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Domethieus

[CSE] Taokaka vs Tager

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For this one are we supposed to wait for him to come to us, or be aggressive.

Being too wild can get you punished for good though. Don't forget Tao's drives usually get stuffed by all kind of moves that have a good hitbox and remain active for quite a while. If you are playing neutral you have to wait for the moment to get in on Tager's recovery or hit him during a move's startup frames, if you go head to head when some of his moves are active (happens when Tager uses his air moves) you are going to lose the trade battle. Move around, force him to make a mistake and get in. That's pretty much how it generally sums up.

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For this one are we supposed to wait for him to come to us, or be aggressive.

An important thing to remember if you are going to play passive is that Tager gets meter (spark bolt) by doing nothing. This matchup is pretty much a do whatever you want matchup, just dont get hit. Tao's defensive options are relatively poor so the gadget finger mixup can be really powerful depending on the skill level of the Tager player. Tager's j.2C doesn't have as much priority as it did in CS1 now, and 6A can trade with it or even beat it clean. As Ronove said, just watch out for a lot of Tager's aerials. His air throw in particular is a good option in the matchup. Pretty much do what you want, let the Tager player leave an opening for you and punish. Well spaced j.C's are perfect for this

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This is fun matchup overall for me. Crawling dodges spark bolt. Any whiffs Tager does make is a free 4.5k~ish combo assuming if you do get a CH 2C with it. Your ~D's has overall less priority too. Passive play seems to work but if Tager is aggressive, you also have to be aggressive(from what I had to deal with). Watch out for tech traps. If your health bar is less than 3/4, a 720 will kill Tao. 6C is good for catching jump startups. As Renove said, force a Tager to make a mistake. General strategy but it works.

2D~B crossup works but only if the Tager doesn't read it. I believe he can either 2A, 5A, 2C out of it.

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A tricky matchup when tager player is above normal skill. Passiveness leads to tricky setups by Tager. He can easily break your get away drive's trajectory by his magnetic stuff and collider, and make you half dead in an instant. As far as aggressive play goes, drives on block are very unsafe against him. Especially when he is experienced against Tao. The strongest option in my opinion is aggressive assault/mixup play with normals and crossups via 2d~b and cat jump. Thus you are fast enough to stop his fast moves from coming to active, and you are airborne while linking your chains - not to eat any of his throws. Tager can read your jumps and crossups of course, but generally it is pretty hard for him.

Still don't know a really decent strategy against him. If someone has other clues, please share!

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This is another one of those match ups that never really changes in how you play it and a lot of information remains a constant factor with each version of the game. Outside of Tager getting one or two new gimmicks I feel that even in Extend nothing will really change in terms of overall approach.

Tager Pressure- His pressure is really not that great and with a little bit of an IDGAF type of attitude you can really just disrespect any attempt at advance pressure easily and on IB you really limit his options.. Tager has some pretty good frame advantage of some of his normal's the problem he has no good way of using it without respect and fear.

*Notable frame advantage*

5A(+2)

2A(+2)

2B(+5)

5D(+2)

B sledge (+3)

Gadget finger on hit (+3)

Despite all the positive frame he has his moves just have too much start up thus making it possible to poke him out of stuff despite being at positive frame advantage. Most of his normal's can be canceled into 5B/2B (his lows). 5B is pretty good for 360/720 buffer motions as it is not JC and 2B is +5 on block and is probably his only safe frame trap.2B is also good for re-pressure and is their go to normal due to the heavy frame advantage,multiple gatlings and its ability to catch jump outs.

Tagers anti air's- 5A (decent hit box though not as good as 2A so less used), 2A( very good hit box and generally a better option than 2C), 2C (Ton's of active and recovery frames,fatal counter properties,kinda high risk,high reward,GDLK hit box). More are definitely possible but these are the most common ones and 2A/2C is all he really needs as both of them will get the job done just fine. Make it your best effort to bait 2C as it leads to very good damage and can easily take away half of Tao's health also it can lead to good burst bait stuff which at that point they can 720 punish you to really make you regret bursting.

Tao Pressure on Tager- Stick to the neutral in this match unless you got respect,tager has all the tools to stuff any form of mix up you might have and his back dash is really good when used properly. Use 6A for frame traps as it is JC and you can simply run away if the attempt to catch them mashing fails,2A is pretty good if they don't know how to IB and you can really harass him with it as you can gattling into 5B which is JC and you can choose to resume pressure or run away. On hit you can do stuff like ,2A,5C,JC, rising j.2B, J.C whiff into 2A/5B/6B/grab this setup is tager specific and is pretty good when you have respect as he can only get out of it with a well time back dash or churnin. Due to the numerous options you have you can choose to go for a throw reset,bait churnin,return to neutral,punish his back dash,etc. It's very safe and once you get the timing down it becomes a really interesting pressure tool that outside of Tao using 6B/throw cannot be mashed out of with a normal. Overall better safe than sorry in this match up so always do safe things and take as little risk as possible. If the tager player is respecting you don't abuse it as you might do something really stupid and get punished.

