[CS2] Litchi vs Tager

[E3vE3 WAZ HEA]

ok i kno this is REALLY dumb since litchi has a huge advantage agents tager but i still have problems with him. i kno i can poke him if i have the staff and try to anti air them if they try to jump in, also blocking sparkbolt i can do some times but some times if im not paying attention i will get hit, but im still having some issues with this match anyone can help

[Romeyurhomey]

Ummm not to troll but 6B>6C (0:50)

[E3vE3 WAZ HEA]

its okay i knew i waz going to get trolled wen i started this but hey i kno there must be other litchi players who still have trouble with this match i was just one that wasnt afraid to ask for a little advice, weather i get trolled or not

as for the 6b>6c i do use that but there are some tagers i fight who have found away around it (or im doin it totally wrong xD) like i said i know i can just poke them but its not enough for me they still get in grab and distroy me.

[Star-Demon]

I play some decent Tagers both locally and online.

Myself - I have problems respecting Tagers properly. I mostly play them as if to practice attacks, and you just can't. You have to learn Tager properly like any other character. That's why I lose Tagers.

That video is actually a very good example - Ignore the corner stuff - Pay close attention to the first minute. LK understand this matchup and stays very active in a neutral game against Tager by reacting and poking.

Look how afraid Tager is to jump. If you encounter jumpy Tagers - they are counting on you to not know your own character's AA tactics, AND not respecting you. He knows if he jumps Litchi is going to IttsuA or punish his air block and Proceed as Planned. Litchi has just the correct spacing. Enough to 6C or 6B without getting punished, enough for it to connect if blocked.

The first and FOREMOST thing about Tager is that he has to be respected.

The problem with Tager is that he has this terrible reputation as a character that doesn't fit in BlazBlue and is gimped to being broken, but here in AMERICA it seems Tager is S tier when he's actually Tager (D) tier. This is because no one respects Tager and feel they can be aggressive or turtle and Tager is just going to sit there and accept whatever they do. You are going to lose if you play like that.

[Lord Knight]

6b is not trolling

you are setting the pace of the match

i spend the beginning figuring out what kind of pace the match is going to be

well used itsuu is great vs tager since it always hits two times - you can force him to the ground and do fuzzy on his landing

if you are magnetized and midrange dont do 6b > 6c

when you do decide to do 6b > 6c always buffer an airdash during 6c to autoconfirm it

[E3vE3 WAZ HEA]

ok thx this should help just one more question what to do after gadget finger, i seem to get punished dispite everything i do

backdash

jump

2a

DP :8/:

block (usualy get over headed low hit or most of the time grabbed)

is there somthing im doing wrong or im i timing these wrong

[Nakkiel]

You don't have a 100% answer for gadget finger. Jump back j.A is probably your safest option, since it only gets beaten by Gadget Finger 5A which doesn't lead to much damage.

[E3vE3 WAZ HEA]

ok, thnx

i found this thing against tager that works pretty well, i just came up with it the other day, basically if i have the staff ill do 2b[m] 6a[m], i find that to be helpful as it hits low then a overhead, i went an entire round doing this, even when he jumped i moved back and waited for him to land then did it again, just wanted an opinion on this mix up

[Star-Demon]

ok, thnx

i found this thing against tager that works pretty well, i just came up with it the other day, basically if i have the staff ill do 2b[m] 6a[m], i find that to be helpful as it hits low then a overhead, i went an entire round doing this, even when he jumped i moved back and waited for him to land then did it again, just wanted an opinion on this mix up

I learned this recently, too - Half-screen distance double overhead? It's really neat but I have to warn you - it's a gimmick. Real Tagers won't put up with that.

You don't want to be stuck on the tail end of that overhead, the staff coming back to you (not sure which state it's in, but I don't think you have the recovery to do much with it), and now Tager is Sledging, Jumping in, or Voltecing. Bad.

If it hits - your game is still neutral as it was and Tager took a little damage and now you are recovering. If he got hit by Litchi's Staffless part of that Overhead, watch yourself be 360ed after.

If he's in the hole in between both overheads, you're boned.

If he blocked, you're also boned.

If he jumped, you're boned.

[Romeyurhomey]

What are tager only combos that Litchi can do?

