[CT] Ragna vs Tager

[Magnet]

Hmmmmmm..... From some of my online experience and from a face to face encounter with a decent tager, i honestly think this matchup, at least for Ragna, can be difficult without reaaaally good spacing. :RG:generally, Im just gonna hold back against Tager, around a 5B distance away, and poke and prod him with 5B, 5C, 6D and carefully placed J.Cs, then hitconfirm into combo/damage off those. at the range i stay at, I mostly have to worry about his D's and spark bolt. if I'm magnetized, I avoid jumping as much as possible, because of atomic collider. I personally don't use Dead-Spike often in this match. Tager can just sledge right through it and get a counter hit. watch both of Tager's meters carefully, and be very cautious on your oki options, especially if your magnetized. Try to avoid losing the round to a wakeup 360 or 720 because you neglected to pay attention to his meter/magnetism. if your not magnetized, maintain a slight distance and be ready to move ASAP, since some tagers may wakeup tech into 360B. Barrier Breaking (Aka stopping your run by using barrierguard) can be a decent way to bait spark bolt for some Tagers, and can also save you from running straight into one. Granted, even if you block it your still magnetized, but its a hell of a lot better then being magnetized and flying towards a combo-ready tager. Be EXTREMELY CAREFUL about bursting in this matchup. A bad burst only weakens your already low defense score, and removes your ability to barrier break (I Believe, confirm anyone?) So only burst as a last resort. avoid airdashing to get really close to tager. don't let him show you his nice, communist approved invulnerable 360 as a punish. if your feeling gutsy, try blood kain if you've got the meter/health. it turns your already decent normals into pressure machines, particularly your 5D and 6D to sum it up, I suggest just playing this matchup really carefully. rushing down willy-nilly may work at first, but may hurt you in the long run if the Tager decides to take a chance. his risk/reward ratio is somewhat higher in terms of damage, since he can take and dish out more damage then you if you let him. however, you control the pace of the matchup, so force him to play your footsie games and wear him down with cautious mixups. Notable Moves (in no particular order of importance) for 1. 5B (Nice, fairly big safe poke. just dont wiff it.) 2. 5C (Big reach, good for fishing for a counterhit.) 3. 6D (Slow to start, but good pressure and mixup possibilities off a blocked 5B or by itself. on hit can lead to a nice combo.) 4. 5A/2A (Quick pokes for getting out of pressure.) 5. Inferno Divider (its a shoryuken reversal with some damage potential, just don't use predictably or else...) 6. 6C (Useful in combos. Tagers got a HUGE hitbox, making the 6C->GH combo good, expecially if you can follow it up) 7. Gauntlet Hades and TK Gauntlet Hades (not particularly useful in pressure, but they're your cash cows for damage, so USE EM) 8. instant block/instant barrier block/counter assault (as always, these should be mentioned. they can get you out of pressure and get you back the momentum, which is important)

[Xill]

High lvls Tagers like to backdash anything you throw. Air dash close to the ground so you can either hit him through the tail end of his backdash (Somewhat risky till you know what you're aimin' for) Or jump after you land next to him to dodge his grab or attack and punish. (Less Risky till predictable) Just, as usual with Ragna, have a lot of pressure strings and actually AIM for where they aren't blocking. I don't like tossin' overheads at Tagers, but if i have a roman cancel and I can toss out a Gauntlet Hades at no risk... I'll go for it. Its rare, and will get him to think higher, that way, you get much easier low combos start'd.

[Shinobi]

This match-up is bullshit.

[Akureikaze]

Pointless Information. if you just so happened to Inferno Divider C for whatever reason...and tager has his spinning distortion going jam as much as you can on Inferno Divider C you can clash the first hit, and you'd be considering in air, jam out a second and you can go through and hit him during his DD i've done it for lulz at least three times already

[Tage*Proto]

Honestly this match doesn't seem that bad for ragna, you just have to stay disciplined. 5b is a monster in this match, just don't get overzealous with your blockstrings because of the backdash threat. It takes a lot more for ragna to win this fight then it does tager, so you should be playing it that way, smart and safe.

