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[CSE] Noel vs. Carl

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Match Up Ranking: To Be Discussed

Recommended Playstyle: To Be Discussed

Your Best Tools: To Be Discussed

General Strategy: To Be Discussed

Has A DP?: Zip. Brio might count since it has a very fast start-up, but can be stopped if you hit Carl or make him block. Oh and it costs Nirvana meter hur hur.

Has A DP With Heat?: Gear Super (632146C) -Once activated, the giant gear will stay there for the full duration regardless if Carl gets hit or not. Nirvana can still do things during the animation.

Things To Look Out For: To Be Discussed

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I don't play this match-up a lot so I am always scratching my head when it comes to effective ways to approach Carl. It seems to me like this just turns into a game of jump-over-the-doll. Is it always supposed to play out like that? Noel has very limited range and Optic Barrel is only so effective. Any suggestions for approaching?

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The Carl matchup is more of a game of Chess, if you're just netplaying or playing casuals, then I tend to just try my best to dodge the Doll and get to Carl as fast as I can, however this is only one way to play the matchup, and it's not recommended to play like this too often.

The actual "Chess" aspect of this matchup involves taking out Nirvana, and making sure you never get stuck between Carl and Nirvana. When you say "Optic Barrel is only so effective", you're correct as far as approach goes, but Optic Barrel's REAL use in this match is to hit Nirvana at a safe range. Throwing out Optic Barrel when Carl tries to activate Nirvana for any reason, is the best method of safely taking her out, OB does a pretty decent chunk of Nirvana's health bar, and once you take her out you can go on the offensive.

If at any time Carl is the one that get's hit by Optic Barrel, then you can rush in and start your offense, be careful though, because if the Carl get's free from your pressure, you could find yourself Blocking the Doll, meaning it's sandwich time.

So basically the real way to play this matchup is absolute patience, Drive is also decently effective against Carl's normals, 2D goes over a lot of them, however Nirvana likes to eat 2D alive, so be careful when throwing out Drives while sandwiched.

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I can't say I have ever tried to beat down Ada before going after Carl. What a funny idea. Most Carl players will always keep Nirvana in front of them(which is the smart way to do it). Next time I play this match-up I will try and be a bit more patient with it. If I can make Carl worry about losing his sister then the battle is won!

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It's not WON per se, but the fact that you can easily kill Carl before his sister revives is a big factor, the Carl player needs to be very careful if his sister is dead against Noel.

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Om if u dont mind me saying so,, the carl has no tools on wake up VS 2a mash. Ada has i believe a 6-7 frame activation window were she goes from Off to On, during this window carl is trying to input or has already input Brio. If Ada is hit during this 6-7 frame period Brio will take her meter, ur 5a/2a will take meter, Brio will not activate & carl cannot Vivace out due to the 2a spam. Doing meaty 5a into 2a beats every option he has, it does become a problem if carl backdashes because u will whiff & he can grab u for ~4k this is why u do 5a > 2a xN to beat the backdash & meaty 5a to tell Ada STFU & wake up Gear has 1 inv frame during super flash & thats has a 8f startup. If a carl tries this there free anyway or the have 0 respect for u. Seriously its suicidal

@12:40 u can see Tsubaki eliminating his wake up options with Meaty 2a into 2a mash

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=O7oAg9qKnTQ&t=11m45s

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uhh i stumbled across that vid while watching sum ion youtube. But even still a 2a is a 2a O.o wth why would it matter whose 2a it is. I can assure u its legit from personal experience. which is why i say do 5a 2axN since it only goes to x3 in EX save one rep by using 5a to hit Ada & 2ax3 for carl cause if u did 5a 2a 5b the 5b would whiff during a backdash if carl did one.

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Just for comparison sake: Tsubaki 5A/2A - Startup 6, Active 3/Startup 7, Active 2 ---- Noel 5A/2A - Startup 5, Active 3/Startup 6, Active 3.

Even the hitboxes are both comparable on both attacks for both characters(I looked I was already on the wiki~). I do not see it being relevant to which character is doing it(in this case) but you never know. I could be wrong.

Anyways, thank you for that bit of insight Akira.

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