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AchedSphinx

[P4A] Aigis vs Mitsuru

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I'm starting the match-up threads to give a basic rundown of each character Aigis has to face. Please note this is a work in progress and I would be grateful to receive any feedback on errors I've made or things that are incorrect. This information isn't my own, I've gotten it from other sources, and part of it is my overall assessment.

Matchup Ranking:

The Enemy's Assessment:

Overview

General tips
  • Due to Mitsuru’s good range normals and Coup Droit, along with her persona attacks, going into Orgia Mode can be difficult.
    Aigis can punish a low altitude j.B by dashing and doing 5a.
    Distance yourself in the air, her j.A can defeat jump ins, and be cautious of her j.C. Watch out for her 2B as well when jumping in.
    You cannot punish Coup Droit B or SB, perhaps with IB it becomes possible.


Close Range
  • Mitsuru’s typically use Coup Droit to close the distance followed by 5AA. Aigis can use 2A in between the 5A and 5AA to escape pressure.


Medium Range
  • Mitsuru’s 5A is very good. To safely mode change into Orgia mode, do so after 5B, 5C, or 2A+B (sweep).
    Can backdash to distance self when Mitsuru does Coup Droit A.
    If you block her 5A and plan to punish with 5D, instead go for j.C.


Far Range
  • Be wary of Mitsuru’s long range persona attacks. You don’t want to get hit by Marin Karin, as Aigis is very SP dependant for her stronger combos. Be cautious of using 2B, as Mitsuru can Coup Droit B it on block and close the distance immediately. She can also do Coup Droit SB, so be wary using 2B.


Air-to-Air
  • Be careful of Mitsuru’s j.A, can use j.2D to counter, but be wary of using it because of persona breaks.


Ground-to-Air
  • If Mitsuru is in the air, 2B is one of the best options to use, mainly because it allows easy change mode. If Mitsuru is running away, you can do j.A into Megido to set up a combo.


Air-to-Ground
Aigis j.B is her go to move for air to ground. Throwing it out isn’t something you should auto-pilot however. When done, make sure you’re at the highest point as possible to avoid Mitsuru’s anti-air 2B.

If Cornered
If Mitsuru has you pinned in the corner, don’t bother DPing, low-guard until a throw or All-out-attack occurs, and use that as a means of escape. For 5AA > Coup Droit B, the safest way to escape would be Quick Escape to remove yourself out the corner. Can do 2A to counter Mitsuru’s sweep feint.

Reversal
Getsu-ei is Mitsuru's DP. It has a huge vertical and horizonal hitbox, making it difficult or impossible to cross over her to punish it. The DP moves her toward you and she jumps a bit off the ground. It is punishable on block. Best ways to bait it out are simple pokes.

Good Tools For The Match Up

[*]2B

[*]Orgia Mode

[*]j.C

[*]5A

[*]5B

Things To Look Out For

[*]Coup Droit B

[*]Her Normals

[*]Her Persona long range normals

[*]j.B, aka instant overhead

Conclusion

[*]Tough fight. You won't be able to dictate the pace as much as you'd like and her normals have far greater range than Aigis. Be careful when you're counter attacking and be mindful of Coup Droit. Once on the offense, don't let up, her DP is good but you can safely bait with 2A and gain big damage. This is probably Aigis' worse match-up, fighting fundamentals will be greatly needed to win.

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I played some of this match over the weekend and got really irritated by Mitsuru DP so I went home and ground out some DP safe stuff, at least on oki you should almost never have to sit back and bait DP

this is highly unorganized and people who have been following the character closely probably already have noticed these things but it might help some players

Aigis can do DP-safe overheads off 236D knockdowns pretty easily, she can do safe jumps off neutral jump with jB 5B (neutral jump, deep 4jB 5B) with j2B 2A, even do safe jump instant overhead (input looks like 236D, 64jB as opponent techs), you can do orgia dash j2B 2A and make it DP-safe as well but it seems a little trickier

in situations where Aigis ends a combo or sweep in 22B to enter OM (such as 5AAA JC jB OTG 22B) you can do 22B 64jB

I need to do a lot more experimentation here but in non-oki situations 5B 6jB cannot be DP'd if Mitsu normal blocks. If she IBs she can DP it. There are probably a lot of situations like this outside of knockdowns, gotta look in a little more

for newer players that may not know what a safe jump is, with these setups if Mitsu quick techs and reversal DPs, Aigis' jump-in will whiff and you will block the DP. If Mitsu just blocks or blocks incorrectly, you wiil go into mixup/pressure/combo

:ballAI::ballAI::ballAI:

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Thank you guys for the information. Mitsuru seems like she could be THE most difficult matchup for Aigis. Then again, Mitsuru is just downright nasty, period.

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Does Aigis have a good answer to Coup Droit B from far away? It seems to stuff every jump attack and it goes under 2B. Usually I just set up mortar or react to it with 236236D.

