandwiched between Carl and Nirvana. ---Teleport combos--- (Nirvana can be anywhere) 2A 2A-2B-3C- 22]D[- IAD- j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C 8]D[- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C (you actually wanna let go of the D before you press C) - After you input the 22D you and nirvana should be on opposite sides of the opponent A vid showing more damaging options (they're harder): http://www.youtube.com/user/LaetabilisCantata#p/u/3/EEiJTulK_Zw 2B 2B- 3C - 22]D[ - IAD - j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C - 8]D[- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 5C- 421]D[- j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C - 8]D[-j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ 2B- 3C - 22]D[ - IAD - j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C - 8]D[- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 4]D[ - 5C- *4D hits*- dash away from nirvana- 5C/5B when the opponent falls b/w you and Nirvana- j.B- j.214C - 8]D[- IAD- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ 3C 3C - 22]D[- IAD - j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C - 8]D[- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 5C- 421]D[- j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C - 8]D[-j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ 3C - 22]D[- IAD - j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C - 8]D[- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 4]D[ - 5C- *4D hits*- dash away from nirvana- 5C/5B when the opponent falls b/w you and Nirvana- j.B- j.214C - 8]D[- IAD- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ Hard but practical 3C - 22]D[- IAD - j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C - 8]D[- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 5C- 421]D[- j.2C allecan- 4]D[ - 5C - j.B - *4D hits*- dash away from nirvana- 5C/5B when the opponent falls b/w you and Nirvana- j.B- j.214C - 8]D[- IAD- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ More ideas (works on all characters): http://www.youtube.com/user/LaetabilisCantata#p/u/5/dbzdA6cFiks Cantible (623C) 5B - 6B - 623C - 22]D[ - 5B - sj.B - j.C - 623]D[ - j.C- j.214C (on some characters you can do a j.2C after the second j.C before doing a j.214C) Forward throw 5B+C- 22D- IAD- j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C- 8]D[- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 5C- 421]D[- j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C - 8]D[-j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ 5B+C- 22D- IAD- j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C- 8]D[- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 4]D[ - 5C- *4D hits*- dash away from nirvana- 5C/5B when the opponent falls b/w you and Nirvana- j.B- j.214C - 8]D[- IAD- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ other combos (harder but worth the damage): http://www.youtube.com/user/LaetabilisCantata#p/u/0/kuMrBVpFcqg http://www.youtube.com/user/LaetabilisCantata#p/u/8/iOE9x0u83co Back throw 4B+C- 22]D[- vivace A- 5C/5B- j.B - j.C - 8]D[ - j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 5C- 421]D[- j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C - 8]D[-j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ 4B+C- 22]D[ - vivace A- 5C/5B- j.B - j.C - 8]D[ - j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 4]D[ - 5C- *4D hits*- dash away from nirvana- 5C/5B when the opponent falls b/w you and Nirvana- j.B- j.214C - 8]D[- IAD- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ More Ideas: http://www.youtube.com/user/LaetabilisCantata#p/u/8/iOE9x0u83co Airthrow j.B+C- 22]D[- 5C - sj.B- j.C - 623]D[ - j.C/j.2C - 214C Low to the ground j.B+C - 22]D[ - 66 (the opponent should now be b/w you and Nirvana)-5B - j.B - j.C -8]D[- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 5C- 421]D[- j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C - 8]D[-j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ j.B+C - 22]D[ - 66 (the opponent should now be b/w you and Nirvana)-5B - j.B - j.C -8]D[- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 4]D[ - 5C- *4D hits*- dash away from nirvana- 5C/5B when the opponent falls b/w you and Nirvana- j.B- j.214C - 8]D[- IAD- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ More ideas: http://www.youtube.com/user/LaetabilisCantata#p/u/1/MWWW2vKPT-Q http://www.youtube.com/user/LaetabilisCantata#p/u/8/iOE9x0u83co ---CON--- 2A 2A- 2B - 3C - (j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*)x2 - *- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C 2B 2B - 3C- j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C- 