[CT-CSE] Critique my Jin Thread. Post videos of yourself playing and get advice

[eQualz]

If you catch with 2D as your starter, do not add that 5B in there. Just go from dashing 6B straight into Sekkajin, since you'll get more damage that way.

That is sooo not true.

[danteMdie]

I don't use 214A in blockstrings. Used it once just to test the opponent as a desperation move, since the round was pretty much lost.

As for j236D i never thought of it. The move does seem nerfed compared to cs2 (or other character's moves just got buffed...).

" I think you have enough time to cross under when you do the 2D, so if your back is to the corner, you can put him in the corner that way"

Didn't know this. Thought i had to go for something>sekkajin>66>5C>2C>2D and only go for cross under after is, and doing this online is, uh, kind of a pain.

Anyway, thnks for the tips. I would upload some more vids, but have some technical difficulties atm.

[kirk]

Imo, Yeah you do jump and airdash around a bit too much. Those j236Ds seem off...

Don't press buttons after blocking deadspike. It's quite big on the plus.

Honestly at the beginning of the game imo,UNLESS you are totally sure of what he's going to do, it's better not to press buttons as whatever you could reach him with would lose to whatever he has at his disposal except maybe jC.

Take this with a grain of salt though as I'm not a great player and what i'm saying could be completely wrong.

Edit : What eQualz said. and you have to do a high 2d hit to crossunder afaik.

[Moy_X7]

If you catch with 2D as your starter, do not add that 5B in there. Just go from dashing 6B straight into Sekkajin, since you'll get more damage that way. I think Moy told me that you can get even more damage if you do 2D>j.2C>j.C>Sekkajin instead, but I'm not confident enough with that online to use it. Also, nice fucking 6A reset. Me gusta.

The bold text is false, you should always try to add a 5B to those 2D combos if possible. You're right on the j.2C > j.C > 66 5B/5C Sekkajin stuff though.

Examples of the optimal 2D combos mid-screen:

2D > j.2C > j.C > 66 5B > 5C > Sekkajin > 6C > 214C

2D > 66 6B > 66 5B > 5C > Sekkajin > 6C > 214C

Oh and you can't do the cross-under with 6C > 2D, it has to be off a 5C > 2C > 2D.

[Rewenger]

When you hit enemy with 2D at "medium" distance, do j.2C > j.5C > 66 > 5B > 5C > sekka > 6C > 214C. This is probably the best 2D followup possible. Also, it always works with 5C CH > 2D. Hivemind desu. =(

[Moy_X7]

As far as the actual matches go...

vs Lambda

• Try to always IB the D follow-ups (5DD, 6DD, 2DD), Lambdas will go for the D follow-ups 90% of the time. That's free meter and more time to close the distance between Lamb and you.
  
• Use TK j.236C when you're at her 5D's range, you'll go over 5D and shoot your j.236C straight at her. She'll be forced to block it if you're close enough to her.
  
• In that same note, don't be afraid to use Ice Car if you have the meter to RC; you'll punish 5D attempts if successful or you'll get in if she blocks it.
  
• Don't let yourself get bullied by 236D~C. If she does it after 236B, you have enough time to air tech and do j.236C before you touch the ground. You'll be propelled over her 236D~C due to j.236C's "kick-back".
  

I'll be honest, you did poorly against that Ragna. Bad or no hit-confirms at all, bad pressure, etc. As said before, don't let Ragna jump around on you as he pleases, DP A his ass. You did much better against that Lambda, I was like "is this the same guy?" lol.

You do jump around a lot but that's not necessarily a bad thing. These guys failed to punish your excessive jumping but people with good reaction will 5A/AA you out of your jumps like nothing. Cut down on those jump and practice better block strings.

[danteMdie]

Well, i forgot to mention that the match agains't the ragna player was like...the 10th? And the 10th loss too... But yeah, i underperformed agains't him and usually do actually.

In that session (before this match) i went for j 2C quite often but he would just "5a CH, 6B, etc etc etc".

As for blockstrings, i really have to improve a bit, but sometimes since i respect the opponent too much, i get kind of scared of doing the usual jin stuff. It's not like i don't know blockstrings, i just feel that they are going to interrupt my pressure at the very 1st chance - one of the reasons i never go for 5B>2B>5C>6D agains't them for example. Every time i tried that they would just "5A" in my face.

Oh well, better times will come. But as i start using ragna more often, i start feeling jin's nerf since CS2. When my laptop is fixed i'll upload some more stuff

[eQualz]

Sorry for the short reply earlier, most of the stuff has been said anyway by now.

Just one more thing to add as I also played one these guys. It's freaking hard to get in on Emjay but as you probably noticed, he burts as soon you get your momentum and get your stuff started so it can be easily baited. Doesn't help though that he's one of the better (if not the best) Lambda around EU. I need to look up for this guy again.

