[CSE] Makoto Combo/Discussion Thread

[KazenBusou]

Aaaah, so that's what it's about. Thanks a lot.

[KazenBusou]

Double-posting. If I should delete the post, tell me.

On that same combo, right after the 5B > 6C, linking it into 214B > j.A appears to be a matter of delaying. Or maybe it isn't. Makoto hits too high with her j.A if I cancel it "immediately".

Also, the j.B > j.D right after that has a jump cancel in the middle, doesn't it?

And just to make sure: "Corona Ender" means "Corona Upper -> Meteor Dive"? Or is there more?

EDIT: Now onto the "Weak" Corner confirm combo. When I do this: 2C* > 236A~D > 66 > 5CC, The 236A~D connects, but it doesn't send the foe to the floor, recovering right after they touch it. This doesn't create a good situation to send them back to the air with the 66 > 5CC. Any advice? What am I doing wrong here?

[Reisi]

Simply get used to the timing of 214B > j.A, there's not a lot of advice I can give you there.

Yes, j.B > jc > j.D.

Corona ender can be anything from j.CB > j.CC > j.623C~D to 6321473C~D, the former being most damage and the later best oki. In any case, delay the ~D as much as the proration will allow you to. (Oki is awesome btw.)

You are most likely doing the 236A too early. The enemy will bounce off the orb 3-4 times, but will then fall down. That's because your ~D is whiffing entirely, due to the opponent being too high. You have to wait a bit after doing 2C so that your opponent is in the middle of the orb when it starts hitting them. Then the ~D part will hit and you'll have enough time to do 66 > 5CC/6A.

[Lusterleon]

I know Makoto can combo her 2C> 214A~CCC>5A>stuff, if timed right :3

[Domethieus]

updated with BnB section with notes. I'll be putting up credits when I don't feel sick.

[lowhunter]

I have a question about this combo: "5B > 6C > 214ACD > PF 2 > 2D > 2C > 214AA > Aerial"

After the 2nd PF hit, do I have to dash backwards in order to the 2D to hit?

Thanks in advance ^^

[StarGazer]

After the second hit of Particle Flare you have to Dash under your opponent so you must pay attention to where is your opponent, eg: after Makoto recovers from the second hit of Particle Flare, if your opponent is on the right side of Makoto then you have to input 66 to the right to dash under him and create the needed distance for 2D to hit correctly, if your opponent crossed you to the left side and you input'ed 66 to the right, Makoto will do back dash instead of dashing which will result in failure.

... Its really hard to explain this combo, hope you get it right

[Zeron_X25]

You just dash forwards and when you do 2D, it goes the other way and hits them. It's not really that hard to explain. lol

[milesw]

The real problem is what part of the body the character hits during the 2d. If its the tip u cant combo. When its lower down at the side of her arm it combos.

Im still getting to grips with hitting that consistently.

Bump to my previous question.

Comboing off a raw pf cant combo off the 2d. Its easier when its done of shooting star or a back throw. But i cant do it from a raw hit :/

[Reisi]

I just tried it.

You can do a backdash in time when done right next to the opponent. You can also dash under after they cross you up. And I got 2D > 2C to hit in very rare cases. But after that, you can only go into an air combo since they're too high. I tried that for at least 45 minutes now, there seems no way to connect 2D properly. 214A~C~B works on FC, but I can't hit it anytime else and even then it's damn finicky, it's far beyond match practical, if you ask me.

[milesw]

I just tried it.

You can do a backdash in time when done right next to the opponent. You can also dash under after they cross you up. And I got 2D > 2C to hit in very rare cases. But after that, you can only go into an air combo since they're too high. I tried that for at least 45 minutes now, there seems no way to connect 2D properly. 214A~C~B works on FC, but I can't hit it anytime else and even then it's damn finicky, it's far beyond match practical, if you ask me.

I'll keep trying. It would be a nice against tager's 2d or something on block if you could get a combo off of it that goes over the dmg of the full super.

[Fluck]

Hi guys, a few questions about Makoto's combo theory:

1) How do you combo airborne opponents in the corner? For example, after baiting a burst or catching a jump-out. The current route I'm using is basically stuff into j.B j.D into 2D 5D, but I think it's likely that there are better routes.

2) Linked to the first question, what are the ways to incorporate 5D into your combo on an airborne opponent? You can do it after j.D and 2D, but are there other ways?

[Reisi]

1) Depends on the punishes available to you. If they're really high and you hit them with the tip of 2C, you could go: 2C > 214A~D > 5CC > 2D > j.D > 2366A~D > 66A > 5D > 'ender'

j.B > j.D > 2D > 2C > 236A~D > 66A > 5D > 'ender' on regular hit. j.B CH > 2D > 2C > 214A~D > etc. for punishing them when pushing buttons. If they are too high for j.B > j.D, go for j.B > j.B > j.623C~D so you can keep them in the corner and continue pressuring them.

2) If proration allows it, you can pick up opponents with 5CC > delay > 5D. As stated above, 236A~D > 66A > 5D works as well.

[StarGazer]

1) You can either go for j.D or get 6A > 2D, for example:

- Someone tries to get out of orb oki 236A > 2A 5B 6A 2D > 2C 214AD > 5CC > j.B jc j.D > 5D > Ender

- Someone tries to jump out j.A j.A j.B > jc j.D > 2D > 2C 236AD > 6A 5D > Ender

2) 5CC and 6A gives you enough untechable time to connect your 5D, there are rare situations like j.B CH > Land > 5D or 214BD > RC > j.B > land > 5D

5CC is very strict when it comes to hitboxes and proration scale

Example:

-6A Anti air CH > 665CC 5D

-5CC > Gazer > 2A 5B 2D level1 > 5CC 5D

-6A Anti air CH > 66A 5D

[Domethieus]

-Updated-

[kotokot]

I just tried it.