[E3vE3 WAZ HEA]

What are tager only combos that Litchi can do?

i have this one without the staff, i have it on my camera n might upload it

5c 2c j.c j.b j.c 2c j.c j.b j.c 2c j.c j.b j.c 2c 6c(1) 623/421D j.bcb dj.bcb 236b 236c

the j.c after the 2c u wana slightly delay the j.b or else it will miss

i live for tager loops and spend hours in the lab learning some, even tho they might not ever come into play in a real battle

[Nakkiel]

I learned this recently, too - Half-screen distance double overhead? It's really neat but I have to warn you - it's a gimmick. Real Tagers won't put up with that.

You don't want to be stuck on the tail end of that overhead, the staff coming back to you (not sure which state it's in, but I don't think you have the recovery to do much with it), and now Tager is Sledging, Jumping in, or Voltecing. Bad.

If it hits - your game is still neutral as it was and Tager took a little damage and now you are recovering. If he got hit by Litchi's Staffless part of that Overhead, watch yourself be 360ed after.

If he's in the hole in between both overheads, you're boned.

If he blocked, you're also boned.

If he jumped, you're boned.

Actually at max 2B[m] 6A[m] chain distance, you're very safe regardless of Tager blocking it or not. 6A[m] is still only -2 (-5 on IB). That's not that much of a disadvantage when you're half the screen away. Just backdash if jump backwards, he can't do anything about it unless you're magnetized. The reason 6A[m] isn't a good choice is because unless it CHs for some reason or you spend 50 meter, there's no reward. It leaves you at +1 on hit so you can't just be grabbed for free, but it's not the place you want to be in this matchup.

Don't bother with using this against him other than very sparingly, there's just no reward for it. Zone him with 6B[m], 6C[m], Itsuu and when he jumps 2C[m]/j.A/airgrab is still a good mixup. ItsuuA is also now a very strong option which you can easily replace 2C[m] with. If you have 50 meter and want to rush him down, 5A hits him crouching and rising j.C]m[ hits him crouching.

The match isn't fun, but it's fairly easy when you know how to play it. Just lame him out.

[E3vE3 WAZ HEA]

Actually at max 2B[m] 6A[m] chain distance, you're very safe regardless of Tager blocking it or not. 6A[m] is still only -2 (-5 on IB). That's not that much of a disadvantage when you're half the screen away. Just backdash if jump backwards, he can't do anything about it unless you're magnetized. The reason 6A[m] isn't a good choice is because unless it CHs for some reason or you spend 50 meter, there's no reward. It leaves you at +1 on hit so you can't just be grabbed for free, but it's not the place you want to be in this matchup.

Don't bother with using this against him other than very sparingly, there's just no reward for it. Zone him with 6B[m], 6C[m], Itsuu and when he jumps 2C[m]/j.A/airgrab is still a good mixup. ItsuuA is also now a very strong option which you can easily replace 2C[m] with. If you have 50 meter and want to rush him down, 5A hits him crouching and rising j.C]m[ hits him crouching.

The match isn't fun, but it's fairly easy when you know how to play it. Just lame him out.

thx this should really help

[Star-Demon]

I'm having problems executing the strat. Tager will BB IttsuA, and on the way down I won't know what to do and get hit into big damage. I'll burst to get control back, but it was recommended I Counter Assault to get back to good space and neutral. I'm not sure if this is good when he's doing his stuff to get to Atomic collider, since I never seem to block it or read it correctly.

Pretty much, I learned he's got no fear of CH from me. I need to learn the damn kote link and corner rape or else I'm gonna have this Tager jumping everywhere and coming down on me.

6B, 6C, and 3C really did help me out, though.

[Romeyurhomey]

if he blocks Ittsu A, You can just do jA,jA,jB,jA throw mixup to pressure him.

[E3vE3 WAZ HEA]

okay ive fought 3 tagers that do this and im gettin punished for it what to do against sledge hammer happy tagers

[Lord Knight]

6B. if they are using B sledge, its a free hit.

if they are using A sledge, pay close attention to how they are using it. reposition yourself as needed

[E3vE3 WAZ HEA]

kk thnx

[Lord Knight]

I'm having problems executing the strat. Tager will BB IttsuA, and on the way down I won't know what to do and get hit into big damage. I'll burst to get control back, but it was recommended I Counter Assault to get back to good space and neutral. I'm not sure if this is good when he's doing his stuff to get to Atomic collider, since I never seem to block it or read it correctly.

