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Eddie Q&A's

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is it just me or i can't really get the timing with megalith head's frc? i already opened the input display to see the exact frame the frc needs to kick in but.. yes..i'm stupid alright..i feel like i'm the only one here who can't get it right..

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is it just me or i can't really get the timing with megalith head's frc?

i already opened the input display to see the exact frame the frc needs to kick in but..

yes..i'm stupid alright..i feel like i'm the only one here who can't get it right..

It's right before Eddie turns back as in like.. Moves back into his normal stance.. Something like that... You'll see what I mean.

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This might sound noobish but what are some of Eddie's UB?

UB? UB's? unblockables?

eddie's unblockables are usually of two attacks, high and low, hitting at the same time.

the low attack is usually the summon's drill special (release hs when summon is out), and the high attack is zato's (aerial attacks, 6k, dust etc[usually aerial moves])

heres one simple setup.

in a corner:

"with your summon" damned fang, 'set drill special about 1~1.5(depends on opposing character) seconds before zato puts his arm in the ball', jump up and time your aerial move to hit on wakeup as the first hit of drill special is hitting the enemy.

thats one (<_<;

the reason you have to set your drill special depending on the opposing character is because every characters have different wakeup timing.

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how is the shadow gallery loop done?.. im new to eddie... been playin him for about 3 weeks now.. but progressively moving from game to game.. started with #r.. and id like to know everything about him there before i move on to slash (which i wanna do within the next week or 2).. but i wanna know the basics before i progress on to the next game.. Shadow Gallery loops is a lil tuff

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In Slash, the Shadow Gallery 'loop' is just ending a SG knockdown combo with a Shadow P link into another SG, for like 20 extra damage (much more in #R depending on how jacked their guard gauge is). This goes into the Mine UB, which is done by just setting a mine right after the SG knocks the opponent down.

The whole combo looks like:

(string to Shadow S) j.H-D, 41236 (hold S), release S to make Shadow S hit, 2nd hit of SG hits. Then you relaunch with Shadow P then TKSG (412369S), which hits immediately after, then you set the mine. Follow this with a regular rj.S or whatever to guardbreak.

Alternatively, if you didn't do the relaunch part, you'll need to followup with something like the following due to the slight delay on mine-set:

(land from SG), Backdash, 22H FRC, rj.K, dj.S-H to guardbreak, then go into either SG from the air for knockdown, or land and 6P into aircombo.

Anyway, the relaunch/loop part of the combo isn't really worth it at all in Slash, because not only is the SG hard to synchronize with the Shadow P, but the damage is pretty terrible. You can relaunch into the second SG by using a Shadow S instead of Shadow P, but that takes like all of your meter and is very, very unlikely to happen in actual play. And in either case, you generally won't have enough Shadow Gauge to hit with the relaunch and go into mine UB, unless you landed a hit with your first shadow attack... so I'd suggest to just stick to a combo to SG + mine UB.

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In Slash, the Shadow Gallery 'loop' is just ending a SG knockdown combo with a Shadow P link into another SG, for like 20 extra damage (much more in #R depending on how jacked their guard gauge is). This goes into the Mine UB, which is done by just setting a mine right after the SG knocks the opponent down.

The whole combo looks like:

(string to Shadow S) j.H-D, 41236 (hold S), release S to make Shadow S hit, 2nd hit of SG hits. Then you relaunch with Shadow P then TKSG (412369S), which hits immediately after, then you set the mine. Follow this with a regular rj.S or whatever to guardbreak.

Alternatively, if you didn't do the relaunch part, you'll need to followup with something like the following due to the slight delay on mine-set:

(land from SG), Backdash, 22H FRC, rj.K, dj.S-H to guardbreak, then go into either SG from the air for knockdown, or land and 6P into aircombo.

Anyway, the relaunch/loop part of the combo isn't really worth it at all in Slash, because not only is the SG hard to synchronize with the Shadow P, but the damage is pretty terrible. You can relaunch into the second SG by using a Shadow S instead of Shadow P, but that takes like all of your meter and is very, very unlikely to happen in actual play. And in either case, you generally won't have enough Shadow Gauge to hit with the relaunch and go into mine UB, unless you landed a hit with your first shadow attack... so I'd suggest to just stick to a combo to SG + mine UB.

Thank you much!.. I got it.. =)

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In Slash, the Shadow Gallery 'loop' is just ending a SG knockdown combo with a Shadow P link into another SG, for like 20 extra damage (much more in #R depending on how jacked their guard gauge is). This goes into the Mine UB, which is done by just setting a mine right after the SG knocks the opponent down.

