Osuna Report post Posted July 11, 2009 Mm really? I play my brother who uses Rachael a lot and whenever he has like 2-3 rods set up and he uses Baden-Baden Lily, I'm always able to sledge through them without any problem. Though I need to check back on the damage of that move ><, it seems like one of the stronger projectile-related distortion drives though.That happens for me most of the time too, maybe we are moving forward before all the hits land? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Plasma Report post Posted July 11, 2009 Also found out that one close range distortion drive sword move V-13 has goes through it ><. Is the projectile guard properties based on one hit doing 2400, or a projectile hitting more than once damaging over 2400? Ice Fang hits more than once <_<. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Order Jeff Report post Posted July 12, 2009 Hey guys, I don't really play Tager, and this might have been posted already, but I have found ways for you to easily combo into his astral. If you have a few character lengths between you and your opponent you can hold back and A+B+C to sort of sneaky barrier prep, then spark bolt while still holding the three other buttons. After it launches, spam tap the d button until activation. If they are hit, then stop hitting it and it will combo into the astral. If not, hold it to magnetize then towards you and try your best to time the grab. If they are too close, wait for the D spam until they cross you up or dont go for the astral. Also, if your opponent has around 5.5k(carl) or 6k(nu-13) hp remaining, only two I have tested this on, and you have 80 meter, if you land a grab, proceed with the magnetic air grab cancel, but right as you grab them, hold A+B+C, it won't RC yet, then spark bolt and spam D as usual with the immediae release upon activation. Always grab towards the closest corner so the air grab will point them back into open space, gives enough activation time for your astral off the wall bounce. I will see if I can find any more extended combos for use at higher opponent life or less meter. Pretty much anything off a spark bolt seems to work. Thanks. -Bringer of candy. Tasty, tasty candy. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HZMN Report post Posted July 12, 2009 Hey guys, I don't really play Tager, and this might have been posted already, but I have found ways for you to easily combo into his astral. If you have a few character lengths between you and your opponent you can hold back and A+B+C to sort of sneaky barrier prep, then spark bolt while still holding the three other buttons. After it launches, spam tap the d button until activation. If they are hit, then stop hitting it and it will combo into the astral. If not, hold it to magnetize then towards you and try your best to time the grab. If they are too close, wait for the D spam until they cross you up or dont go for the astral. Also, if your opponent has around 5.5k(carl) or 6k(nu-13) hp remaining, only two I have tested this on, and you have 80 meter, if you land a grab, proceed with the magnetic air grab cancel, but right as you grab them, hold A+B+C, it won't RC yet, then spark bolt and spam D as usual with the immediae release upon activation. Always grab towards the closest corner so the air grab will point them back into open space, gives enough activation time for your astral off the wall bounce. I will see if I can find any more extended combos for use at higher opponent life or less meter. Pretty much anything off a spark bolt seems to work. Thanks. -Bringer of candy. Tasty, tasty candy. That train departed about 1 page ago. Sorry you spent the time doing that post though, pretty much condensed what we said already Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kensk Report post Posted July 12, 2009 highest damage spark volt followup i could find for 50% meter (tested on arakune) spark volt, 5C, 6A, 2C, atomic collider, step forward just a hair, B sledge, folluwp, RC, 5C, heat does 4927. meterless, it does 4185 (end after the sledge). is that the best you can do..? followup does not work on carl (unless im fuckin it up)... :/ but the 4185 damage part does, however. also the 6C 5D followup doesnt work on him after this combo anyway... edit: the rc followup seems arakune specific, kinda blows. i tested on carl and rachel, neither work. there might be a way to get it to work on rachel but idk. editx2: also it may seem like a "bad idea" to forgoe the 6C 5D followup, but you still get 2 seconds of magnetism with this combo, and you can still do tech resets off sledge followup, in fact, its almost better in that sense because it a) doesnt knock them full screen b) its a much less commonly seen tech trap. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Order Jeff Report post Posted July 12, 2009 Oh well, I threw that out there without looking because my family was leaving for a movie. Apologies for repeating what you guys already posted. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
