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dot_Nova

Potemkin vs Sin

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Yeah I know Potemkin has a lot of bad matchups, but this one is currently really really the struggle. Not sure what you can actually do to get in since there's so much pushback on his stuff. There is almost no reason Sin should ever go in on this matchup. Even watching the Gaku vs FAB one, I know FAB won but he had no business going in. Gaku just decided to get greedy when he should have just kept Potemkin out. I'm pretty stuck on this matchup right now. Think you just have to get your spacing perfectly for  Beak Driver and learn to bait it out in order to slowly push your opponent in the corner and then run your game.

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It's pretty much the old Tager pet peeve of mine: characters with highly punishing long range moves suddenly transforming into a HIGHLY dangerous zoner against my chosen character. To the point where I'd rather fight an actual zoner.

 

I'm not really adding anything here, it's just a fighting game phenomenon that really brings my piss to a boil.

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Well what I've been using in the match-up is mega fist forward actually, obviously you don't just spam it all day but it was doing some decent work vs this sin I was playing. Other than that, on oki I double jump or backdash to bait out the dragon punch. Finally, if the sin tries to beak driver into food as a block string it's actually punishable with a slide head. Y'all probably know all of this, and some of it might even be wrong, but figured I'd share either way. 

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MU is pretty rough. Megafist forward is good to jump over everything but bull bash(overhead)

Careful when jumping in because his 6P is pretty good.

 

Once you knock him down it's fairly easy to beat him since his DP has very small range. I like doing a fake jump-in meaty and then BD immediately when landing. If he DP's it'll whiff and you can pot buster for free.

 

His backdash is a pain to deal with. I still need to find a consistent way to catch it other than hard call 6H.

 

Be sure to not let him eat for free. Get used to when your opponent chooses to eat. If he tends to eat during blockstrings, hammerfall into him when you believe he's going to try. If he's across the screen, slowly make your approach and get ready to slidehead if he's low calories and wants to eat. If he whiffs his beak driver then it's also a free slidehead, the move has a good amount of recovery on whiff.

 

You can hammerfall through bull bash and elk hunt since they both hit once or you can blitz bull bash and then slidehead for a free approach (watch out for his YRC).

 

Blocking elk hunt leads to a free pot buster. He may be plus on it but none of his normals are fast enough to beat pot buster. His only option would be to jump out, chain another special or BD immediately.

 

Be careful if you try to jump over his lightning projectile super as Sin can jump and stab you back into it.

 

Generally, when his calorie meter is running low, look to be extremely aggressive since he has to eat. Do your best not to get hit as any conversion leads to him getting meter. Be patient when approaching him. Eventually he'll be backed near a corner and has no choice but to try and aggress onto you.

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There's a pretty tight spot where you can actually contest Beak Driver with 5H I've found some mild success in. But my spacing isn't good enough to fully take advantage of it. But yeah right outside the range of Beak Driver you can 5H to either stuff it or at least put yourself in a position where you can make him guess "Jump or is he going to walk forward" 

 

Get your Anti-Airs in order for this matchup too, I don't think Sin should really go in much in this matchup, but I have yet to see a Sin fully play it lame so you gotta take advantage of when he comes in!

 

This matchup has helped me remember that sometimes, jumping in and FDing is good enough to get you where you want to be.

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It's pretty much the old Tager pet peeve of mine: characters with highly punishing long range moves suddenly transforming into a HIGHLY dangerous zoner against my chosen character. To the point where I'd rather fight an actual zoner.

 

I'm not really adding anything here, it's just a fighting game phenomenon that really brings my piss to a boil.

I would say more specifically this matchup is very similar to Tager vs. Hakumen in that Tager is outranged and due to the nature of his opponents mechanics kind of fucked in general.  With Hakumen he could poke and poke and poke until he gets bored by which time he's got full magatama and a nice fat full magatama and/or character specific combo with your name on it ready for the next time you get hit.  Sin feels pretty much the same way except that the charging up part is faster but able to be interrupted (Slidehead in response to eating).  I agree about rather fighting an actual zoning character instead of Sin as at least in those matchups stuff like FDB is an actual threat.  My only success in this matchup comes when I'm able to block enough stuff that he's low on calories and then disrupting his attempts to refuel.

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Hey so I just found out, at beak drivers max range you can actually slide head him and it'll low profile the beak driver. Just something useful to know. Also, his slide special move, can't remember what it's called, ias throwable, so if he ever uses it in a string that isn't clean you can just throw him out of it. Didn't test pot buster, but regular throw definitely worked.

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Hey so I just found out, at beak drivers max range you can actually slide head him and it'll low profile the beak driver. Just something useful to know. Also, his slide special move, can't remember what it's called, ias throwable, so if he ever uses it in a string that isn't clean you can just throw him out of it. Didn't test pot buster, but regular throw definitely worked.

Just like what dot nova said in an earlier post, you can block sin's slide (elk hunt) then punish with pot buster unless he chains or jumps.

To add, my sin partner claims that he's forced to jump out in response to seeing pot IB his elk hunt because he still gets pot busted if he tries to chain it to anything.

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Just like what dot nova said in an earlier post, you can block sin's slide (elk hunt) then punish with pot buster unless he chains or jumps.

To add, my sin partner claims that he's forced to jump out in response to seeing pot IB his elk hunt because he still gets pot busted if he tries to chain it to anything.

 

Ah, I had no idea what elk hunt was and forgot to look it up. Thanks for that little bit of insight, ill try adding it to my game.