Neutral game-Tager may have the tools to stuff any of your approaches but overall neutral is all yours. His normal's have a lot of active frames and good reach, but tao's sheer speed makes her drives overall better at controlling space. The tager player really needs to make good guesses and have good spacing to control more space than tao. You can pretty much dash around the entire screen and all Tager can do is watch and wait for the point in time in which he catches you,due to the drive distance nerf it is now harder to run away from him and in most scenarios impossible. Tager's normal's and his over all massive structure cover too much space to truly escape now as even when you sticky kitty away from the wall after a standard ender tager is usually standing in front of you after a forward tech and landing. But overall tao can fish and poke for counter hits all day so be sure to confirm every hit you get. Crawl is actually pretty good in the neutral as you can crawl his 2A,5C,spark bolt and 5D which are generally all his good pokes you can craw 5A but if they are mashing it there is nothing you can do besides rise and block as any option you try will get you counter hit more times than it will win. Air thorw is also a good option against passive tagers as a lot of them do barrier jump to gain some space from time to time so you can get a free air throw attempt against these type of players, truth be told you can air throw tager out a lot of his air normal's so be sure to give it a try as they have tons of active frames and do well at stopping drive happy tao's so air throwing them is a much safer option from those closer distances.

Escaping Tager pressure- Though not as strong Tager has the mind game factor of bang in his pressure. Tager has the ability to make you afraid to do things thus making you respect is unsafe things due to fear of taking damage. Like bang tager cancel almost all his stuff into 2B which is the rough equivalent of bangs 6A it's a frame trap and leaves at plus frames,pretty much stops you from mashing and jumping out. Once your not mashing they can command grab you (360A.720) and deal big damage to tao for trying to block. The best way around this is to have a calm mind at all times and to never let one thing hold you down as it may lead to your downfall,an example of this is when tager yomi colliders you don't let this one good guess stop you from trying to jump as you might get 720 for being grounded which is even more damage. Always alter between your options, back dash into barrier is really good at gaining some space from tager and is a good way of escaping 360A without getting collidered. Just be careful as tager can get back dashes with 5D and 5C so try to use it only when you feel a command grab is coming . Gadget finger is usually where all the problems start as tager is +3 and he has many options that he can do. Rest assured all these options are guesses and most of the of his safe option can be back dashed and require him to do very slow normal's to catch your back dash. A lot of tager do gadget finger and mash 5A to stop you from jumping away/mashing out you can back dash this as well as block his attempt to 5C it, this is usually your best option as you escape, 720,360A,yomi collider,5A mash,5B,2B, eventually they will have to start using 5C and 5D after gadget to stop you from back dashing both of which you can crawl/mash out not to mention simply block and counter assault. Overall gadget finger oki is simply a very good game of rock paper scissors and guessing wrong twice is probably game over so work on your guessing skills. Everything else comes down to 5B/2B frame traps and mashing/crawling things like 5A,5A,5D in which case you have to not block the 5D and simply mash or crawl.MTW RC is pretty good at beating a lot of options but it requires 100 heat so a lot of tager players don't throw it out too often after gadget as if it fails they just lost their fear factor (720 mash out).Essentially tao will always have meter to counter assault so the amount guess work you do is really not all that much.

Best tools in the match up- Drives are ok if your using them to control space/ be really annoying be careful as Tagers air normal's are active for years and do well at stuffing drives. Be sure to air throw anytime Tager jumps as his normal have slow start up and it can be really easy to get throw reject misses if they are just pressing buttons in the sky, J.C is pretty good some times but truth be told I prefer to not throw it out all too much. Crawl is pretty good as you can crawl a lot of his good pokes as well as spark bolt thus making it hard for him to control space. 6A and 2D are somewhat useful though be careful as they can trade if timed even a second late, and this is a trade tager players are happy to take as the health loss is nothing to them (lol 13K). Tagers 2A/5A/2C/5C do really well at stuffing drive cancel approaches so be unpredictable as these can all lead to damage you can't afford to lose. Patience is definitely helpful in this match as it's required in order to go for time out victories and generally beating overly aggressive tagers (never get into a mash war with tager you don't have the health to do so).

What you may want to do/What not to do- Never save your burst as tager breaks primers pretty easily and can now do guard crush 720/360A for solid damage. Tager can use a meaty MTW RC to bait out wake up gold burst and stuff all your wake up options so show some respect when they have 100 heat. Try to burst early as it becomes easier to burst bait the more you wait as well as you don't want tager with a life lead. Don't stick to one game plan as you become very auto pilot this way, always adapt to your opponents tech traps and habits. One thing that you may want to do is purple throw tager when your about to finish the basic loop ender as you can get easy green grab resets/ and drive counter hit's if they are mashing. This is a very good way to avoid getting 720 as you can't 720 in the air, if done properly you can really limit his air options without being at much risk. I see a lot of japanese players do this when tager has low health and has 50 heat as losing to 720 mash out sucks, be sure to experiment with it in training as the fact that you get all your air mobility options if they tech the purple throw gives you plenty of options to choose from. If they don't tech the purple throw it's free damage and you can use 5D-B cancel and go for an air tech trap or do something like 2B cross under stuff the choice is yours.

Final words- This match up can be quite difficult if the tager has a lot of tao experience so don't let the whole tager low tier thing get to your head. One of the best ways to start the match as jump back gain some space and see the type of player they are and adjust your play style accordingly. Obviously you will have trouble beating a patient player with patience so be more aggressive if they are very aggressive switch to a more passive play style as this will fluster them and cause them to take more risk. Try to be quick on what you want to do to tager when he is blocking as you don't want to be in his face for too long. When you have a good life lead don't be afraid to back off a bit as you might find yourself losing to a tager player throwing out an act of desperation (720/random MTW). Remain clam at all times and try to pick off any bad habits the player might have this match up can be either really bad for tager or really simple as catching you and making 2 correct guesses should kill you. As for which play style is best to play it all comes down to who your opponent is and how he acts to certain situations. Adapt accordingly and abuse your superior mobility if worst comes to worst

learn hazama and just counter pick him with S tier command grab shenanigans.

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