[Infectellect]

Patience, wait for openings and counters. Try to get good damaging combos in those openings, but even if you have to chip away with a few counter hits, you'll get him eventually. Prepare to cancel out of his throws, and just be careful when he was 50% heat. Someone mentioned IB'ing some of his moves, which works great as they are quite predictable. Good Tagers tend to use the same gameplan over and over, and the same but VERY damaging combo's. Just learn when it's safe to let go of block, and when to barrier block. Try not to get stuck in the corner or you'll be sorry. Pace the fight and try to stay in the middle of the battlefield.

[Kairi_Yamoto]

My buddy mains Tager, and we've fought each other a lot. He's given me some good tips. Tager will rely on tried and true combos to pack on massive damage, so cancel out of the throw combos. From the times I've played him, I find its not best to pressure Tager too much, but the 6D j.D pressure can come in handy sometimes, use it very sporadically, or you'll eat more throw combos and tager busters than you should. In general, keep a moderate distance between you and tager, and rely on your 5B and 5C to poke and start combos Also, it never hurts to ID when you're up close, utilize it more against Tager and end it with 236C to wall bounce, as Tager is big enough to be caught in another ID string as he bounces off the wall before he can recover. Be careful when magnetized, as it closes the distance between the two of you rather fast when Tager attacks, I know its caught me off guard plenty of times. However, it does allow you to counter from a further distance if you can time it right. I haven't messed too much with IB'ing yet, so I can't say much on that front. Avoid accidental bursts, and watch Tager's tension; I've been finished with more distortion drives than I can count because I wasn't paying attention and rushing forward to pressure Tager. Overall, its not a bad matchup. When I first started out I thought it was just ridiculous how much damage he could put on Ragna in one combo, and magnetism didnt help either. However, I just had to play ragna smarter, and actually learn what connected into what. Wait patiently, choose your attacks carefully, and punish any missed moves. Hope that helps.

[Prototype909]

Honestly this match doesn't seem that bad for ragna, you just have to stay disciplined. 5b is a monster in this match, just don't get overzealous with your blockstrings because of the backdash threat. It takes a lot more for ragna to win this fight then it does tager, so you should be playing it that way, smart and safe.

The matchup isn't bad, it's just stupid. The fact that Ragna has to play...so UN-Ragna like to win it.

The match is a joke if you play as defensive as God himself and just throw out counter 5B/5Cs and BnB combo it up. But if Ragna plays offensive, Tager can just IB + Backdash/360A all day if you aren't mixing it up constantly (And I mean constantly).

It's just stupid and shouldn't work the way it does. You basically get consistently punished for attacking.

[Blade]

How big is Tager's Kara range, anyway? I keep getting thrown in places where I don't expect to be thrown...and it's not even a Tager Driver...

[A.X.I.S.]

The matchup isn't bad, it's just stupid. The fact that Ragna has to play...so UN-Ragna like to win it.

The match is a joke if you play as defensive as God himself and just throw out counter 5B/5Cs and BnB combo it up. But if Ragna plays offensive, Tager can just IB + Backdash/360A all day if you aren't mixing it up constantly (And I mean constantly).

It's just stupid and shouldn't work the way it does. You basically get consistently punished for attacking.

dead wrong, as a tager i will argue...people like ragnarebellion and donpara9on (cant spell his name right) are rush ragna's they mix up very well and always try to get a punish.

this match up is so simple.

blade tagers throw range is bigger than yours just keep it in mind, if you hell fang..ID real quick after..most tager will 360 punish you if you do it.

from what i see tager's throw range is maybe twice ragna's?

oh didnt we play before prototype?

[FlyingVe]

dead wrong, as a tager i will argue...people like ragnarebellion and donpara9on (cant spell his name right) are rush ragna's they mix up very well and always try to get a punish.

this match up is so simple.

blade tagers throw range is bigger than yours just keep it in mind, if you hell fang..ID real quick after..most tager will 360 punish you if you do it.

from what i see tager's throw range is maybe twice ragna's?

oh didnt we play before prototype?

This is basically the way to approach the match, you are much better of pressuring Tager than playing defensively. That being said try to fight Tager at your maximum possible range with 5B 5C and 2C. Also, while ID after hells fang is okay I would just avoid using HF in a block string all together unless you have meter for a RC. Also, 2C Tager's sledge hammer and 2D it's easy to do and has huge counter hit hit stun, then follow with one of those massive 6C combo's.