The whole combo looks like:

(string to Shadow S) j.H-D, 41236 (hold S), release S to make Shadow S hit, 2nd hit of SG hits. Then you relaunch with Shadow P then TKSG (412369S), which hits immediately after, then you set the mine. Follow this with a regular rj.S or whatever to guardbreak.

Alternatively, if you didn't do the relaunch part, you'll need to followup with something like the following due to the slight delay on mine-set:

(land from SG), Backdash, 22H FRC, rj.K, dj.S-H to guardbreak, then go into either SG from the air for knockdown, or land and 6P into aircombo.

Anyway, the relaunch/loop part of the combo isn't really worth it at all in Slash, because not only is the SG hard to synchronize with the Shadow P, but the damage is pretty terrible. You can relaunch into the second SG by using a Shadow S instead of Shadow P, but that takes like all of your meter and is very, very unlikely to happen in actual play. And in either case, you generally won't have enough Shadow Gauge to hit with the relaunch and go into mine UB, unless you landed a hit with your first shadow attack... so I'd suggest to just stick to a combo to SG + mine UB.

Actually, doing the final -P- into SG is definately worth it because of the timing when the mine is set. If you just blatantly do -S- + SG into mine, they have plenty of time to IB your far drill and air-throw you for your trouble way before the mine explodes. Doing -P- + SG with that SAME setup however, basically guarantees 80-95% total damage output (depending on character). Check the timing on this and compare the two, as shadow -P- recovers MUCH faster than nobiru does. Eddie still kills half of the cast with this setup, and the other half has between 5% and 20% left. With a little guard gauge build on a single rep of drill pressure, it still kills everyone. His other tone-downs and FD pushback are actually what made him worse in this game, and his damage on okizeme is still very strong if you set it up optimally.

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Actually, doing the final -P- into SG is definately worth it because of the timing when the mine is set. If you just blatantly do -S- + SG into mine, they have plenty of time to IB your far drill and air-throw you for your trouble way before the mine explodes. Doing -P- + SG with that SAME setup however, basically guarantees 80-95% total damage output (depending on character).

Well it's worth it if you can get it, for sure. But due to its overall difficulty, amount of gauge required, and the overall increased pushback in Slash, that's not going to come very often. How often do you see vids of Slash Eddie landing a relaunch SG + mine?

I suppose the far drill could be IB'ed, but then you can always opt for IAD j.K-P-K to guardbreak instead, which should push them back down into the mine for UB.

Check the timing on this and compare the two, as shadow -P- recovers MUCH faster than nobiru does.

Yup, I accounted for this in the two followup combos that I posted above.

His other tone-downs and FD pushback are actually what made him worse in this game, and his damage on okizeme is still very strong if you set it up optimally

I would have to disagree here, and say that shadow not jacking up gauge on block (in combination with weaker moves) is the biggest nerf to Eddie from #R to Slash. Not being able to do lame 4-hit combos to SG for 50% damage followed by mine for the other 50% at the end of a shadow pressure string is a pretty huge change! :(

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Well it's worth it if you can get it, for sure. But due to its overall difficulty, amount of gauge required, and the overall increased pushback in Slash, that's not going to come very often. How often do you see vids of Slash Eddie landing a relaunch SG + mine?

I suppose the far drill could be IB'ed, but then you can always opt for IAD j.K-P-K to guardbreak instead, which should push them back down into the mine for UB.

Yup, I accounted for this in the two followup combos that I posted above.

I would have to disagree here, and say that shadow not jacking up gauge on block (in combination with weaker moves) is the biggest nerf to Eddie from #R to Slash. Not being able to do lame 4-hit combos to SG for 50% damage followed by mine for the other 50% at the end of a shadow pressure string is a pretty huge change! :(

I said "his other tone-downs", as well as FD pushback. "His other tone-downs" encompasses all of them, implying that the damage reduction on that particular situation isn't the sole thing that made him worse.

As far as your example goes, it doesn't work. Letting nobiru recover after the SG before planting the mine allows them time to wake up and prevent you from attacking them in retaliation. In fact, if you backdash, you're giving them the time they need to get up and run outside of far-drill range. If you want the guaranteed damage from an unblockable setup, then you HAVE to end your loop with -P- into SG. Doing anything else gives them opportunities to escape at the least, and at the worst, punish you for trying.