Oh and don't go tellin' me you be maining Ragna.

[Jyosua]

That is sooo not true.

The bold text is false, you should always try to add a 5B to those 2D combos if possible. You're right on the j.2C > j.C > 66 5B/5C Sekkajin stuff though.

Examples of the optimal 2D combos mid-screen:

2D > j.2C > j.C > 66 5B > 5C > Sekkajin > 6C > 214C

2D > 66 6B > 66 5B > 5C > Sekkajin > 6C > 214C

Oh and you can't do the cross-under with 6C > 2D, it has to be off a 5C > 2C > 2D.

Seriously? I could swear I got less damage when I tried that and that someone told me not to do it... disregard that, I am derp.

Yeah, I wasn't sure on that 6C>2D thing, which is why I preceded with "I think". The rest of that paragraph I was pretty certain on though.

I should add a disclaimer to things I say ~_~

[danteMdie]

Just one more thing to add as I also played one these guys. It's freaking hard to get in on Emjay but as you probably noticed, he burts as soon you get your momentum and get your stuff started so it can be easily baited. Doesn't help though that he's one of the better (if not the best) Lambda around EU. I need to look up for this guy again.

Oh and don't go tellin' me you be maining Ragna.

Yes, he's probably the best. You should play agains't Hexanoid though, his lambda is starting to kick real ass.

As for maining Ragna... Well, i play with him since CT and he was my main in the beginnings of CS1, before going to hakumen... And the jin lol.

EDIT:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NM2kqjEMqq4&feature=youtu.be

Some matches vs SliceySmashy.

You might notice i've used 2D too often (and in the wrong way), jumped too much and missed some combos... But i would still like to hear some opinions about this.

[OmegaBankai]

Yes, he's probably the best. You should play agains't Hexanoid though, his lambda is starting to kick real ass.

As for maining Ragna... Well, i play with him since CT and he was my main in the beginnings of CS1, before going to hakumen... And the jin lol.

EDIT:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NM2kqjEMqq4&feature=youtu.be

Some matches vs SliceySmashy.

You might notice i've used 2D too often (and in the wrong way), jumped too much and missed some combos... But i would still like to hear some opinions about this.

From what i see, your jins okay, i like some of the things you do in here, but you need to stop wasting good meter on dumb stuff, also, dont be afraid to yukikaze, it is not a bad thing to toss one in there every now and then, using hirensou 623D DP should be adjusted more corner opportunity, get them on those silly jump outs., 623D DP.

Also, with 2D you want to be as far away from the opponent as possible, 2D is a weird move, and its not even that safe.. what with the meager plus you get on block. Generally, use it as a modified poke and see how the opponent reacts, you seem to like getting in, so dont even use 2D unless the situation calls for it. You want to make sure you've made your opponent scared of you in order to set up for a proper 2D as anyone will just block it and mash out knowing you aren't safe. Just try to sneak in your favorite moves and keep them blocking.

Taking pressure is bad, especially for jin now, one of the reasons i took a leave of absence. Your goal as jin is to get your opponent in the corner ASAP by whatever means, and once that happens, your options wont be as limited, play with your opponents head, goof off, and dont eat any of their attempts to get out, because then you'll be in a bad situation, and you will have to use more of your resources to win.

Are there any good jin videos to look at? Im bored and i want to see how the competition is nowadays.

And dont be scared to use 5B, its a good move, just dont overspam it.

[danteMdie]

Thnks for the input

Well, i never though too deeply about that meter wasting, but yes you're right. Sometimes i'm in a match and when i'm playing a zoning game and instead of just running to the opponent i go for 236D or j236D. No sense at all.

As for yukikaze, i used it once on the vid but it was an execution error - it was mean't to be 623D. Last days i've been using yukikaze more often though (and it works lol). Stopped using 2D like crazy too - using mainly on 5C>2D blockstring, opponents' backdashes or tager lol.

As for competition... Here in Europe it's incredibly rare to find good jin players... I only know 6 people which are worth watching: Wsilent (mains arakune), Mr. E or Shadow2bolt or just INTERNET-DIVIDER (hooked on marvel atm), Kid-kun, eQualzz, annoyances and sephi-tetsu (has some nice combo vids btw). I'm completely oblivious about x360 players in EU though...

[-Kid]

Need critique on my Jin. I don't really know how to play this match up. It's hard to get in against relius, and i can't stay far using ice swords.

I'd appreciate some advice about this match up AND on my Jin in general. Thanks in advance guys.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JOcjWt5SDYw&t=19m36s

[Jyosua]

Well I'm pretty free with most matchups still, but why are you not trying to poke ignis when she retreats at full screen? Also, if you notice he tries to throw Ignis at you on your approach a lot, you can often beat that by hitting him with a well-placed 2D.