Pretty much, I learned he's got no fear of CH from me. I need to learn the damn kote link and corner rape or else I'm gonna have this Tager jumping everywhere and coming down on me.

6B, 6C, and 3C really did help me out, though.

in BB, when you land you are forced to stand for some unknown amount of frames

so when you do itsuuA anti air, do w/e air normals to force him down. you should land before him. keep using normals to force him down. end in some jump cancellable normal

from there you can do high/low and there isn't much he can do about it. do jBCB for high or 2b/3c/haku for low

[Star-Demon]

Thanks - another thing I've noticed after last week - My spacing is incorrect. Tager reaches farther than I think he does, especially in air with his j.d(?). That hits me the most, and it sets me up for hte most damage once I'm magnetized and in his face when he lands and I'm getting up.

[E3vE3 WAZ HEA]

Thanks - another thing I've noticed after last week - My spacing is incorrect. Tager reaches farther than I think he does, especially in air with his j.d(?). That hits me the most, and it sets me up for hte most damage once I'm magnetized and in his face when he lands and I'm getting up.

i notice that too when i see tager jump im like "hes not going to hit" but when i try to do sumtin like 2c[m] i hear a thick "COUNTA"

[Lord Knight]

General Matchup:

-6-4 for Litchi. You need to quickly figure out what kind of approach they take towards the matchup, as that will define the pace (more so than other matchups)

Round Start:

-Jump away jC > airdash back jC. Tager can't stop you from doing this, and if he chases you in the air you'll counter hit him.

Fullscreen:

-Look at him.

3/4 Screen:

-Pretty much the optimal distance for this matchup. From here you should have ample time to react to all Tager's movements.

-Be ready to prepare 6B or Itsuu for his approach. If you do 6B, follow up with 6C and buffer airdash.

-If he does super jump, itsuuA. Normal jump, itsuuA if you can, or 6B > 6C him away.

Midscreen:

-Run away! Reposition yourself optimally if you can.

-If they are getting into this position by super jumping at you, be prepared to run under them to reset the positioning.

-3C[m] will beat his 6[A]. Confirm by setting the staff and doing dash 5C > jBCB loop, or if they are near the corner, follow up with 2B > 6B.

Litchi's Pressure:

-5A is awesome in this matchup. It's +3 on block and leads to high/low/throw/anti-mash/anti-backdash/anti-jump. Unfortunately Tager is too big for point blank 3C > delay Tsubame combos. Alternate between 5A > 4D, 5A>2C, and 5A > 3C (or 2B), 5A > Throw and Throw reject, and whatever else you can think of.

-Staffless, when doing 5A pressure, if he's standing, follow up with jBCB for meterless instant overhead. Outside of that, normal 5A pressure still applies.

-With 50 meter staffless, you can do instant overhead with jC RC > jC > jB. Make sure you do it off a jump cancellable normal (like 2A).

Tager's Pressure:

-Scary! If he does sledge and you have meter, you can CH him out of the recovery with CA.

-Tager's 3C is punishable on IB.

-Tager's specifically like doing 360/720's after 5A, 6A, 5B and 2B. Of course, be prepared for the mixup.

-If you're midscreen and read a command grab, try to escape with backstep rather than jump. Although jumping is easier, if they guess your jump with Atomic Collider, you'll take a good amount of damage.

-Always be prepared for the collider reset!

-If you don't think you'll be able to block the Gadget Finger > RC > Collider mixup, gold burst.

-If Tager has 100 meter, after Gadget Finger he'll definitely do Magna Tech Wheel > RC. Be prepared for the mixup after (initially command grab).

-B Sledge will beat Tsubame Gaeshi, so be careful.

Daisharin:

-After Daisharin, jump straight up, follow up with falling jC.

-If he does 720, he'll get counter hit. If he does sledge, he'll get counter hit. If he does MTW, you can barrier on reaction.

-For mixup, do rising jC or 3C.

[E3vE3 WAZ HEA]

Maybe it's just me but that seems a bit overwelming to remember once I start panicking I forget everything and wind up losing But ima try to do the best I can I swear my top 3 hated characters tager ragna n hazama

edit: forget it >.>

[Star-Demon]

"Only losers do their best, winners go home and fuck the prom queen."

Anyways, putting the stick down and going crazy and just throwing in an overhead seemed to work out better than I thought. I should do more of this, since it took more life.