The amount of eddie gauge required is actually just enough for an UB setup. If you're choosing to not to -P- into SG for the guaranteed damage, and doing -S- + SG instead for just a (escapable) setup, then you're planting the mine anyway, which uses up the rest of the eddie gauge. I really don't see why the amount of gauge is an issue unless the guessed correctly off of the first mixup (and in that case, you should be confirming and going into a low/throw guessing game off of 2K and -P- for another UB setup).

You don't see many Eddie players doing re-launch via -P- into SG very often because it's not only harder to get them into that guessing game in the first place, but FD pushback actually HURTS this guessing game to a very large extent.

If you do maware, running j.K, and they FD the first hit, you have to compensate with flight in order to get the second j.K to fuzzy guard break if they duck. If you decide to j.K and then do 2D, in order to get the whole loop consistantly, you have to IAD off of the 2D. By doing that, they easily have enough time to normal block the 2D, IB the nobiru (lvl 3 guardstun), then jump up and air-throw you while you try to react to a block and keep the string going (having buffered -P- and using that in conjunction w/j.S).

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I said "his other tone-downs", as well as FD pushback. "His other tone-downs" encompasses all of them,

So you're saying that originally, you were in fact trying to emphasize that 'all of Eddie's tone-downs make Eddie worse'... excuse me for being a bit skeptic here. That's along the lines of saying 'all of Ky's buffs make him better', which is a very general and pointless statement to make.

As far as your example goes, it doesn't work.

SG (2nd hit) knockdown into backdash -> far drill FRC is easily meaty. You can't just 'get up and run away' from it. Surprised you didn't know this.

In fact, if you backdash,

This bit in particular confuses me. If you don't backdash, your far drill will be offscreen and totally miss. It sounds like you are getting the combo I listed confused for something else - I'll dig up an example from a match vid when I get back home and post it up to show you what I'm talking about here.

The amount of eddie gauge required is actually just enough for an UB setup.

True, if you always get them with your first shadow mixup - which you generally do not. Oftentimes, you just barely have the meter for SG + Shadow S knockdown, if you go that route.

FD'able strings

I think you're exaggerating the threat of FD to Eddie's pressure in general.

If you're finding your specific Eddie strings pushing you back too far by FD, you should try working empty fly dj.S-H or Damned Fang in there. 2K-Shadow P and even the first rj.K are not requirements in Eddie pressure strings, so if you're having problems with them then simply try something else. It's rare to see good Eddies get frustrated from being FD'ed away repeatedly, even in Slash.

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Pardon me if I think you're being overly presumptuous here, but you're twisting my words around. I didn't say you couldn't compensate for FD in your strings. I'm citing SPECIFIC examples based ENTIRELY upon the shadow gallery loop ender into UB. Instant blocking the 22H in your example gives you the ability to get out of that setup for free. Be it by jumping back and FDing, dashing forward and doing 6P, running jump FD, or air-throwing Eddie for attempting this setup in the first place. In fact, doing -S- into SG makes this setup escapable. Doing -P- into SG makes the UB guaranteed. Maware, running j.K, they duck, j.K, j.H, -S-, running j.H, j.D, -S- + SG, -P- + SG, mine, backdash, 22H FRC, IAD j.whatever is a FREE unblockable. Whereas maware, running j.K, they duck, j.K, j.H, -S-, running j.H, j.D, -S- + SG, mine, backdash, 22H FRC is NOT a free unblockable. The recovery time off of -S- takes too long to set the mine. The science behind that is that in the first combo, 22H FRC, even if IB'd, stops them from jumping and doing anything about your floating presence because the mine explosion happens IMMEDIATELY after the FRC, making it IMPOSSIBLE to jump out of. In the second combo example, the mine does NOT explode immediately, which means after they IB the 22H FRC and you IAD in, they can jump up and airthrow you. But, just to give you the benefit of the doubt, let's say they fail to airthrow you out of this. In order to achieve the fastest coverage, you have to do IAD j.S, j.H to keep them pinned, then you need to perform an overhead. If they sat there and IB'd your j.S and j.H, they get a free throw. If they didn't and you attempted to do 6K as you were landing for a quick overhead to get the UB, they can just as easily gold-burst that move on reaction or jump backwards and FD. I'm not saying that you CAN'T UB off of your examples. I'm saying that it's not gauranteed, and relies more on the opponent not knowing how to defend against it as opposed to it actually being free. And I don't think you're correctly evaluating the actual threat of FD to Eddie's pressure in general. It eliminates a lot of his mixup options, therefore making him far less of a threat on offense in general. Besides, if they're FDing, the only mixup you have to apply to compensate for it is running 2K -P- or Damned Fang, both which lead into UB (in the corner). I really don't think you're reading my posts carefully enough, as I didn't say I was -having- problems with running 2K into -P-. I posted that as a mixup you should be going into on having your FIRST mixup off of running j.K blocked. I really want to understand what you think I'm saying, because based on the way you're posting, it really doesn't sound like you see what I'm talking about. EDIT: As an afterthought, I'm not trying to be a dick about this, but if it's the way I come across, then my bad.