You can do a backdash in time when done right next to the opponent. You can also dash under after they cross you up. And I got 2D > 2C to hit in very rare cases. But after that, you can only go into an air combo since they're too high. I tried that for at least 45 minutes now, there seems no way to connect 2D properly. 214A~C~B works on FC, but I can't hit it anytime else and even then it's damn finicky, it's far beyond match practical, if you ask me.

afair i did without FC 214A~D>PF>2D>2C>214A~C~B, but it was very few times and is too hard. 2D must hit as low as possible and must not crossdown if you want 2C>214A~C~B.

[KazenBusou]

I've been thinking about learning some 6A anti-air counter combo, but I can't see much here (yet).

Could I have some suggestion here? It's not that hard to get to the 6A > 5CC part, but what beyond there? Could I get to some of the usual combo enders?

EDIT: Ok, so I've been trying

CH Anti-Air 6A > 66 5CC > 2D (1) > 5B > 6A > j.B > j.D > 66 5CC > j.CB > j.CC > 623C~D (16 hits / 2777 DMG)

I suppose it's nothing close optimal, but it's the best I could pull, huh. Any comments?

Also, what's best to use when using Comet Cannon as oki? I suppose there are a good bunch of possibilities there. Right?

[excelence]

Question about crouching combos

5b>5cc>214ac~b>2a>5b>6a>BBS(3)>665d>.... <- is it possible to do 214ac~b pick up at this point, since the push back is pretty brutal?

thanks in advance.

[kotokot]

KazenBusou

6A AA CH>66A>2D>66 2C>214A~C~B>etc, midscreen to corner about 3200 afair.

or try 2D>66 5CC> j.B>j.D>2C>236A~D if you close to corner.

excelence

i think possible, but you can 66214A~C~B. But proration could be too bad.

[KazenBusou]

KazenBusou

6A AA CH>66A>2D>66 2C>214A~C~B>etc, midscreen to corner about 3200 afair.

or try 2D>66 5CC> j.B>j.D>2C>236A~D if you close to corner.

Thanks a lot! Will try that.

Looking for stuff to do with 50% Heat, I've been trying- failing at this: (Midscreen, it says)

*B+C > 214A~A > 5B > 6A > BBS > 66 5D > 214A~C~B > 5CC > j.B > j.D > 66 5CC > j.CC > 623C~D [3810/36]

I have no idea how to connect BBS with 5D. Makoto stays on the BBS animation for too long before being able to move. What am I doing wrong here?

[Bibiquadium]

I presume its the one from my video, you have to be really quick on it, else they will tech inside your BBS.

Misread it, wait just a little more after 214A~ since if you do it too quickly you'll get a much lower wall bounce making it extremely hard to link your 5D, so yeah delay your A~A a bit.

[Domethieus]

Think I can remove the *WIP* on this thread now? Since it only needs updates on combos and it has a fairly decent amount of combos on it lol

[kotokot]

Thanks a lot! Will try that.

Looking for stuff to do with 50% Heat, I've been trying- failing at this: (Midscreen, it says)

*B+C > 214A~A > 5B > 6A > BBS > 66 5D > 214A~C~B > 5CC > j.B > j.D > 66 5CC > j.CC > 623C~D [3810/36]

I have no idea how to connect BBS with 5D. Makoto stays on the BBS animation for too long before being able to move. What am I doing wrong here?

waste of heat i think. Go for standart midscreen 214A~A>6A>2D with PF ender, will get 4k~4.5k dmg and bit more meter. In corner 6A>5D>etc or 214A~D>5B>6A/5CC.

for corner i started using B+C>214A~D>5B>6A>2D>j.D>2C>236A~D>6A>5D>5CC>ender. About 3850 dmg and 40 heat with dp ender. Other ways like 5CC>5D or 5CC>2D is much harder and difference in damage is about 50-100.

[Bibiquadium]

It may be a waste of heat, personally I never use that mid screen grab combo but it's still a good thing to practice BBS combos no matter their circumstances so that it happens naturally afterwards. Because I believe the 214A~A 6A 2D almost does the same damage meter less.

[KazenBusou]

wait just a little more after 214A~ since if you do it too quickly you'll get a much lower wall bounce making it extremely hard to link your 5D, so yeah delay your A~A a bit.

Funnily enough, if I do it as fast as I can, the easier it goes, actually. If I do it immediately after the grab, the wall bounce is so high the huge punch barely hits the foe, leaving enough room to connect the 5D.

waste of heat i think. Go for standart midscreen 214A~A>6A>2D with PF ender, will get 4k~4.5k dmg and bit more meter. In corner 6A>5D>etc or 214A~D>5B>6A/5CC.

for corner i started using B+C>214A~D>5B>6A>2D>j.D>2C>236A~D>6A>5D>5CC>ender. About 3850 dmg and 40 heat with dp ender. Other ways like 5CC>5D or 5CC>2D is much harder and difference in damage is about 50-100.

Speaking of PF ender, I find it quite hard to connect it after the j.D, even in the corner. Is it a matter of how high in the air Makoto is?

Thanks, guys. Playing Makoto seems like a less impossible dream now.