[Xrd] I-No vs. Ky Kiske

[Hollysmoke]

• Use this thread to discuss the Ky Kiske matchup.
• If the matchup is giving you trouble, check to see if this post already contains info which will help you. If not, be as specific as possible when asking for help and others will be glad to give advice.
• Please focus more heavily on discussing how to play the matchup properly than who is at advantage/disadvantage.
• This post will be updated to collect useful info over time.

Round Start:

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Neutral:

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Offense:

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Defense:

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Punishes:

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Combo Notes:

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[Blackalpha]

I play regularly against a Ky so I can shed some knowledge in this matchup. I'll edit this post as things come to me and remember, here is what I have so far though.

 

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- Full screen you want to use note, definitely a safe time in this matchup to do so. 

- In regards to the note, if you can get it off earlier so the note wracks up more hits on it, you can go through one of Ky's fireballs and it keeps going

- Note from full screen that has at least enough travel time for 4 hits is excellent if Ky does a CSE, it trades with the CSE for 3 hits, and the 4th and 5th will continue on. It can surprise the Ky player

 

- You can 6P through fireballs! 

 

- If you get hit by a CLOSE stun dipper from Ky (236k move where he slides low and slashes you twice) the first hit will hit, but the 2nd will not combo, so make sure you are in downback even if you see you are getting hit by the first slash, because you will be able to block the 2nd one and punish.

 

- Stun dipper and Greed Sever are both punishable on block, but depending on the distance when you blocked them will determine how much of a punish you can get. Close up you should go for a launch combo (c.S > 6P > 5H > stuff) but further away this won't connect so read the distance before punishing!

 

- HCL destroys any seal Ky puts up, great option to use in neutral

 

- HCL is another good tool in this matchup, you can catch him when he throws a fireball or even a CSE (charged stun edge, 3 hitting fireball). In this version, if you hit him while CSE is in startup, it completely disappears. Don't be scared about trading with this anymore as you can beat it clean now.

- Also watch out for using HCL too much though, Ky has a clear counter to this if he reads it with doing stun dipper. Make it safe with a YRC though if you are unsure and then you can block the stun dipper and punish.

 

- if a Ky is going for a f.S > fireball blockstring, it is not tight, you can STBT inbetween the f.S and the fireball.

- Can counter poke with 6P if you're expecting a f.S also

 

- Have I mentioned how awesome STBT S and HS version is in this matchup? In neutral you can go right under any fireballs and close the gap to start your pressure. Free note oki pressure after a STBT-H lands too.

 

- Ky definitely has the upper hand in the neutral for this, so when you get an opportunity to knock him down with an HCL, STBT, or have him block notes, you absolutely want to go in and stay on him.

 

- On defense, just block low and react to overheads. His only overheads are his 5D and Greed Sever, and both are blockable on reaction with experience. Greed sever leads to big damage now in the corner so make sure you pay extra attention if your back is up against the wall.

 

- Ky has a good reversal DP on wakeup, so you have to watch for that sometimes. I occasionally like to do some fake hoverdashes and backdash on his wake up. His DP will completely whiff and he cant make it safe if you do that.

[choysauce]

Also establishing your safe jump vs DPs is very strong. hoverdash > hoverdash > super low j.K (so cheap, love it =D). The best answer for Ky here is blitz shielding. It's easy to mash BS on wakeup, so don't go for this option every time. Empty jump throw or low to beat the BS. Still good advantage here

 

I also heard you can low profile his DP w/ 2K & 2S, but I haven't seen it or been able to learn the timing yet. So it sounds like I-no should most definitely win after a knockdown

 

Greed sever is -13 on block so in most cases it seems that a 2S(9f) > HCL will work every time if you time it correctly. But not sure how the framedata changes depending on how deep the blocked GS is.

 

Wakeup Super w/ I-no doesn't seem like a good answer if Ky has 50% heat. Reading the wiki, Ride the Lightning is 100% projectile invul & hit invul f1-25. So he can ride through Longing desperation super on reaction to the super freeze i'm sure.

[Vegeas]

Matchup is f*****g tough. Stun Edge YRC and he gets in for free. Then the enchanted version of stun edge is even worse, especially when they use it in a block string. When I try to Stroke the Big Tree to low profile it I get poked out.

I just find myself blocking from one corner of the screen all the way to the other. And it's not just Ky it's just about the whole roster. Feels bad man.

[PacStrife]

What your describing probably is caused by a lack of good FDing on defense. They can definitely reset their pressure with stun edge YRC, but there is a hole there to get out with a smart jump, blitz, STBT, Dead Angle, ect.

But really you have to FD some characters to get out of their pressure or IB to create gaps that way.

[felirx]

If you're also really passive, Ky can just go for 6K or 6H and reset pressure all day. It's up to you to FD to make a gap, throw/jump/stuff 6K, IB and 1frame jump out etc etc etc.

 

Guilty gear is all about active defense. Slayer will press buttons forever, Leo forever, Sol forever and so on. It's up to you to stop them from pressing those buttons.

[choysauce]

Made a note for quirky matchup specific things. Trying to train up for EVO with this, and also share. Let me know if there's any info you think that should be added or modified.

 

Blockstrings are probably not 100% correct for what Ky players usually do, but hoping to get the jist of what options we have to punish.

 

http://www.evernote.com/l/Ae86gT5NSAZKo4elZla0yvZ_dS7z693F4Cw/