[CSE] Rachel vs. Tsubaki

[gli]

Summary:

Fullscreen:

Midscreen:

Pressure:

[Sakaku]

- Tsubaki can't shield rush you for free anymore. If you block the A, B or C version and she has no charge, feel free to pressure or punish (?) her since she is only able to cancel them on hit and is quite minus on block.

- Try to find habits when she pressures you. Pressing too many buttons often result in a CH in her favour. One frame trap I know is where she will do 2AAAA 5AAA pressure into 5C.

- 214B/C/D beats our 6B. Be careful when trying to outpoke her 5B (haha)

- Don't be too Lobelia happy. FC 3C hurts.

[Tari]

For what it's worth, you can react to Tsubaki's shield charge startup with cat chair at almost any range beyond point-blank and win. The only shield charge that doesn't lose to cat chair is the D version, since it crosses up. She can bait it by using a shield charge that doesn't reach you, though, or by using the aforementioned D version.

Not particularly useful info, I suppose, but still an option.

[Kiba]

- Tsubaki can't shield rush you for free anymore. If you block the A, B or C version, feel free to pressure or punish (?) her since she is only able to cancel them on hit and is quite minus on block.

Tsubaki can cancel 236X into 214D/22D on block and whiff too.

[Tari]

Tsubaki can cancel 236X into 214D/22D on block and whiff too.

Cat chair still wins! Mwahahaha. But yeah. Previous cons still stand.

[Sakaku]

Tsubaki can cancel 236X into 214D/22D on block and whiff too.

Ah lol. The more you know..

[TD]

a lobelia > tsubaki

pumpkin > tsubaki

a lobelia stops all 236x and dives, no wind required. the huge active frames means it's exceedingly difficult for tsu to punish (perish the thought with a nearby pumpkin out). she can 214d through them (fullscreen she can do 236c 214d if timed right), but it leaves her in a worse off position w/o heat/charge.

3c beats lobelia and will hurt too, but needs 50 heat. lol

also, the general short range of her 'counters' are made apparent with hime's ability to keep tsu fullscreen.

236a(xn), summon, 236a is great in neutral. 8d beats the dives guaranteed if you want to be sure of a ch. 6d is good for stopping her from advancing. pumpkin stops IAD's and its pumpkin lol. tsu cant kill george reliably.

iris and 236c8d to ch sj.[d] bullshit. knock that stank ho out of the air.

play the neutral correctly and she wont even get the chance to pressure you. this MU to me feels like it's 6-4.

correct me on anything

[Alex073088]

I think if anything its even, definitley not 6-4. Tsubaki rapes up close with or without meter. rachel cannot deal with that pressure. Also, If a tsubaki is losing to, or cant get around lobelia a then that player is not very good. she can cleanly space her way in and just airdash B over it. Or with charge she can 236+d(the move she dashes forward quickly) then use another charge to perform her upperbody invunerable launcher and get a nasty combo for and over zoning rachel. Imho there is no 6-4 rachel favor match-up in the game.

[Tecta1Eastside]

Its kinda hard to judge the match-up as for as exact numbers. Tsubaki's mix-ups are not that great. She doesn't rape you without meter since she is not even breaking 2k ground to ground unless she is at max close range. In general, tsu needs charges to even break 2k off of everything midscreen. While tsu is charging rachel is setting up her zoning game. So even if she has charges tsu still has to work to get to you and it takes 2 charges for that 236d into 214d set-up if you even land it on her. You can block either part and be fine. Now once tsu has 50 meter and 1 charge at max close range she can break 4k off her 214214d anywhere on the screen off of 5a 5b 5c 6c 2c 3cFC combo starters. Her high corner damage set-ups take both meter and charges to get over 3-4k off of everything. On rachel's end she still has her zoning and oki game which is good midscreen and worse for tsu in the corner. With meter its not that hard for Rachel to break 3k and get oki or set-up her zoning game. The match-up is really just how good the rachel player zones tsubaki and since their damage output is about even I would lean towards this match being 55-45 rachel's favor. Anywhere in the range of 50-50 to 60-40 is acceptable though as long as its not in Tsubaki's favor. Im pretty sure most ppl would say its in rachel favor though.

[Alex073088]

Rachel zoning is not that dominant against a mobile character like tsubaki(helpful but risky for rachel to zone), it takes her own meter to full gaps which refills slowly after use, and does no damage. Tsubaki can break decent damage off J.b counter(2.8k),unblockable, or her anti-air without charge. Its not hard to get charge for tsubaki either and with rachel damage output, she can only do but so much damage from zoning.

Now when tsubaki does get in she doesnt have to worry about rachel trying to fight back, her normals are godlike, combined with the low attack that gives frame advantage and the fact that most unsafe strings at tsubaki maxs range rachel is not reliably able to punish pretty much means that tsubaki wins up close hands down. And rachel wins if she can counter tsubakis methods to advance on her. To me 50-50 even, both characters have a decent and fair shot of winning this match-up.

And it is hard for rachel to break 3k midscreen without wind or meter sir. She needs her resources available same as tsubaki.

[Airk]

Rachel zoning is not that dominant against a mobile character like tsubaki(helpful but risky for rachel to zone), it takes her own meter to full gaps which refills slowly after use, and does no damage. Tsubaki can break decent damage off J.b counter(2.8k),unblockable, or her anti-air without charge. Its not hard to get charge for tsubaki either and with rachel damage output, she can only do but so much damage from zoning.

Tsubaki doesn't have an unblockable without charge. Yes, she can get ~3k off it in the corner without ANOTHER charge, but that's still not particularly impressive. It -is- pretty easy to charge against Rachel overall though.

Now when tsubaki does get in she doesnt have to worry about rachel trying to fight back, her normals are godlike, combined with the low attack that gives frame advantage and the fact that most unsafe strings at tsubaki maxs range rachel is not reliably able to punish pretty much means that tsubaki wins up close hands down. And rachel wins if she can counter tsubakis methods to advance on her. To me 50-50 even, both characters have a decent and fair shot of winning this match-up.

And it is hard for rachel to break 3k midscreen without wind or meter sir. She needs her resources available same as tsubaki.

Yeah, but Rachel's meter fills up just by standing on the ground, and she starts the match with it full.

I wouldn't go so far as to say that this is 6/4, but maybe 5.5/4.5 - it's mostly about who gets momentum first, and it's a little easier for Rachel than it is for Tsubaki.