[xlolxlolx]

bait his 2cs with stuff like whiff j.a>j.236a/b etc, shouldve dead angled near the end there so you would get corner and chance for comeback, not too sure about the 2b>throw reset since i think you kinda needed the meter, the missed 5b hit confirm was pretty huge there, youre respecting his stuff a bit too much, bad combo choice for ice sword air dsh combo, 2d, j.c, j.a, and 2a are pretty much your best move for this matchup iono the details but i tend to lose to him mid range but win close and far

[eQualz]

Can't really see much going wrong except for a few bad hit confirming. He pretty much dominated the neutral game. Once he has meter try to bait his CA with short blockstrings like 2B > 5B(1) > jump but that's more of a player reflex rather than match up advice, lol. We need to play again once my exams are over.

[Moy_X7]

bait his 2cs with stuff like whiff j.a>j.236a/b etc, shouldve dead angled near the end there so you would get corner and chance for comeback, not too sure about the 2b>throw reset since i think you kinda needed the meter, the missed 5b hit confirm was pretty huge there, youre respecting his stuff a bit too much, bad combo choice for ice sword air dsh combo, 2d, j.c, j.a, and 2a are pretty much your best move for this matchup iono the details but i tend to lose to him mid range but win close and far

^^ Pretty much this.

That Relius was pretty damn spot on. He reacted to every jump in with his 2C, so you'd probably need to bait those more like you did that one time with j.236B > AD > j.2C > j.D stuff. Again, that 5B > 6B failed hit-confirm was pretty bad, that would have set the momentum for you. I'm also iffy on that 2D > stuff > reset attempt, should have finished your combo for the Heat gain and corner carriage.

I haven't played any good Relius' so I can't really comment on the match-up. I just know that if he does that move where he has Ignis teleport behind you and you IB it, you can stuff his approach with 5B(1) CH or maybe even 5C.

[-Kid]

Hmm, yeah my bad on the 2 dropped combos. For the first one, I actually

Didn't know that my j.B was going to cross over like that, so that's why I did 5B > 6B.

The second one with the 2 6C's, I just don't know what happened there. I was just having a really bad day in general. The reason why I opt'd for that reset is because I just wanted to keep relius close to me.

Several times I tried to bait a CA by jump cancelling, yet I still got hit

Thanks for the input!

[Dingo_Egret]

Well, is my first time that I post here, so I thought that would be a goob opportunity to do it. Here, some matches with a friend that mains Noel:

Some advice or tips about my Jin?

PD: Sorry for my poor english xD, I'm a spanish player.

[Moy_X7]

Man, that's a lot of matches so I'm just gonna give you advice on the first three...

1. I like that 6B CH > stuff > DP D > more stuff > DP D > more stuff combo but you're wasting meter doing that. The optimal corner 6B CH combo is:
   6B CH > 6C > (Delayed) 214A > 44 2C > 6C > DC > DP B > 6C > DP C > 5B > 5C > 2C > sj.D > AD > j.2C > j.C > 66 5B > [1)3C > 214C] or [2)5C > 3C > 214A] (5359 or 5291/66 or 60). You'll use the 2nd finisher since you're playing Noel who doesn't get hit by 3C > 214C. I say it's a waste of meter because I only saw you getting 5.3K out of it which is the same you get with the optimal combo.
   
2. Be careful when you use 214B to break Primers without meter. You got lucky that the Noel player wasn't Barrier blocking.
   
3. I'd say to try and not use slow attacks like 6B or 6D too often but that Noel didn't seem to resort to Drive reversals lol.
   

Other than that, you play pretty well. I like your use of 6B, your judgment of when to use that is spot on. Oh and you English is pretty good too, btw.

Si que saben jugar BB en España, eh, jajaja

[Dingo_Egret]

Man, that's a lot of matches so I'm just gonna give you advice on the first three...

1. I like that 6B CH > stuff > DP D > more stuff > DP D > more stuff combo but you're wasting meter doing that. The optimal corner 6B CH combo is:
   6B CH > 6C > (Delayed) 214A > 44 2C > 6C > DC > DP B > 6C > DP C > 5B > 5C > 2C > sj.D > AD > j.2C > j.C > 66 5B > [1)3C > 214C] or [2)5C > 3C > 214A] (5359 or 5291/66 or 60). You'll use the 2nd finisher since you're playing Noel who doesn't get hit by 3C > 214C. I say it's a waste of meter because I only saw you getting 5.3K out of it which is the same you get with the optimal combo.
   
2. Be careful when you use 214B to break Primers without meter. You got lucky that the Noel player wasn't Barrier blocking.
   