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Does Aigis have a good answer to Coup Droit B from far away? It seems to stuff every jump attack and it goes under 2B. Usually I just set up mortar or react to it with 236236D.
236236D is a pretty strong answer IMO. Free 2000-ish damage? Yes please. Especially if you see them charging it, trying to be all clever.

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Fuuuuuuck this bitch. Hated her in P3 and even more in this game.

I don't have a solid game plan in this match up other than hope the Mitsuru does unsafe(lol her DP and what else?) stuff and I go in to punish or hope she does a bad droit and hopefully be close for 5A to change momentum.

Lulzy thing I enjoy doing is to AoA quite a bit in this match up(even though we'll get destroyed by 5A). If they're retarded enouh to charge Coup B in range of our AoA. AoAing her sweep feint is funny too, it would beat out her flow chart 4/5/6B or grab.

Yea... I got nothing. Just gimmicks. I haven't been able to figure out the 2B OS/whiff thing against her DP as well.

If you block her 5A and plan to punish with 5D, instead go for j.C

:psyduck:

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I actually like that AoA idea, I'm going to try it next time I'm getting bodied by her. Apparently from what I heard, Lord Knight thinks this matchup is in Aigis's favor, I don't see it. She's not as bad as Teddie IMO, but probably second worst, it's just too hard to get in on her, it's like a fucking wall, even in Orgia.

I heard something about Aigis's 2B having some sort of invincibility, maybe that's a part of it? Anyways, #1 priority is to always evasive under her after blocking her DP or punish with a 5A as she's coming down, unless you were spot on with the DP bait and instant-blocked it, you're going to be able to use any move that's slower than 5A to punish it before she reaches the ground and Bufu's your ass.

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Funny, I just starting throwing out AOA today to slow her barrage down and it actually bought me some breathing room. Any breakthrough options for stopping the her basics like 5B > 2A+B or droit? I've been able to bait, block, and 5AAA droit if it's not space perfectly but I dunno if that's guaranteed.

When cornered, I've also been attempting escapes w/sj.turn.236A/B. The worst is when you roll thru her and eat 5B FC or bufu from behind.

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I've been watching a friend of mine suffer in this Match up, heck, I've messed around with Aigis a bit to see just how bad it is, and I won't lie, this MU is annoying. I think the one person that has a good idea on how to handle the MU is Kurumster. His gameplan at UFGT9 make the MU look a little more bearable, he doesn't come out on top but he does a ton of things to manage the match up and it shows:

I hope this can spark up any ideas on how to deal with Mitsuru.

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I think I have a better idea on how to fight the character. One of the main mistakes I was making in that fight though is full screen orgia activate. Yes, it does make her run away and get her to the corner. The problem is, by the time you get her there you have been poked out of the air a number of times and you've lost all your meter. The ground dash approach can be low profiled with her sweep (if you're using j.c as you should) and the aerial approach loses to j.a. One of the easier ways to deal with people who stop your approaches like that is to just straight up megido them, but Mitsuru has some good pokes that reach too far and will likely stop it (just like Elizabeth does). A way to deal with low profile sweep is to dp it. I didn't do it in that video because I did not think of it until I reflected on the match.

Luckily, Mitsuru has one of the easiest dps to deal with. We don't have to do anything other than just straight up safejump it, no shenanigans. The real problem is her pokes, her persona buttons that snipe us out of activate and droit. She can stop us at any time with 25 meter whenever she sees us dashing at her with an ex droit. Typically, I like to stay far back and jump up and down to bait droit (in or out of orgia). Her buttons are better than yours in every way. I like to 2b people in neutral when they're close to me as a get off me move. It almost never gets rolled because they're too close to react to it. This works against almost ALL the cast, but Mitsuru just keeps you at a range where you will get poked out of doing 2b. You end up being forced to block until you dp her or break a throw. Sometimes you can block long enough where they freeze up to try and bait a dp and that's where you also get a turn. It works a lot against good players.

If Aigis had better ground game I think some matches would be a little less suffering when it comes to that aspect of the matchup. It kinda hurts when she's fighting against characters who can combat her j.c very well air to air (Teddie, Chie, Mitsuru, Liz).

A few of the basic do nots in this matchup are:

Do not activate orgia in the range of he ice move that snipes you out of the air

Do not activate orgia if she is charging droit

Do not deactivate in her face without using a 5c ender that gives big space to you

Do not bother approaching her air to air in orgia

Do not bother trying to anti air her unless she is way in the air (even then you're better off just doing 5D [while you're not in orgia I mean])

Some Do's

- Use j.c a lot. Regardless of her j.a and 5a being able to break it, it still leads to opportunities where if blocked you can start mounting your offense and if hit (counterhit) you can get up to 4k damage.

- Air turn dash j.c is very good for dealing with her 2b. It's one of those that doesn't hit behind, making it very easy to counterhit.