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Just a short response here, as I can't keep up the lengthy posts given the amount of work I should probably be doing about now: - Instant blocking the 22H shouldn't result in one being able to escape, from my experience and observations on it. There still doesn't seem to be enough time for the opponent to do anything other than possibly jump a bit into the air only to get pushed back down into by a rj.Eddie. I've also not once seen this string broken out of the way you describe on a good amount of Jap Slash Eddie matches, which is why I'm a bit skeptical here. - A main point of mine as to why not to focus on landing the relaunch SG combo is that one requires to connect off the very first mixup, something that occurs only ~30-40% of the time on the average from my observations, and requires very tight timing that risks you giving up free damage from the 22H variant of the UB. That's where we differ, it seems: you say the 22H is easily escapable, I say it's not...

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Just a short response here, as I can't keep up the lengthy posts given the amount of work I should probably be doing about now:

- Instant blocking the 22H shouldn't result in one being able to escape, from my experience and observations on it. There still doesn't seem to be enough time for the opponent to do anything other than possibly jump a bit into the air only to get pushed back down into by a rj.Eddie. I've also not once seen this string broken out of the way you describe on a good amount of Jap Slash Eddie matches, which is why I'm a bit skeptical here.

- A main point of mine as to why not to focus on landing the relaunch SG combo is that one requires to connect off the very first mixup, something that occurs only ~30-40% of the time on the average from my observations, and requires very tight timing that risks you giving up free damage from the 22H variant of the UB. That's where we differ, it seems: you say the 22H is easily escapable, I say it's not...

I'm glad to see that we see eye to eye on things. In my experience, I get the SG loop 95% of the time I go for it, so maybe my opinions are a bit biased :china: . However, the point was that it IS escapable period, wheras -P- into SG is not at all escapable. If they have enough time to jump, they have enough time to FD your attacks and prevent any further damage from occuring from the mine.

My philosophy on Eddie is that you really need to learn every facet of the character, no matter how hard a technique is. I'd say in #R, you wouldn't need to focus on the -P- into SG as you could potentially end the round without it. However, in Slash, it is absolutely vital to scoring high-damage if you land anything off the first mixup. The reason you don't really see many Eddie's landing that kind of shit is because they're capable of it in the first place, and most Japanese matches actually showcase players preventing Eddie from getting what he needs to start the guessing game in the first place. Also, in Slash, this guessing game is much easier to "see" (even though it's a fuzzy guard break) because of the increase on FD pushback from a blocked j.K. At the same time, the reward on land 2K->Maware is not as high as going high when you're not in the corner. The only place you see this mixup hit at all is in the corner, where 2D has an equal payout as j.K for a succesul mixup. Even then, hit-confirming off of j.K and going into safe options (and more mixups) on block is much easier and much safer than doing it off of 2D, where as I listed before, you can be punished if you attempt the combo in a certain manner, and the opponent CAN reaction punish this if they're fast (still hard).

Eddie's a hard character to play, and he needs absolutely everything to be a dominant threat on offense (the only place he really shines in this game). Skimping out on some things, even if they're easier and have -somewhat- equal payout, really just matters on the defense of the competition you're playing against. If you're playing against someone who doesn't know how to fight Eddie, well, you could really just do shenanigans all day and still win, but that's a moot point. :keke:

Thanks for the discussion, I'm going back to lurking now.

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man i was really gonna try to learn this stuff b-4 midwest buttt my slash broke , or at least my swap majiK!! :( :( :gonk: BUTTT i love you aaron i hope you see this sorry havent called back workin 2 jobs these days kinda lame, but i'll hit ya up!

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AKA - I agree with pretty much everything you said about Eddie in your last post, so I won't get too detailed there. You seem thoroughly convinced that 22H FRC is not the way to go, so I'll have to do some testing with that when I can. That info on FD making the mixup easier to 'see' in Slash is especially interesting, as I had always noticed the j.K mixups were less effective in Slash but couldn't quite place why (I had blamed hitpause/blockstun, originally). Anyway, good discussion. :) Also, it'd be great if you could post more in the Millia forums! I'd actually be very interested in hearing what you have to say about her gameplan, as that can vary quite alot from player to player... moreso than with many other characters, it would seem.

