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zeth07

[CP] Azrael vs. Kagura Match-up Discussion

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Discussion about the Kagura match-up goes here.

First post may be edited as important information arises. If any information seems wrong please feel free to correct it, hopefully with actual proof / examples. Anyone is free to post info as long as it is constructive and helps with the discussion of the match-up.

  • Will post info much later after the game is out and matches have been played.

Notable Matches:

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Might be worth nothing, if Kagura tries to approach with his 6D~C, you can Valiant(charged) to punish, no CH though sadly.

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Found a couple of silly things as far as beating flash kick goes, one is definitely more practical though.

This particular option is definitely a harder 'read' than the other, and is only really applicable during pressure: do some normal that is special cancellable into hornet bunker, then special cancel into hornet bunker and hold as long as you need, though once the first hit of the flash kick is auto-guarded, you can release D, you'll go under the rest of it for free and get a counter hit. This is better to do if you don't have a lower weak point in my opinion, just cos it's easier to confirm. Off counter-hit hornet bunker launch (w/o weakpoint), you can follow up with 2C 3D into stuff or go straight into rekkas if you want to. If you do have the lower weakpoint applied, you have to wait until they land until you release D, otherwise they'll float too high for you to combo off the chase.

The other option works in both pressure and as a meaty option and it involves 6A. You can either cancel into 6A from something like 5B or 2A or you can do it after blocked 236A during pressure, or you can do it after D knockdowns. So usually if you clash the DP with 6A, most of your other options, including doing nothing, lose to the rest of the flash kick. However, you can special-cancel the clash into DUMP and the auto-guard will guard the rest of the flash kick for you, and the move is slow enough to where you'll land at around the same time they do and score a CH. The follow-ups to this are actually better so long as you have a weakpoint, which you usually will. Off 22C dump, you can usually only follow up with 5B or 2B, but off raw dump, especially CH, you can go into 5C, and from there into rekkas/TC>valiant. Plus DUMP is a 100p1 starter, so no matter what you do, it's going to hurt.

EDIT: a couple of small caveats to this: One is that sometimes depending on how they time the flash kick, the 6A itself will be the thing that counter-hits, in which case you can probably special-cancel dash into rekkas or something. Two is that sometimes the dump will cross-up, which won't really change the combo/follow-up too much depending on what weakpoint you have applied, just be wary of this.

EDIT 2: the second option is definitely beatable if the Kagura knows to mash A after the clash. But then again, even if you auto-pilot 6A into dump, it's still very little risk, especially compared to the huge reward you get for successfully landing the DUMP counter hit.

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If you clash 6A against his DP, it might be best to 2A. You'll low profile the rest of the DP and you can punish with 5D or 5C > Valiant, depending on if you have a weakpoint.

Good stuff Bakery! Frametrapping with 6A to beat DPs in our pressure sounds really REALLY helpful. Especially when considering how many kaguras just spam that move. We should beat most mashing this way as well. No matter what you do after baiting a DP, make it hurt. If you don't take away half his health, put him in the corner, and set up unblockables afterwards, Kagura wont learn his lesson :D

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Yeah, I was going to mention 2A as well, since it beats/trades/goes under their A mash depending on what point in the flash kick you clash with. I'm almost starting to like the hornet option a little more even if it is far more ballsy/troll, just cos I don't have to deal with the uncertainty of clash.

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I just wanna let you guys know Kagura's 5A is really good at anti-airing and j.A is really good as a air to air.

Seriously you eat those two moves and you are in serious danger so do the usual and always try to cross up j.B direct jump in's are a no.

You can beat some of his stance follow ups with delay backdash and growler so its not so bad if he stance rush on you.

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Lol Azrael's 5A and 5B are better for anti-airing imo, and are far more braindead. Same goes for Azrael j.B with air-to-air. My friend who plays Kagura said this regarding the Hakumen match-up, but I think it can be applied somewhat to playing vs. Kagura in general: "When you see me not crouching, that is your cue to air dash on me." I respect this cos flash kick is one of the best anti-airs in the game, and is also a relatively safe reversal. Why would Kagura stand during my blockstrings ever? To block overheads? He could just flash kick me and get oki. Granted, he won't flash kick on reaction to overhead every time, but there's only so many things Azrael can reliably gatling into overheads off of (2A/5A and 5B/5BB being the main ones, 2B > 5D if you want to kill yourself I guess), so I imagine a good player will catch onto this and punish accordingly.

I'm not too worried about neutral. 6A will beat or go through most of whatever he can do, and the hitbox is good enough to beat stuff like 2D~B/2D~A. 5C is good enough at certain distances to stuff stance rushes entirely, though Kagura gets forced back a little too far for the 5C > 6C fatal counter combo to work. If I really want to troll, there's distances where I can hornet bunker on reaction, and the damage from CH'ing that is at least 4k.

This doesn't come without hitches, though. There will be lots of instances where stuff will just trade. This matchup is kinda hell for both Azrael and Kagura: Azrael can't do some of his better mix-ups as freely as usual, Kagura's sonic boom oki/neutral gets ignored by Growler, etc.

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If they attempt sonic boom oki, you can, of course, Growler. Just be prepared to block afterwards, because they'll be on top of you very soon.

 

Backdash is always a good option to get out of pretty much most things Kagura can do, there are a few moves that will get you though if you do it every time. Is there anything in particular that he's doing that's getting you?

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Mostly that move where he changes sides. I can Growler that but it's by read.

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Ah, that would be his 6D~B, I think it's called Dragon's Mirage. Yeah, I think you can just backstep out of that, might want to do some tests to see if spacing changes the outcome any, but I think you can pretty safely dodge out of it.

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Kagura may be a very bad character but like most characters can catch you with alot of gimmicky shit. And what's worse is that flash kick which is very good in neutral and while he's being pressured.

 

From my exp when most Kaguras flash kick you without it being a CH then you can immediately tech towards him and drop with J.B as long as you commit to the guess that it will hit him. 80% of the time I've tried this I get a free mid screen combo.

 

Edit-  This is not viable anymore in extend, kagura will short dp you if you try this.

 

Kagura can command grab you, overhead you, and has a very deceptive low move that makes you think it's the over head when it really isn't. Dragon's mirage also negates ANY wake up growler. Do not wake up growler as defense it will not work against this. Corner combos from this guy really hurt so you need to know what DOESN'T work while you're in it.

 

Growlering the sonic boom he does in neutral is also very good because of gimmicks you can do to throw his advancement off the absorbing invulnerability. I usually just buffer growler again. Don't get too growler happy though because Kagura also has that dragon move that works just as good as Ragna's hells fang if not, better, and will CH you. Knowing your spacing with Kagura during neutral is important.

 

Most Kagura players like to throw out the crouch stab move. this does not work to box jumps, and will end with a huge corner carry combo.

 

That flash kick is harder to punish than other DP/Kicks so you should never try to 3D or 6D to punish..just 3C. Other than being wary of all of the above especially flash kick just play as Azrael usually plays; Kagura has a very tough time with this character.

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