[CP] Jin Gameplay Discussion

[shtkn]

yeah, i couldn't get the double jump loop to work. maybe on fatal? would that even be worth doing?

[Moy_X7]

I just tried it off a Fatal and while it does work, the timing is pretty damn strict so yeah, I personally don't think it's worth it anymore.

[shtkn]

it might be worth it vs the charaters you can't do the normal fatal loop on. i'll have to try it when i get home

[xHarukashii]

I love jin's new dash cancel off his throw.. TIME FOR GIMMICKS.

[Dawn of Musou]

Haha it's taking me some time to get used to. He's able to move a lot sooner compared to B Musou so I gotta delay the follow-up or get the air hit.  He also moves closer so I gotta get used to doing B+C>66>j.2C>j.C>stuff from a different angle while delaying it lol. Think I'll still be using B musou after grab until I get used to dash cancel. Also 6C> charged 236D only works in the corner but tbh I think using 6D does the same thing while being meterless so I don't really see why it would be used.

 

This 623D nerf hurts though, can barely get damage off it and going into 214D requires stricter timing aka going to be impossible online.

[xHarukashii]

OH GOD THANK YOU FOR MY GRAB DASH CANCEL BACK MORI! BBCP 1.1: Jin Kisaragi grab dash cancel gimmick's study-  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnrffX9MahE&feature=youtu.be 

[cadacus_ater]

My first impressions of CP 1.1 Jin:

 

We can still hit 4k off of 5C crouching CH meterless, but you need to execute it super fast and microdash like a boss, lol.

[CO] CH 5C > 6B > 5C > 2C > 6C > 2D, j.2C > j.C, 66 2B > 5C > 2C > 3C > 214B~C

 

6A CH can still combo into 5B but you might need to delay your 5B input a split second more or you could end up skipping the 5B input.

 

Throw > DC seems better for using gimmicks than boosting damage.  It does open up this corner combo for around 3160 or so (thanks to xlolxlolx):

Throw > DC > 2C > TK j.214C, 3C > 214B, 5B(1) > 5C > 22C, 5B(1) > 22C [Couldn't get 5B(2) > 5C > 22C > 5B(1) > 22C to work]

 

There is a more damaging TK j.214C corner throw combo with a single 22C for oki, but it is very very hard.

Have to catch them with 6C practically as they land and then time the 6B perfectly (probably was possible with musou cancel, but as I said...it is HARD).

Throw > DC > delay 6C > 6B > TK j.214C, 3C > 214B, 66 5B(2) > 22C [3204, 23]

 

Yes, j.2C > j.C, 66 5C still works.  I can get j.2C > j.C > dj.2C to combo (testing on Ragna) but the following j.C won't combo afaik.

 

 

If you want a feel of how much extra time we get with Throw > DC

Throw > DC > 6C > 623C > 5B is possible in the corner, lol (not optimal though from what I can tell).

 

 

Bottom line...Jin just got slightly nerfed in damage...he is still pretty much the same as before.

[shtkn]

argh guess i was wrong on fatal loops working on kokonoe, couldn't get it working today oh well.

[Jyosua]

So it looks like this is highly character specific, but 5D Fatal > 214D > 66 (5B or 5C) > 2C > j.2C > j.C > 66 5B > 2C > j.2C > j.C > 66 5B > 5C > 2C > 3C > 214B > 5B > 5C > Sekkajin appears to still work.

 

I couldn't get it to work on Kagura though. Ragna works with 5B. Jin will work with the first microdash being 5C, but the rest 5Bs.

[Dawn of Musou]

OH GOD THANK YOU FOR MY GRAB DASH CANCEL BACK MORI! BBCP 1.1: Jin Kisaragi grab dash cancel gimmick's study-  https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QnrffX9MahE&feature=youtu.be 

That was some huge scumbaggery lol, thanks for the ideas. School needs to stop interrupting my lab time so I can test more stuff out.

 

[Jyosua]

Oh yeah, apparently not all Jin players know this: When Kagura has already blocked something (he's in his blocking animation), your 5A will not whiff, so you can use 2A > 5A > Throw to TRM him.

[Jourdal]

This happened...some of the 236D stuff seems a tad worth it?

http://youtu.be/W41RRkajzPM

[stickystaines]

About the 5D fatal combo posted above; you can replace 2C with 5C and it will make it possible/easier to do it against some characters like noel and kagura.

 

This lists the characters on the initial attacks after 5D 214D, so anyone with dash 5C 2C still needs to do 5B 2C on the second one. Dash 5C 2C does more damage, but i'll list all the characters that you can do 5B 2C on as well if people like to keep their combos as consistent as possible. Bold means you dont have to do the slight delay on j2C to get it to work. Makes the combo a bit easier.