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Darn . . . looks like I showed up too late. Well, I'll try to pick up the pieces if I can.

Well it's worth it if you can get it, for sure. But due to its overall difficulty, amount of gauge required, and the overall increased pushback in Slash, that's not going to come very often. How often do you see vids of Slash Eddie landing a relaunch SG + mine?

I'm sure AKA would see videos of it more often if he recorded his own matches. You'll have to excuse him, I think sometimes he forgets that not everyone is at the same execution level.

The time I spent fighting AKA this year was short but sweet... I can tell you he isn't the type of person to see something in a video and start a discussion using it as justification. If he is saying setup XYZ is good and useful... it probably means he uses it frequently and finds it useful. As for the specific current topic... P into shadow gallery... yeah, I saw that from him a lot at Evo2k6. There are US players who can escape nobiru --> SG setups, and if USA guys can do it then Japan must also be quite skilled at it.

P.S. I can't beat AKA with DI Sol

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ohh yeah and yeah aka is right about seeing / escaping shit , i mean i didn play eddie to much in reload but everyone i play is pretty good at getting out of things , like frc drill setup in to mine or whatever , it only works if i get a counter hit but everyone i play with is mostly able to white block then jump or air throw ect.

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ohh yeah and yeah aka is right about seeing / escaping shit , i mean i didn play eddie to much in reload but everyone i play is pretty good at getting out of things , like frc drill setup in to mine or whatever , it only works if i get a counter hit but everyone i play with is mostly able to white block then jump or air throw ect.

"white block" "guilty" "upper" you Mid westerns are so funny!

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Could someone please give me the Commands for eddie's unblockable to dust unblockable drill combo in the corner... ive seen it.. ive tried it.. but i cant seem to get the buttons right.. :(

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gotta be more clear than that, but. you're probably talking about.. Haneru(summon release D), K, S, Shoukougeki(summon release P*1) OR Mawaru(summon release K*2) D(hjc), j.d(pref), Shadow Gallery, (set Drill Special) ---> then unblockable. *1 = XX and Reload *2 = Only in XX exp's/tips -haneru + k. hits at the same time = unblockable -for before your ground Dust, you need to slide tap imput summon's move. so.. enemy otg (hold D), (release D), run up, k, s, (p or k*d slide tap), --> (rest of the combo) -p or k has to be pressed first for the slidetap, or you'll get another haneru, which may connect, but obviously you wouldnt have enough eddie gauge for the next drill special. -there are other ways to do this combo, but im pretty sure this one is the easiest way for most of the people. ..yeah only works in XX and Reload. in reload, haneru takes away 80% of the eddie gauge so you can only do shoukougeki after the first unblockable. and in XX, haneru only takes away about 60%, so mawaru is possible for SLIGHTLY(haneru scales like a meany) higher damage and easier combo. also, in slash. haneru puts enemy airbourne on hit with shittyass untechable frame. so obviously your ground combo cant continue, and therefore your Dust wouldnt hit. well, if you and your friends play either R or XX, use the combo. if you have slash, maybe not.

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gotta be more clear than that, but.

you're probably talking about..

Haneru(summon release D), K, S, Shoukougeki(summon release P*1) OR Mawaru(summon release K*2) D(hjc), j.d(pref), Shadow Gallery, (set Drill Special) ---> then unblockable.

*1 = XX and Reload

*2 = Only in XX

exp's/tips

-haneru + k. hits at the same time = unblockable

-for before your ground Dust, you need to slide tap imput summon's move.

so.. enemy otg (hold D), (release D), run up, k, s, (p or k*d slide tap), --> (rest of the combo)

-p or k has to be pressed first for the slidetap, or you'll get another haneru, which may connect, but obviously you wouldnt have enough eddie gauge for the next drill special.

-there are other ways to do this combo, but im pretty sure this one is the easiest way for most of the people.

..yeah only works in XX and Reload.

in reload, haneru takes away 80% of the eddie gauge so you can only do shoukougeki after the first unblockable.

and in XX, haneru only takes away about 60%, so mawaru is possible for SLIGHTLY(haneru scales like a meany) higher damage and easier combo.

also, in slash. haneru puts enemy airbourne on hit with shittyass untechable frame. so obviously your ground combo cant continue, and therefore your Dust wouldnt hit.

well, if you and your friends play either R or XX, use the combo.

if you have slash, maybe not.

that's it sir.. thank you very much.. =)

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