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elk hunt> beak breaker isn't a true block string?

Even I would believe it's rekka ken tight. I'll just test it and post results after work. I have a tourney this weekend and there's a sin army I need to prepare for.

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elk hunt> beak breaker isn't a true block string?

It is a true blockstring. Just look at the frame data. Elk hunt is a lvl 4 move and has 14 frames of block stun if you IB it, and beak driver has 11 frame start up, there is no way to punish it at all. One easy way to test this simply is IB elk hunt then hold forward for the beak driver, you will still block it because you are still in block stun from the elk hunt. You also can't punish point blank Beak driver>Elk Hunt, but at pretty much any range out of it you can IB beak driver and Pot Buster the elk hunt.

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Matches from recent locals. It's been a while since I've played the MU so this is a good example of what to do and especially what not to do.

 

Hammerfall is a very poor option to beat beak driver since you can't YRC between the two hits, stay spaced and slidehead so it goes over you or jump over it. Be very patient yet take risks that your opponent wouldn't expect because neutral game/footsies is almost impossible. And his DP is very bad if it whiffs so try to bait it, otherwise you'll be at a disadvantage again even if you block it.

 

Don't use flick in this MU because beak driver does not have a hurtbox on it (I particularly had a bad habit of using it in this set). It's much more useful once you've pushed him into the corner.

 

https://youtu.be/9gS-vc0WRD4

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Matches from recent locals. It's been a while since I've played the MU so this is a good example of what to do and especially what not to do.

 

Hammerfall is a very poor option to beat beak driver since you can't YRC between the two hits, stay spaced and slidehead so it goes over you or jump over it. Be very patient yet take risks that your opponent wouldn't expect because neutral game/footsies is almost impossible. And his DP is very bad if it whiffs so try to bait it, otherwise you'll be at a disadvantage again even if you block it.

 

Don't use flick in this MU because beak driver does not have a hurtbox on it (I particularly had a bad habit of using it in this set). It's much more useful once you've pushed him into the corner.

 

https://youtu.be/9gS-vc0WRD4

Really solid matches. The empty cross up superjump into backdash to bait the DP  was awesome. Double jumping at different times was putting in good work. I would have liked to see the Sin play it a little lamer though. He sacrificed eating to leap in a little too much and was really getting anything off of the pressure. I hate how much of the matchup involves slidehead and blocking beakdriver until they are low on food.

There was  a few times where you lost out on damage to bait bursts that didn't happen. Was that more trying to read the Sin player, or is that just how you take the matchup since resetting into neutral is so awful? I'm curious if the burst baiting is more the matchup or just more your style/more your knowledge of the local players?

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Really solid matches. The empty cross up superjump into backdash to bait the DP  was awesome. Double jumping at different times was putting in good work. I would have liked to see the Sin play it a little lamer though. He sacrificed eating to leap in a little too much and was really getting anything off of the pressure. I hate how much of the matchup involves slidehead and blocking beakdriver until they are low on food.

There was  a few times where you lost out on damage to bait bursts that didn't happen. Was that more trying to read the Sin player, or is that just how you take the matchup since resetting into neutral is so awful? I'm curious if the burst baiting is more the matchup or just more your style/more your knowledge of the local players?

Going back to neutral would've been awful because I was low health so it was do or die. I also tend to try and bait bursts when I play normally too.

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Just checking, you can't throw a guy while he's stunned by blitz but you can throw a guy if he whiffs blitz, right? So a guy can blitzback to eliminate his stunstate only to be throwable?

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Just checking, you can't throw a guy while he's stunned by blitz but you can throw a guy if he whiffs blitz, right? So a guy can blitzback to eliminate his stunstate only to be throwable?

That is correct. Being rejected is basically being in a hitstun state, but using blitzhield puts you back into a normal state. Though doing something like Potemkin Buster to counter reverse blitz is suboptimal. 2H/6H are more optimal to punish counter blitzshield, or even counter 6K>PB if you really want the post PB knockdown. Especially since you can YRC OS against blitzbacks.

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Try to keep these questions in the general discussion thread~

Just checking, you can't throw a guy while he's stunned by blitz but you can throw a guy if he whiffs blitz, right? So a guy can blitzback to eliminate his stunstate only to be throwable?

You can grab blitz. So what a lot of characters can do after a ground rejected opponent is run up > FD cancel the dash > then do 4H or 6H. If they blitz, you get throw otherwise you'll get your attack.

 

 

Especially since you can YRC OS against blitzbacks.

How do you YRC OS blitzbacks?

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Just like what dot nova said in an earlier post, you can block sin's slide (elk hunt) then punish with pot buster unless he chains or jumps.

To add, my sin partner claims that he's forced to jump out in response to seeing pot IB his elk hunt because he still gets pot busted if he tries to chain it to anything.

236K on IB is -2, potemkin buster is 3 frames of start-up. This means that Sin either has to jump, backdash, or hawk baker on reaction. You can try to read jump or backdash but if Sin has a lot of food then you might just eat a DP to the face.

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i have troubles vs sin super, looks like if he can make you block a elf hunt or beak driver when he has 50% of tension, it's a free meal? what it's a good way to deal with this, outside of avoid the beak driver (very difficult). 

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It's really hard to punish his eat if you're in blockstun + RC slowdown. I don't recall ever being able to punish it.

 

If he doesn't spend meter, 5H > hammerfall works I believe. You can also YRC when you're out of blockstun for the slowdown and then 5H  > hammerfall him since hitting him during eat is CH.

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