BBCS1 Tier List: THE FINAL CHAPTER

[blakmaphia]

Rachel actually considered better than Tsubaki?

[T.Kang]

Rachel actually considered better than Tsubaki?

I have hard time figuring this one out myself. Seriously :/?

[KayEff]

It's because of her neutral.

[CakeWasBannedd]

rachel's abare is much better than tsubaki's, she also has better normals, the ability to zone, etc etc

[T.Kang]

rachel's abare is much better than tsubaki's, she also has better normals, the ability to zone, etc etc

But does it really make up for her lack of damage? I don't know, Tsubaki being able to do 3k-4k combos with a charge level or two seems to easily outweigh Rachel's shitty damage she gets even on the long run. Then again, I'm not one that should judge the tier list. Just giving my 2 cents.

[Nini Heart]

Tsubaki can do 3-4 or even 6 k if she wants. Point is, she's not getting the charge she needs against decent opponents and she can't make enough openings with her flimsy pressure against any good opponent.

Rachel has a lot going for her. Damage is the only thing she's missing.

Outside of the things cake mentions, she has actual oki, good mix up, good pokes, controls space well, etc.

[T.Kang]

Tsubaki can do 3-4 or even 6 k if she wants. Point is, she's not getting the charge she needs against decent opponents and she can't make enough openings with her flimsy pressure against any good opponent.

Rachel has a lot going for her. Damage is the only thing she's missing.

Outside of the things cake mentions, she has actual oki, good mix up, good pokes, controls space well, etc.

Thanks for your input. Now I get it LOL.

[kirbster]

Tsubaki can do 3-4 or even 6 k if she wants. Point is, she's not getting the charge she needs against decent opponents and she can't make enough openings with her flimsy pressure against any good opponent.

Rachel has a lot going for her. Damage is the only thing she's missing.

Outside of the things cake mentions, she has actual oki, good mix up, good pokes, controls space well, etc.

I'll have to strongly disagree, her low damage is not the only reason she's pretty bad. Her oki outside of the corner sucks on most characters since this game's combos are so character specific, her mixup is super easy to block on reaction if you're really used to it (ask Fred, it's litterally impossible to hit him with an overhead, seriously... except in the corner with a pole). Her pokes are fast but have terrible range and prorate like shit (6b has range but gives you NOTHING in this game, even on CH), her anti air can work if properly spaced, but it's useless against a lot of characters which allows them a free jump in (Hakumen, Ragna, hell even Tager come to mind).

Her zoning is good, but it's more annoying than anything and won't win you the games in the long run. 5b is decent, but landing a clean one in a match is pretty rare.

I honestly could go on, but whatever. I just don't like reading that the only thing holding her back is damage when that's simply not the case. No offense though, hopefully you still <3 me

[Nini Heart]

No one in this game has actual oki out of the corner and very few characters do have it in the corner.

Her mix up is still good even if her 4B is slow, she has J.2C with wind for an 18 frame overhead(?).

Proration is linked to damage.

Properly spaced anti-air is pretty much universal except for Valk's 2C(though I do agree that Rachel's is on the weak side).

And her zoning won't win you any games because even when you confirm your proper zoning into a combo, you do almost no damage.

I honestly believe that Rachel isn't as bad as you guys think. Sure she needs a bit more than damage tweaks to be actually good, but the main reason she is so low on the tier list is her horrible damage.

Still <3 you. Repping dem low tiers together:)

[kirbster]

lol as hard as that is to believe, I'm trying to be positive with her 6a since most Rachel players will say it's downright shit. j.2c with wind is fast as fuck but doesn't combo into anything except lobelias or lighting, which is why it gives you nothing unless there's already a pole and that's usually in the corner.

I agree that damage is the main thing holding her back though. And frankly, every single one of these issues and more have been fixed in CS2, so can't complain there.

[Airk]

It's all fine to say "Damage is the only thing holding her back" except that damage is 100% of how you win in these games. It doesn't matter how good your pressure or your zoning or your oki are, if you need to succeed 4 times as often as your opponent. And Rachel doesn't particularly excel in any of those categories. Even if your opponent makes a huge mistake, it doesn't really cost them. Tsubaki can at least capitalize on the opponent's errors (and everyone makes -some-) for some sort of results. Getting charge isn't impossible, though you won't get much against good players.

Both characters are weak, certainly, but no matter how good or how lucky you are with Rachel, it doesn't really matter because it won't do any damage.

[Nini Heart]

Rachel can do some damage. She just has horrible proration on most realistic starters. Same as Tsubaki, except Tsubaki needs charge. In order to charge, you have to give up momentum, and god knows how important momentum is in this game.

[Sophisticat]

Eh, I'm of the opinion that Rachel would be fine if only her damage was higher. Her other stuff wouldn't be better, but more damage alone probably would've put her in mid-B tier.

[Zoogstin]

I agree. Her corner lockdown is pretty solid if you ask me.

[Dusk Thanatos]

Rachel has the elusive power of GRADE A STALLING, which Tsubaki doesn't have. Her stalling power is like grade F-.

Even if Rachel doesn't do damage, she's better at keeping health leads intact, which is ungodly important when your damage is shit.

[Gil]

More damage + 6a actually being an AA and Rachel would have been far from shit. But no, damage wasn't her only issue. This dead horse has been beat so much, but still.