3. I'd say to try and not use slow attacks like 6B or 6D too often but that Noel didn't seem to resort to Drive reversals lol.
   

Other than that, you play pretty well. I like your use of 6B, your judgment of when to use that is spot on. Oh and you English is pretty good too, btw.

Si que saben jugar BB en España, eh, jajaja

Thank you very much for the tips, I will take account your advices ^^. In these matches I tried to change a lot my pressure tools, because my friend knows my Jin pretty well, so I used different stuff like the 6B throw bait, the 2B 6D gatling (commonly the Jins use 5B after 2B or viceversa, so this could be predictable), etc. Lol, I know that the ice car is risky, so I take care of that for the next time xD (we played and recorded those matches at 4.00 am xDDDD).

Buen español ese jaja :D

¡Gracias!

[Jyosua]

This link won't be live for a couple of hours, because it's a 3 gig file I'm uploading to youtube. but if someone gets the chance, can they look over a few of these matches I had against Moy's plat, and critique me a bit. I think this is my first time posting in this thread with a video of my own, because I never really take videos of me trying to seriously play against someone and upload them that often. (I often forget) Anyhow, some of the matches I may do better than others in because it depends how much I've warmed up and whether or not losing repeatedly has affected me caring about the matches. After a certain point they may start going downhill.

http://youtu.be/FJ9cVIO7oh4

[Moy_X7]

Holy shit, over an hour worth of matches?

As the guy who played against you, I have a couple of things to say to you...

• You're easing down on the wake-up DPs but they still get you killed from time to time. Wake-up reversals are too easily telegraphed. If you must DP, do IB > DPs.
  
• Don't do wake-up/random 214Ds, I don't know why I got hit by as many of those as I did but that's a 4K+ punish lol.
  
• Try to mix things up with the 2C > NX gatling. You seemed to always just 6B after 2C and I later used that to my advantage to just 5A you out of it. Oh and you should only use frame trap strings on people who are impatient and push buttons. I've got nothing but patience, which is actually not a good thing since I let myself get pressured for longer than necessary.
  
• Try not to be too predictable with the JCs after 5C, I air tossed your ass way too many times after I got tired of 5C > JC lol.
  
• If you see that I have the Bat equipped or 50 Meter, be careful when you approach after a + move like 2D or j.236D. It's too easy for me to do 66 5D (Bat) lol.
  
• Don't push buttons after you block the falling hammer.
  

[Jyosua]

Holy shit, over an hour worth of matches?

As the guy who played against you, I have a couple of things to say to you...

• You're easing down on the wake-up DPs but they still get you killed from time to time. Wake-up reversals are too easily telegraphed. If you must DP, do IB > DPs.
  
• Don't do wake-up/random 214Ds, I don't know why I got hit by as many of those as I did but that's a 4K+ punish lol.
  
• Try to mix things up with the 2C > NX gatling. You seemed to always just 6B after 2C and I later used that to my advantage to just 5A you out of it. Oh and you should only use frame trap strings on people who are impatient and push buttons. I've got nothing but patience, which is actually not a good thing since I let myself get pressured for longer than necessary.
  
• Try not to be too predictable with the JCs after 5C, I air tossed your ass way too many times after I got tired of 5C > JC lol.
  
• If you see that I have the Bat equipped or 50 Meter, be careful when you approach after a + move like 2D or j.236D. It's too easy for me to do 66 5D (Bat) lol.
  
• Don't push buttons after you block the falling hammer.
  

Those 214Ds: I do them for a couple reasons. First, if I see someone recklessly running back in after a green burst. Second, after I jump in the air in order to escape the corner. I think you like, jumped in front of that a few times. XD The random 214Ds after a blocked 5D are completely retarded and it's a bad habit I need to replace with 236D or something else instead. Yeah on the gatling, but I'm afraid to let 2C recover, so aside from a 6D, I don't have much to cancel it into unless I want to end my pressure.

As far as the j.2C>j.C string yeah I'm predictable with that. I'm thinking of ways to break that habit, and I caught someone recently with a hilarious Jump>land 2B recently. I might try to do that more often for some better mixup. I also should try using it after a 2A or 5B (1) instead. My pressure is still a WIP. I can't mindlessly throw out moves unless I know they're frametraps. I just don't trust people not to press buttons. I realize I'm going to have to give up on that ideal eventually, but... after getting accustomed to netplay it's hard.

Tournament tomorrow so I gotta get some sleep. Thanks for the advice. I don't expect anyone to sit through and watch all these matches, but if someone else has some advice too, I appreciate it.

[Moy_X7]

Oh and don't always Burst the moment you get hit after a failed DP. I don't know why I don't bait those Bursts more often, specially when I can just pogo through them.