8]D[- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 5C- 421]D[- j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C - 8]D[-j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ 2B - 3C - j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C - 8]D[- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 4]D[ - 5C- *4D hits*- dash away from nirvana- 5C/5B when the opponent falls b/w you and Nirvana- j.B- j.214C - 8]D[- IAD- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ 2B- 3C- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 5C- 421]D[- j.2C allecan- 4]D[ - 5C - j.B - *4D hits*- dash away from nirvana- 5C/5B when the opponent falls b/w you and Nirvana- j.B- j.214C - 8]D[- IAD- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ 4D Have Nirvana do 4D. Right before you the first hit of her 4D hits the opponent A vivace behind the opponent to cross them up. Then A vivace back to your original position. After this dash away from Nirvana then do- 5C/5B - j.B - j.214C- 8]D[ - IAD - j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 5C - 421]D[ - j.2C allecan - j.B - j.C - 8]D[ - j.2C+]D[- j.B- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ 8D 8]D[ - j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 5C- 421]D[- j.2C allecan- 4]D[ - 5C - j.B - *4D hits*- dash away from nirvana- 5C/5B when the opponent falls b/w you and Nirvana- j.B- j.214C - 8]D[- IAD- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ Unblockable hits Perform a ground combo or blockstring that leads into a setup where Nirvana hits the opponent with 2D and Carl hits the opponent low with either 2B, 6B, or 3C. If you were initially doing a ground combo time it so that unblockable setup does not combo from the previous ground combo. Also make sure that the 2D hits last 2B/6B/3C - 2D - j.2C allecan - 5C - 421]D[ - j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C - 8]D[-j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ 2B/6B/3C - 2D - j.2C allecan - 5C- 421]D[- j.2C allecan- 4]D[ - 5C - j.B - *4D hits*- dash away from nirvana- 5C/5B when the opponent falls b/w you and Nirvana- j.B- j.214C - 8]D[- IAD- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ Forward Throw 5B+C - 2]D[ - j.2C allecan - *2D hits* - j.2C allecan - 5C- 421]D[- j.2C allecan- 4]D[ - 5C - j.B - *4D hits*- dash away from nirvana- 5C/5B when the opponent falls b/w you and Nirvana- j.B- j.214C - 8]D[- IAD- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ 5B+C - j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- 5C- 421]D[- j.2C allecan- 4]D[ - 5C - j.B - *4D hits*- dash away from nirvana- 5C/5B when the opponent falls b/w you and Nirvana- j.B- j.214C - 8]D[- IAD- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ Airthrow j.B+C - 2]D[ - 5C - *2D hits* - 5C- 421]D[- j.2C allecan- 4]D[ - 5C - j.B - *4D hits*- dash away from nirvana- 5C/5B when the opponent falls b/w you and Nirvana- j.B- j.214C - 8]D[- IAD- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ ---NCO--- These combos assume that Nirvana is really close behind Carl. In some situations while you are doing Carl’s part of the combo you’ll need to walk Nirvana forward some: Cantible (623C) 5B- 6B - 623C (walk Nirvana forward if needed) - 2]D[ - 5B - *2D hits*- Vivace B - 5C- 421]D[- j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C - 8]D[-j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ Airthrow j.B+C - 2]D[ - 5C - Vivace A/B - 5C- 421]D[- j.2C allecan- j.B- j.C - 8]D[-j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ j.B+C - 2]D[ - 5C - Vivace A/B - 5C- 421]D[- j.2C allecan- 4]D[ - 5C - j.B - *4D hits*- dash away from nirvana- 5C/5B when the opponent falls b/w you and Nirvana- j.B- j.214C - 8]D[- IAD- j.2C+]D[- j.C- *2D hits*- j.2C+[D]- 2147]D[+C- fermata 214214]D[ Other ideas: For more airthrow combos as wells as the front and back throw you can use the same combos from the teleport section. You just don’t have to do 22D. =) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TheSlyMoogle Report post Posted November 28, 2009 Anyone come up with an air-throw follow up? Just thinking out loud here: JB+C, 22]D[, Land, 2C, 623]D[, 236A, SuperJump, J.B, J.214C, 8]D[, Land, 66, 2C, 8]D[. KD maybe JB+C, 22]D[, Land, J.2C, Alle~can, 623]D[, 236A, SuperJump, J.B, J.214C, 8]D[, Land, 66, 2C, 8]D[. KD maybe JB+C, 22]D[, Land, J.2C, Alle~can, 5C, 4]D[, 236A,... -Overlord Kyle- Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeero Report post Posted November 29, 2009 Carl: Move：DMG：Starter：Combo 5A：160：80％：82％ 5B：430：90％：89％ 5C：620：100％：92％ ２A：130：70％：82％ ２B：390：70％：89％ ２C：600：90％：80％ JA：150：80％：84％ JB：510：100％：89％ JC：660：90％：89％ J2C：700：85％：92％ ６A：480：100％：70％ ６B ：580：90％：89％ ６C：550：90％：90％ ６C(full charge)：1100：90％：90％ ３C：590：100％：85％ throw：960：100％：70％ back throw：840：100％：70％ air throw：940：100％：70％ cantabile(1)：0：100％：84％ Cantabile(2)：100：--％：100％ contata(20 hits)：2309：87％：41％ ６D：960：90％：85％ ２D：720：90％：104％ ８D(hand)：720：85％：85％ ８D(wave)：560：104％：78％ volante：560：90％：89％ anima：1500：90％：80％ generaru：3000：60％：90％ gold burst：0：80％：80％ ４D：320＋780：90％ ：90％ ３D：200×4：90％：95％ burio(1)：310：90％：95％ burio(2)：800：--：-- allegreto(6 hits)：1449 Just noticed something... comparing this to the original damage charts we have here... http://s1.zetaboards.com/blazblue/pages/carl_data/ Theres actually no buff to anything except 4D... and a nerf to j2c starting proration... So Carl's damage buff came from a nerf of everyone else? XD edit: Side note of what seems to break guard primer that I've seen so far 41236D 4D (1st hit) 2D Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Umareru Report post Posted December 1, 2009 Nee-san's punch super also breaks a guard primer or two. I read somewhere it breaks two, but i haven't actually seen it myself because every time i start the punch super it breaks one, but by the end they ain't blocking I like firing Volante, then walking forward with Nee-san leading the charge. Very safe way to close the gap. Just beware sledge. Anyway, I was playing around with the sandwich loop yesterday against various characters and I would like to share some lessons I learnt. I found that when fighting tager, he can 360 you if he instant blocks in your sandwich pressure string, and he can even 720 you in the middle of nirvana's punch rush. What I did to counter him was pretty simple, once he started blocking in the [2a,5a,5b,5b 6D] loop i would jump straight up after 6D and do a jC. It crosses up, dodges all potential grabs. Just Vivace back around to resume the sandwich loop. To stay safe from 720s in Nee-san's punch super, dont vivace to cross up, use IAD j2C Alle~can. Also, the [2a,5a,5b,5b, 6D] sandwich loop DOES NOT HIT LITCHI ON BLOCK. 5a completely whiffs for some reason, she can just jump out. I have no idea how to do pressure strings on litchi like this, i think i'll have to do [5b, 5c, 6D, jC] instead. Its the more damaging loop, but the one with less mixup. Darn. I don't even understand why it whiffs. Does she have a shorter crouch than everyone? Even Carl Clover himself?! I'll share more findings here. Assuming I find anything. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kyle Report post Posted December 1, 2009 (LITCHI)...Does she have a shorter crouch than everyone? Even Carl Clover himself?! Yes, This is a pain in the ass. But try to use this to your advantage. Combo J2C, alle~can, 2B, 5C, 6D, JC, 2B, 5C, 6D, JC, 2A, 5A... Whiff : J.A spam to keep her in block stun long enough to 8]D[. : Cantata To bait for counter pokes. This super really is a great "TRADE". : 2A/2B for a quick low : Bait her DP. IB that crap & punish : j.2C, Alle~can to beat lots of her counter pokes. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kyle Report post Posted December 1, 2009 Brio often hits once with greater hit-stun. It appears the second hit-box is much closer to her hands. Now that 5B, 2B, 5C/6B combo's on hit, Why the hell is everyone doign combo's with 2A, 5A, 2A, ... :psyduck: @2:18- Did Jin bounce off the wall or bounce off Nirvana? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9zmc0c44Zbw Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dasvanu Report post Posted December 2, 2009 Does 2C still have enough untechable time to delay an 8D so that both parts of the clap hit, for a full 2-3 reps? That would do quite a bit of damage (around 4-5k), wouldn't it. It'd be a hefty damage reward after sandwich mixups. Or is 2C techable before that can happen? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zoogstin Report post Posted December 3, 2009 I think I've seen vids of Carl players delaying the 8D so I would say yes. But probably only if the the loop was started really early in the combo, like.... before 5 hits. I could be exaggerating. Can anybody who's been playing CS carl confirm this? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Umareru Report post Posted December 4, 2009 You can still do the clap loop (not the throw loop). I wouldn't say the damage goes up to 4 or 5k, though If you 3C them late into a combo (say, 6th hit), they can tech before you can launch them in the air. So if you cant do like, 9 hits in a sandwich loop and then slide them and continue a clap loop. Now you can finish the clap loop with a Volante that hits them as they are coming down. It forces them to tech in the air between you and Nirvana for more sandwiching. I wish I could say more, but the way people are playing at my local arcades makes it impossible for me to get any training done. They come real early and leave real late, out for blood the entire day. Lol. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kyle Report post Posted December 4, 2009 Does anyone know the MINIMUM DMG Carl's Distortion Drives do in CS? Fermata- Population of China- 800 In CS Supers have a minimum DMG that exceeds proration values. So regardless of how many hits we have into a combo we can always do supers for sweet looking DMG. Big question is which does MORE Damage? Our options would be: ...3C, 632146C, 2]D[, 632146C OR ...3C, 214214D, 632146C MOVE-DMG-STARTER-COMBO 2D：720：90％：104％ Contata(20 hits)：2309：87％：41％ Generaru：3000：60％：90％ Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kyle Report post Posted December 4, 2009 Carl: Move：DMG：Starter：Combo 5A：160：80％：82％ 5B：430：90％：89％ 5C：620：100％：92％ ２A：130：70％：82％ ２B：390：70％：89％ ２C：600：90％：80％ JA：150：80％：84％ JB：510：100％：89％ JC：660：90％：89％ J2C：700：85％：92％ ６A：480：100％：70％ ６B ：580：90％：89％ ６C：550：90％：90％ ６C(full charge)：1100：90％：90％ ３C：590：100％：85％ throw：960：100％：70％ back throw：840：100％：70％ air throw：940：100％：70％ cantabile(1)：0：100％：84％ Cantabile(2)：100：--％：100％ contata(20 hits)：2309：87％：41％ ６D：960：90％：85％ ２D：720：90％：104％ ８D(hand)：720：85％：85％ ８D(wave)：560：104％：78％ volante：560：90％：89％ anima：1500：90％：80％ generaru：3000：60％：90％ gold burst：0：80％：80％ ４D：320＋780：90％ ：90％ ３D：200×4：90％：95％ burio(1)：310：90％：95％ burio(2)：800：--：-- allegreto(6 hits)：1449 Optimal Starters: 8]D[, (second Hit) = 104% 5C, J.B, 6C, B+C, J.B+C, Cantible= 100% Optimal Hits: 2]D[= 104% Cantible (Second Hit) = 100% 5C, J.2C, Brio (First Hit) = 92% Optimal Finishers: 632146C = Minimum DMG ??? 214214D = Minimum DMG ??? J.B+C = Minimum DMG 960 We should find a way to combo into the second hit of cantible... Like what if it activates on a projectile and the follow up hits only? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
4Corners Report post Posted December 4, 2009 You guys know you can hit with a strong clap without delaying it, right? I dunno if it holds for CS, but in CT I actually used to do a fast version of the clap loop that hit with both claps before I found out about the delay to do it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kyle Report post Posted December 4, 2009 In theory an optimal combo would be: Tech Trap: 8]D[ (Second Hit Only), J.2C, Alle~can, 2]D[, J.2C, Alle~can, J.2C, Alle~can, 5C, 2]D[, 632146C, 8]D[, 632146C, 2]D[ DMG: 8]D[ (Second Hit Only) = 560 DMG W/ 104% starter proration J.2C = 728 DMG W/ 92% combo proration (96%) 2]D[ = 720 DMG W/ 104% combo proration (100%) J.2C = 644 DMG W/ 92% combo proration (92%) J.2C = 602 DMG W/ 92% combo proration (86%) 5C = 483 DMG W/ 92% combo proration (78%) 2]D[ = 590 W/ 104% combo proration (82%) 632146C = 800 DMG W/ 41% combo proration (82%) 2]D[ = 0 DMG W/ 104% combo proration (41%) 632146C= 800 DMG W/ 41% combo proration (47%) 4]D[ = 0 DMG with a good knockdown. Total DMG is 5127 This should be tested. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeero Report post Posted December 4, 2009 You guys know you can hit with a strong clap without delaying it, right? I dunno if it holds for CS, but in CT I actually used to do a fast version of the clap loop that hit with both claps before I found out about the delay to do it. Yes. If you do 2C8D fast, its also 2 hits. but the problem with this is, they also fall fast. And who knows if 8D is fast enough in CS for this to work? And since they fall fast, will Carl have enough time to j2C into 2D in CS? IIRC, using a fast 2C8D barely gives me enough time to do anything but a very fast 2C, the delay is to help with combo options afterwards imo. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
feri Report post Posted December 29, 2009 2A > 2B > 3C > 5 > 2D > IAD > j[2]C > ~14c > 2C > etc That is about as cheaty as it gets. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zoogstin Report post Posted December 31, 2009 no clue j.B - j214C - ]8[D x 2/3 is a legit corner loop. After that you can do a TK'd j.214C - ]8[D for one last rep of hits. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kyle Report post Posted December 31, 2009 would 6A even connect from a 2B? on anyone but tager? I saw a CS vid where Carl got 3C, 2B, 6A... in the corner. Great when our 3C is not deep enough to score 3C, J.2C, Alle~can, 6A... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mascarpone Report post Posted January 1, 2010 so .. on this note then.. what DOESN'T link for Carl c.c' Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Braver Report post Posted January 1, 2010 so air throw, 2C, vivace, 2C, 8D doesn't work anymore? I see the new carl doing a new combo o_o So whats the new combo this time for air throw? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeero Report post Posted January 1, 2010 so .. on this note then.. what DOESN'T link for Carl c.c' nothing really... because i've been doing jB (fatal CH) 5C sj jC j2C jC dj jC 214C as my fatal counter combo... healthy 3.3k damage I'm testing that 5B 6B jB thing on every character... at least thats what im in the process of since i keep getting challenged by the same few characters. When i get the full list i'll post up... I also noticed something wierd too because sometimes when i do 5b 6b jb jc jb while pushing nirvana towards me, the 2nd jb ends up crossing over and hitting the other side... might end up beign another cross over gimmick =P In regards to that "infinite unblockable" thing we saw in an earlier vid, I think the way to get out of it is to block low and eat the jC... because that means you're in crouching state and 5b 6b can't hit you... but it seems like 6C forces standing on hit... so need to work on that too =P But asides from that, so far i've been playing carl kinda like CT carl without the throw loop, people still running away, people that know how to get out of sandwich still gets out, people that doesn't still doesnt... so it feels like a CT carl with slight damage buff... but that might just be me Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kyle Report post Posted January 2, 2010 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PV0Tmgi5Ywo @9:50 Corner throw break, AirDash, J.AxN force, 8]D[... Repeat UB set-up BABY!!!!!!!!!!! This gets me pumped Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kyle Report post Posted January 2, 2010 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PV0Tmgi5Ywo @9:50 Corner throw break, AirDash, J.AxN force, 8]D[... Repeat UB set-up BABY!!!!!!!!!!! This gets me pumped The more I think about it, I presume J.A xN will not cover all options because if they are hit, the opponent rises too high to continue combo with 8]D[. Overlord Kyle recommends, Corner combo, JB+C, BREAK, AD, J.A, J.B, Allegreto, 8]D[, Corner combo, JB+C, BREAK, AD, J.A, J.B, Allegreto, 8]D[, Corner combo, JB+C, BREAK, AD, J.A, J.B, Allegreto, 8]D[, Corner combo, JB+C, BREAK, AD, J.A, J.B, Allegreto, 8]D[, Corner combo, JB+C, BREAK, AD, J.A, J.B, Allegreto, 8]D[, ... Hit or block it's rape. The opponents options are to -BREAK, Aeriel move with invincibility -BREAK, Guard J.A, IB Carl's J.B, CH Carl's Allegreto Works in theory, but not so much in practice, Kinda like break Inferno divider RC. Not many can actually do it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zeero Report post Posted January 2, 2010 I dont think its gonna work, on paper i would imagine that if they teched and mashed A or something, they'd have you beat since you have to airdash in before you can A, so you lose in speed... i dunno wut that tsubaki was doing but she got CHed, so who knows =P Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eshi Report post Posted January 2, 2010 I dont think its gonna work, on paper i would imagine that if they teched and mashed A or something, they'd have you beat since you have to airdash in before you can A, so you lose in speed... i dunno wut that tsubaki was doing but she got CHed, so who knows =PI noticed that at that part of the video, when Carl was getting pushed back after the throw break he actually went UP and back, because he had Nirvana activated so it changed his trajectory I assume. So I'm guessing that if a character doesn't have a fast air attack that hits upwardly, Carl's jA will win. I love it, I hope it's not too good to be true! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kyle Report post Posted January 2, 2010 I dont think its gonna work, on paper i would imagine that if they teched and mashed A or something, they'd have you beat since you have to airdash in before you can A, so you lose in speed... i dunno wut that tsubaki was doing but she got CHed, so who knows =P You realize that if they tech & mash anything all we have to do is drop the airdash and use Neesan to punish and end with JB+C for a reset. I did not notice Neesan activation cause the vector change originally. I like this. We could also try doing an immediate allegreto just to stop them from attacking/jumping out. The only question is could 8]D[ reach opponent before they landed? Will Neesan stay out of attack range? I'm liking this set-up. Almost makes CS seem interesting. =P Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