The biggest problem I have with Tager is is basic block string A,B,C,D, Sledge (repeat). I know you can IB and interrupt attacks or ID the gaps, but My IB'ing is inconsistent at best and as always after you ID once or twice they will be watching for it. Does andy body have advice on escaping that string?

[Prototype909]

This is basically the way to approach the match, you are much better of pressuring Tager than playing defensively. That being said try to fight Tager at your maximum possible range with 5B 5C and 2C. Also, while ID after hells fang is okay I would just avoid using HF in a block string all together unless you have meter for a RC. Also, 2C Tager's sledge hammer and 2D it's easy to do and has huge counter hit hit stun, then follow with one of those massive 6C combo's.

The biggest problem I have with Tager is is basic block string A,B,C,D, Sledge (repeat). I know you can IB and interrupt attacks or ID the gaps, but My IB'ing is inconsistent at best and as always after you ID once or twice they will be watching for it. Does andy body have advice on escaping that string?

Other than IB or ID, your only real option COMPLETELY SAFE is to simply wait until they go for a throw in my experience. Jumping away and Ragna's crappy backdash both get stuffed. Blood Kain could hypothetically work though I imagine.

Try 2A after the B, that might work if you're within range.

[VR-Raiden]

The biggest problem I have with Tager is is basic block string A,B,C,D, Sledge (repeat). I know you can IB and interrupt attacks or ID the gaps, but My IB'ing is inconsistent at best and as always after you ID once or twice they will be watching for it. Does andy body have advice on escaping that string?

Here's what you do, go in training and record Tager doing that string. Block it, and find out when you can do anything/what to do. You don't even need to IB to get out of that.

If you mean sledge A, you can hit him after you block it with 5A/5B, it's disadvantage on block. If you mean sledge B, that's pretty easy to see so just ID it or jump out. If you just barrier block the whole thing sledge A won't even reach.

[A.X.I.S.]

This is basically the way to approach the match, you are much better of pressuring Tager than playing defensively. That being said try to fight Tager at your maximum possible range with 5B 5C and 2C. Also, while ID after hells fang is okay I would just avoid using HF in a block string all together unless you have meter for a RC. Also, 2C Tager's sledge hammer and 2D it's easy to do and has huge counter hit hit stun, then follow with one of those massive 6C combo's.

The biggest problem I have with Tager is is basic block string A,B,C,D, Sledge (repeat). I know you can IB and interrupt attacks or ID the gaps, but My IB'ing is inconsistent at best and as always after you ID once or twice they will be watching for it. Does andy body have advice on escaping that string?

yes that is the only way to handle tager efficiently any other way and he rapes you...

that string can be ID'd and to me i hate ID. >.<

ID.

it beats sledge.

it beats magna-tech wheel.

it beats air tech's

it beats 360A and B.

excuse me i have to get a tissue and cry.

[makeSHIFT]

How big is Tager's Kara range, anyway? I keep getting thrown in places where I don't expect to be thrown...and it's not even a Tager Driver...

Tell me about it. I faced a tager online and he flawlessed me from start to finish. I couldn't even recover in time to retaliate.

[Zero000]

yes that is the only way to handle tager efficiently any other way and he rapes you...

that string can be ID'd and to me i hate ID. >.<

ID.

it beats sledge.

it beats magna-tech wheel.

it beats air tech's

it beats 360A and B.

excuse me i have to get a tissue and cry.

cross postin~

don't mess up the DP

seriously, don't mess up the dp

[Nobus3r1]

As someone transitioning from Tager to Ragna I would say that getting really good at throw breaking is an excellent way to stop Tager as if you look in the Tager forum a disproportionate number of his combos start with a basic grab. I know when I was playing Tager against Ragna (or any of the other really fast characters) them throw breaking was usually one of the main factors in lopsided rounds. I would also (don't remember seeing this mentioned) recommend against air dashing if you're magnetized as even if you don't get hit with the drive move you're going to go flying all over the screen as sometimes it seems like the game has a hard time figuring out where you should land.