 

5C 2C:

Relius

Azrael

Amane

Jin

Arakune

Rachel

Valkenhayn

Bang

 

5B 2C delay j2C:

Mu*

Relius*

Makoto

Noel

Taokaka

Hazama*

Hakumen*

Ragna*

Litchi*

Tager*

Terumi*

Azrael*

Izayoi

Amane*

Jin (you dont have to delay if you dont dash after 214D)

Arakune*

Carl*

Tsubaki*

Rachel

Valkenhayn*

Bang

Nu

 

5B 5C delay j2C:

Noel*

Mu*

Relius*

Taokaka

Hazama*

Hakumen*

Kagura

Licthi*

Tager*

Terumi*

Azrael*

Izayoi*

Amane*

Jin*

Arakune*

Carl*

Tsubaki*

Rachel

Valkenhayn*

Nu

 

Cant get it to work either way on:

Kokonoe

Platinum

Bullet

 

Let me know if anyone else's findings are different

[drzero7]

BTW, did Jin's combo change at all, or still the same?

[Dawn of Musou]

Overall mostly the same. Combos off 623D and 214D are shorter and you can do somewhat different stuff with Throw>dash cancel but his combos are overall the same.

[xlolxlolx]

corner d dp>6c>ice car>5b(1)>sekka>5b(2)>sekka

midscreen d dp>ex ice car>dash 2b>5b(2)>5c>3c>ice car 

midscreen to corner d dp>dash ex ice car>dash 5c>sekka>2b>sekka works, if youre too far you can just do dash 6c>sekka or 6c>c dp, if youre closer you can do some other stuff but it doesnt really matter

midscreen to corner/corner ex ice car>dash 6c>ice car>5c>sekka>5b(2)>sekka

 

new corner throw combos straight up dc tk hizansen seems to be the most reliable and does enough dmg to make it worth going for on chars that you dont need to delay it on(havent tested on everyone)

throw>dc>tk hizansen>3c>ice car>5b(2)>sekka>5b(2)>sekka 

tager and rachel only throw>dc>tk hizansen>dash 5c>6c>6d>5b(1)>5c>sekka>5b>sekka,easier version throw>dc>tk hizansen>dash 5c>6c>6d>5b(1)>sekka>5b(2)>sekka, need to delay tk hizansen on rachel

 

 

charged ex fireball enders:

 

for situations youre too slightly too far from corner off of crouching hit normal starters

stuff>5c>2c>6c>2d>6c>ice car>delay 5c>6c>charged ex fireball 

 

off c dp inside corner

ch c dp>dash 5b(1)>5c>6c>delay 2d>6c>charged ex fireball 

 

ch b dp at awkward height/distance

ch b dp>(5c)>dash 6c>6d>6c>ice car>delay 5c>6c>charged ex fireball

[RifleAvenger]

Jin

- Aim was to make Jin's neutral game a little better

- "Hishouken" now flies faster and on counter hit it downs the opponent.

- 5D and 2D are special cancelable

- 2D is jump cancelable on hit. This increases Jin's combo variations.

- "Musou Senshouzan" and "Sekkajin" are now more difficult to continue from

- Now Jin needs to use his 6C or D Specials in a combo to deal big damage

Changes incoming in CP2

They really seem to want people to use ice swords more often. I hope that "downing" the opponent won't mean that it's impossible to follow up on a counter hit sword now.

[shtkn]

5D special cancel!? haven't had that since CT lol. not sure how useful it'd be though...

2D special cancel might be useful for trying to sneak in a charged 236D

[mAc Chaos]

i dont understand why they removed the different ice sword variations in the first place

[RifleAvenger]

Besides possibly the sword change, I don't see how any of these fit into the first line of "improving his neutral."

[darkasjinksu§]

His 5D could also be special cancelable on block, giving him a safe auto-pilot (5D-Hishouken). I'd say that would also be a buff to his neutral.

[Jyosua]

Changes incoming in CP2

They really seem to want people to use ice swords more often. I hope that "downing" the opponent won't mean that it's impossible to follow up on a counter hit sword now.

 

I'm betting you'll just have to do an OTG combo.

 

I'm really happy to hear 5D special cancel is back after all these years. XD

[Dawn of Musou]

Now we just need 6A special cancel, Mori make it happen pls

 

Special and Jump cancelable 2D, wonder if we can do anything new with that? Probably not since we've been jumping after 2D in midscreen combos anyways lol.

 

Wondering how the Musou and Sekka nerfs are gonna work and if it's gonna change our corner combos.

 

Also wondering if the description of 6C and EX moves means they got a damage buff? That'd be nice.

[RifleAvenger]

Jin

- 6C on hit causes spin state, guess no bounce?

- 623D, 2nd hit cause wall bounce

- OD Hiyoku, no visual change

More changes. "6C causes spin state," wut? Maybe this means that rather than 214B and 22C being worse themselves, it's harder to use them in combos because it's harder for Jin to launch the opponent?

[Dawn of Musou]

That 6C change feels like the weirdest thing. Depending on the distance and hitstun of the spin, it'll either not have too much of an effect or change a lot of Jin's combos.