HZMN Report post Posted July 12, 2009 Oh well, I threw that out there without looking because my family was leaving for a movie. Apologies for repeating what you guys already posted. Its cool, like I said its condensed. Pretty much any combo involving Spark bolt can followup with an Astral. But at that point its knowing where your gauges are at the time and your opponents health. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
bjholmes2 Report post Posted July 12, 2009 I realize this is a matter of taste, but the tone in the guide seems very technical. Do you guys like it that way, or would you rather I add more of a personal flavor to it? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Order Jeff Report post Posted July 12, 2009 On carl, the combo, j.2C (CH?) > 2B > 2C > 623C (Press all but D right as the grab connects and hold) > 41236D > D+D+D+D+D, will initiate astral and be fatal from 74%hp and 68 meter. I think it goes up to 75%hp but I wont commit to it right now, cant remember exactly. Played a Carl online specifically to pull this off and he must have been pissed when I did. Another strat I think would be good for astral when your spark bol is too close to a corner is to do any combo into collider, dont walk forward, 6C, 41236D, then B sledge. The delay from the sledge makes them cross you up and tech so during the sledge buffer the initial D's (lol initial d) astral and start to barrier, when they try to punish spam D and stop blocking when they try something with a lot of recovery. Nailed a Ragna, Jin, and Rachel with this just now. I really hate giving up rounds to test these on players but it is really good testing imo. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fu11m3t41 Report post Posted July 12, 2009 Gentlemen, I have made a startling discovery. You CANNOT beat normal grabs with command grabs on wake up. It is impossible. For example, Playing a Ragna, He would attempt to grab me on wake up, and like the Zangief player I am, attempt 360B on wakeup. His normal grab beats it and I feel the pain. Im in shock and infuriated. COMMAND GRABS SHOULD NOT BE BEATEN BY NORMAL GRABS! The only thing I was able to do was 360A on wakeup, because of the invincibility, BUT THAT SHOULDN'T BE THE ONLY REASON IT CONNECTS! Now, I know what your thinking, "Man, you must not be inputting the 360 right". Well, Ill tell you this, I've been playing grapplers since SF2, so I know how to do them. This is infurating. If someone else can test this, that would be great, im just too pissed right now to try anymore. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Osuna Report post Posted July 12, 2009 Gentlemen, I have made a startling discovery. You CANNOT beat normal grabs with command grabs on wake up. It is impossible. For example, Playing a Ragna, He would attempt to grab me on wake up, and like the Zangief player I am, attempt 360B on wakeup. His normal grab beats it and I feel the pain. Im in shock and infuriated. COMMAND GRABS SHOULD NOT BE BEATEN BY NORMAL GRABS! The only thing I was able to do was 360A on wakeup, because of the invincibility, BUT THAT SHOULDN'T BE THE ONLY REASON IT CONNECTS! Now, I know what your thinking, "Man, you must not be inputting the 360 right". Well, Ill tell you this, I've been playing grapplers since SF2, so I know how to do them. This is infurating. If someone else can test this, that would be great, im just too pissed right now to try anymore.I don't understand your problem. 360B comes out slower than a regular grab, and they can start theirs earlier than you. And most teching you can do has portions of throw vulnerability. It would be weird if the 360B won. Zangeif's throw is Much faster. There is maybe 2 frames of vulnerability if that game's mechanics allow throwing that soon while rising. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fu11m3t41 Report post Posted July 12, 2009 360A has 11 frames of execution and 1 active frame. 360B has 8 frames of execution, and 2 active frames. Ragna's Neutral throw has 7 frames of execution and 3 active frames. Atomic Buster has 2 frames of execution and 2 active frames. Potemkin Buster has 3 frames of execution and 1 active frame. Oicho Throw has 5 frames of execution and 2 active frames. Tornado Throw has 5 frames of execution and 2 active frames. Moonsault Press has 2 frames of execution and 1 active frame. I see what you are saying. But, Its extremely frustrating knowing that I can't beat grabs with a command grab on wake up, and thats a pretty big part of grappler play, albeit easily avoidable and punishable. Also, Does anyone feel slightly peeved knowing that Tager's command grabs are slower then normal grabs? And that Tager has the slowest command grabs ever? Still love him to death, but why Aksys? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