[Fahros]

My buddy plays Tager, and he's getting pretty decent. It's one pressure string that really gets me though, and that's if I get caught blocking 5D, he Bsledges, jab jab jab jab, 5D, Bsledge, jab jab jab jab...I'm not sure how to get out of it. I tried attacking him when his Bsledge is winding up and it doesn't work, it seems I have such a high recovery if I block 5D that I can't do anything. All these moves he can keep stringing together seem to have such high priority and are so safe that he can just spam it until my guard breaks and then combo me for massive soviet deeps. So is the only way to get out of this specific string IB? I also fought a different Tager who was 360'ing me after attacks, but it was giving me no option to tech. They weren't counter throws either, I wasn't mashing anything either. He could j.B and then if I blocked 360 me without an option to tech. Now I know I should ID or 6A his j.B, but still, if I get caught blocking why is it giving me no option to tech? He even did it with 720's, clearly after attacks, but no option to tech...And it's not like you can wait to do a 720 so it doesn't count as part of the attack string, because you can't standing buffer a 720... I just really hate how I have to play this matchup, but when shit like above goes down I just straight up lose hope.

[VR-Raiden]

My buddy plays Tager, and he's getting pretty decent. It's one pressure string that really gets me though, and that's if I get caught blocking 5D, he Bsledges, jab jab jab jab, 5D, Bsledge, jab jab jab jab...I'm not sure how to get out of it. I tried attacking him when his Bsledge is winding up and it doesn't work, it seems I have such a high recovery if I block 5D that I can't do anything. All these moves he can keep stringing together seem to have such high priority and are so safe that he can just spam it until my guard breaks and then combo me for massive soviet deeps.

So is the only way to get out of this specific string IB?

Read the last couple of posts

I also fought a different Tager who was 360'ing me after attacks, but it was giving me no option to tech. They weren't counter throws either, I wasn't mashing anything either. He could j.B and then if I blocked 360 me without an option to tech. Now I know I should ID or 6A his j.B, but still, if I get caught blocking why is it giving me no option to tech? He even did it with 720's, clearly after attacks, but no option to tech...And it's not like you can wait to do a 720 so it doesn't count as part of the attack string, because you can't standing buffer a 720...

I just really hate how I have to play this matchup, but when shit like above goes down I just straight up lose hope.

If he does his 360's when you are in block stun or hit stun (or just leaving it), they will be breakable. Otherwise, you can't break them. In that situation he must have waited long enough after you blocked the j.B to do his 360 so that you were no longer in block stun, meaning you could have jumped/backdashed/whatever'd to escape.

[Prototype909]

So, what safe ways are there to deal with the Backdash? Dash -> 2C at max range seems to be the best way i've found to deal with it thus far.

[Spirit Juice]

So, what safe ways are there to deal with the Backdash? Dash -> 2C at max range seems to be the best way i've found to deal with it thus far.

Jump up, wait, j.C on the way down if he isn't doing something lol like spin super after back dash. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but you're at practically no risk for baiting out a backdash with this method, and even if you guess incorrectly, Tager's lack of an anti-air will make the j.C on the way down safe.

[VR-Raiden]

Jump up, wait, j.C on the way down if he isn't doing something lol like spin super after back dash. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but you're at practically no risk for baiting out a backdash with this method, and even if you guess incorrectly, Tager's lack of an anti-air will make the j.C on the way down safe.

I think i've been backdash>360'd for using j.C before, maybe it has to do with the range. Or it could've been that I didn't do it late enough in my jump.

When I jump in on Tager and I think he might backdash I usually just do j.AAAAAA and that will catch him if he backdashes. Tager can CH 2A you if you do that though.

and for on the ground dealing with his backdash, just don't do anything that he can evade and punish with a backdash, like 6D. 5A is really good in this match up cause it hits his crouch.

oh yeah and just something to note, ID© will actually catch his backdash. Not recommending you use it for that, but I've had it happen before in a situation where the Tager was (I'm assuming) baiting the ID thinking he could backdash to avoid it.

[Prototype909]

j.C can be punished by a Backdash -> 360A, even if done with neutral jump. Against regular backdash it works as long as you don't air dash in and j.C. j.AAAAAA is confirmed to work, most Tagers don't know what to do to consistently punish it.

[Spirit Juice]

You know, you could always do this thing called double jump. The whole point of jumping in the first place is to see what they're going to do; not to autopilot j.C on the way down every time. :o

[Prototype909]

You know, you could always do this thing called double jump. The whole point of jumping in the first place is to see what they're going to do; not to autopilot j.C on the way down every time. :o

Even if you double jump, they can just backdash again