- Chase her with super jump a while in orgia. It lets you use other moves if blocked and is easy to confirm if you land the hit. It also matches up well vs her j.a if you're approaching from below her.

I think the combination of losing 2b in neutral (as a get off me) and the fact that she can fight you air to air makes this match a bit problematic. I don't think it's something unbearable or something to really cry about. It's just something to adapt to (like the Shabrys matchup). Knowing that your ground game is suffering also doesn't help. The best way I can say to approach this matchup is to just stay patient and you'll get your chance. If you don't play disciplined (block, properly play neutral, wait your turn, play clean) you're not going to win.

TL;DR - If you notice Mitsuru is laming you out (like LK did me), just try and find a way to approach without orgia and activate it when you've closed the space. I don't think we can fight her without mastering how to use the shield (5D). LK is also just a better player, I wasn't ready to fight him.

I hope to be a bit more practiced up if I get the opportunity to play him again.

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I hope this can spark up any ideas on how to deal with Mitsuru.

It's a matchup that will really test your patience. Orgia movement needs to be on point. You're definitely not able to approach in any linear fashion whatsoever, so you need to vary it up in the neutral game. Double jump/hover for the Mitsuru players that like to 2b antiair works well, or fly over and around it. Mix up your boost angles and height, with 6/3 dashes, double jumps, etc. Being mashy with your supers / AoA can work well if you need to bet it, but that's crappy advice :P (Such as roll -> super as seen in the latest Koichi set in the video thread.)

In my opinion it's really hard to deal with her without orgia, so instead I try manuever and get in vs. the lame stuff, because personally I can't block for too long against her or I'm going to get killed..that's a personal fault though, if you have the defense by all means

Double mode change combos are also really helpful here because you need all the orgia meter you can get.

That's just the neutral game though, I feel like LK is the only one who knows how to really play lame against Aigis in orgia

Once you get the knockdown, you know what to do.

I guess it's also important to stress that you ~really~ need to be able to confirm off all random hits, but this is just something for Aigis in general. The knockdown is really important. If your friend has videos or questions or something we could probably help more

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Since CW I've been trying to find ways to deal with this MU too. low j.2B is a surprisingly good tool against mitsuru's that want to run in once Aigis lands since it's active for so long. j.2B also counts as a projectile and not a head move so if spaced, it'll be AAs.

Another underused technique in the MU is BDC. Mitsuru's 5A is only active for one frame so if Aigis has the read on it while in orgia, she can backdash through it then before leaving the ground, cancel the backdash into a C megido to punish.

Also, Kurum, EX Droit can be punished even on air IB.

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Since CW I've been trying to find ways to deal with this MU too. low j.2B is a surprisingly good tool against mitsuru's that want to run in once Aigis lands since it's active for so long. j.2B also counts as a projectile and not a head move so if spaced, it'll be AAs.

Another underused technique in the MU is BDC. Mitsuru's 5A is only active for one frame so if Aigis has the read on it while in orgia, she can backdash through it then before leaving the ground, cancel the backdash into a C megido to punish.

Also, Kurum, EX Droit can be punished even on air IB.

I don't think I've actually heard of this before, can you elaborate on this?

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Aigis' orgia backdash, like her forward dash can be canceled into any ground special on the first few frames of startup. it's hard to do it with C megido since you have to do a lengthy motion in such a short amount of time but if you want to see the concept, cancel an orgia backdash into a cannon. The motion for such is 2144A or B while in orgia mode. you will she the backdash startup then the cannon. Unfortunately, the invincibility doesn't carry over like it does with Slayer's backdash in GG but can still be useful against moves like Mits' 5A because the active frames are so short.

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So avoiding her 5A range is integral, but what do you do about Mitsurus that get a life lead and then park themselves in the corner to get the win through time out? It's happened a lot in ranked. They won't come out due to 2B and the fact that I've taken a few persona cards AAing them, but attempting to go in just gets me blown up. Vulcan's slight push backwards is helpful for pressuring them into touching a button, but doing it close enough to hit a crouching Mitsuru means eating Droit on landing; Cannon isn't a crouch, so that puts Aigis back in range of eating a 5A; going in from the air is all kinds of bad... when they won't even play footsies, what do you do? They know they're safe from Gatling, they're holding charge for the moment you come in range (and they know they can bypass 5D to tap Aigis), and they'll AA if you attempt to tri-jump in for a boost j.B overhead (or just get anywhere near them).

At 100 meter, Goddess Shield + OMC gets me in, but that's all meter (pre-Awakening) and I've only made it work when at full Orgia and able to do an immediate overhead to start mixup. It's a huge gamble but it's all I've found once Mitsuru gets distance and just parks herself to Bufudyne or SB Droit on reaction to... everything.

I haven't had problems pressuring her, even without Orgia, if I'm the one to put her in the corner, as our jump combos can easily lock her down long enough for Orgia recharge.

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