professorlester Report post Posted July 12, 2009 yeah I love Abels TT but also being an Alex player I know this pain all to well. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Maho Report post Posted July 12, 2009 Always do your 360s as 360BC and 360A~BC, it won't make them beat faster throws but at least you won't get thrown out of the startup. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kensk Report post Posted July 12, 2009 yep, works with any slow move. bsledge, followup, 6b. you should always buffer a throw itech n the startup of those moves if they are close enough to grab you. you typically arent going to get thrown but it idiot proofs everything you do. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fu11m3t41 Report post Posted July 12, 2009 yep, works with any slow move. bsledge, followup, 6b. you should always buffer a throw itech n the startup of those moves if they are close enough to grab you. you typically arent going to get thrown but it idiot proofs everything you do. I think i get what your saying. But it was almost another "Has anyone really been far even as decided to use even go want to do look more like?" moment. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tiamat Report post Posted July 12, 2009 why would you ever do 360B on wakeup? thing has zero invulnerability 360A has invul but it's from frame 3 not frame 1 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yaotzin Report post Posted July 12, 2009 What is a good way to practice Tager's grabs? I recently started trying ranked mode and becuase short-cuts do not work I've been having trouble manually doing his 360's and 720's. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Isorropia Report post Posted July 12, 2009 360B on wakeup works more often than not for me, I just do a delayed quick getup tech and the opponent is usually nice enough to have put out a big meaty attack when they expected me to get up. However at other times, yeah, trying it has got my ass kicked. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dumpsterdiver Report post Posted July 12, 2009 What is a good way to practice Tager's grabs? I recently started trying ranked mode and becuase short-cuts do not work I've been having trouble manually doing his 360's and 720's. 360s and 720s are much harder to do with a thumb than with your wrist. The best way to practice the motion would be to practice the motion. Training mode. Over and over. Forever. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tiamat Report post Posted July 12, 2009 look in the thread called "buffering 360s and 720s" Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fu11m3t41 Report post Posted July 13, 2009 What is a good way to practice Tager's grabs? I recently started trying ranked mode and becuase short-cuts do not work I've been having trouble manually doing his 360's and 720's. A standing 360 is extremely important to learning a grappler. The input is NOT a 360, but more like a 270. The input, if you would kindly look at your numberpad, is 632147A/B. Sit in training mode until you can do it 10 times in a row. Then repeat from the opposite side. Then fight a computer, Every time you block a move, 360. Or, when they are close to you, 360. Win 10 games using only 360s. That should help. Remember, Its going to hurt, you're gonna whiff many times, you're gonna screw up the input many times, and you're gonna be punished for it many MANY MANY times Copypastad from myself. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Catastrophy Report post Posted July 13, 2009 I see what you are saying. But, Its extremely frustrating knowing that I can't beat grabs with a command grab on wake up, and thats a pretty big part of grappler play, albeit easily avoidable and punishable. Also, Does anyone feel slightly peeved knowing that Tager's command grabs are slower then normal grabs? And that Tager has the slowest command grabs ever? Still love him to death, but why Aksys? Tager's 360B does scarier damage than any other non-super grappler command grab. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Tuna Report post Posted July 13, 2009 Question regarding doing instant block into 360... Do I instant block, then do the 360 motion? Or should I try to be doing the instant block as part of the 360 motion, like 632148 where 4 is the instant block? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DoomieJ Report post Posted July 13, 2009 4 for block, than 12367 for the 360 motion is what i do. Low IB you woulda have to come back up to 4 after hitting 1 though. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
