[Xrd 1.1] Venom gameplay discussion thread

[Reki]

There are very few changes to his basic bnbs. Even his more complicated 1.1 stuff is still possible on some of the cast.

Honestly, if you're going to pick up Venom now, you can only stand to gain from it. Even if his combos did change drastically, the general mindset behind the character probably never will. Learning when and where to set balls and how to use them effectively is far more important than drilling any combo.

Hey hey hey, QVs getting less blowback is a huge thing. Universal crouch confirm will probably go from 2K,2D to something like c.S(1),S-qv,5P-ballhit,IAD~

[SnowMonkeyFunky]

1.1 is out, here's what I've got so far

Venom specifics:

-K ball oki isn't completely dead. The regect zone appears to only be dead in front of the Blitz-er, so if you were in a situation where K ball oki would lead to a crossup you should be golden.

Personal shakycam evidence: https://twitter.com/SnowMonkeyFunky/status/596519272253362176

-It seems like sometimes it won't get regected in the front either sometimes. Using jS to BH from a midscreen 6H leaves you outside of regect range when blitz triggers, so you're still pretty safe there too.

More shakycam: https://twitter.com/SnowMonkeyFunky/status/596531424838217728

 

-Still testing, but Reki might be right on that combo being universal. (need to sj>IAD on certain characters. Will make a consolidated list as I work)

 

-At its new final height, P ball can not be low profiled by Ky's Stun Dipper. Exponentially more useful zoning tool in that matchup now.

 

Overall system:

-FD does NOT protect you from projectile blitz. If you are in range you will still be rejected.

-You can blitz bursts now which is hilarious.

[LockedAndClush]

My experiments with Sol, Ky, Venom and Elphelt lead me to the conclusion that you can't reject airborne opponents from the ground, no matter how close they are. So if the rejection occurs on even the very last frame before landing, you're safe (unlike Leo's counter, which I assumed might be a benchmark for the new Blitz - thankfully not). Projectile oki is still a go-to for many characters, the BS change affects projectiles in pressure more.

I might be wrong, of course, since I only tested it for about an hour. Still, the new BS seems a viable, but not game-changing tool.

EDIT

Scrap all that. Ground to air rejecting works, but of course requires being very very close (like "dashing into your opponents head" close). Of course it can be thrown off by just landing etc, but we'll see just how much this affects Venom.

[Justice7541]

2x Ball Set > Sitnger or Carcass seems pretty legit now. There does seem to be a bit of a gap so it's not quite meaty but depending on the setup you go for it may not necessarily allow them to get out. Need to experiment a bit more with it.

[DaiAndOh]

If you mean on okizeme, one ball set into Stinger or Carcass is the standard.

Snow but the details of the latter. The former is a P set into level 3 Stinger which spins into level 4 and then shooting that out ASAP (6HS? to cover space?)

[Justice7541]

Might as set two now since you're charging anyway. 21[4]S~[P} 6S etc. Haven't really had the chance to experiment if there's any particularly strong 2-ball > Stinger setups that can be done yet.

[DaiAndOh]

While interesting you can get the second set while maintaining charge, you only have so much time to set and then charge the stinger before your opponent gets up.

SADLY, you can't get the autoset after a QV, have to input manually to summon cancel after QV.

[Pomparomp]

What can people actually do about looped p ball > 2s? Is it possible to jump out or something?

[sweetvids]

Havent played alot of xrd but if its anything like the S ball>2s block string in AC and they're executing it properly then no. You should see a pushback from the 2s. If not then there's a gap that can be punished. Should still be the same principle in Xrd.

[BurkishMan]

K ball oki isnt as bad as i thought it would be. First off if the opponent doesnt have 25 meter,the oki is the same as the old version. Also there are many safe setups/ways to bait out blitz shield so you get a free counter hit combo.

[SnowMonkeyFunky]

Just don't hit the ball then do whatever you planned if you want a CH.

I'd still rather keep them still. As a general rule of thumb, go for cross up K ball as often as possible, but if you know you'll have to land in front hit the ball with jS. It 'should' leave you out of reject range.

[BurkishMan]

Just don't hit the ball then do whatever you planned if you want a CH.

I'd still rather keep them still. As a general rule of thumb, go for cross up K ball as often as possible, but if you know you'll have to land in front hit the ball with jS. It 'should' leave you out of reject range.

Is there a downside on using jS as apposed to jK

[SnowMonkeyFunky]

It's harder to time, hits sooner so less frame advantage when you get there, and vs some low crouchers at some ranges it may whiff. Something like corner combo ending in 6H xx K ball oki with jS vs crouching Faust and maybe Millia/Venom/etc will whiff.

It's hard to compensate for midscreen, you just need to time it, but in the corner with the new sped up autoset, you can do combo > 6H xx P xx K set dash jS to hit both balls and every character has to deal with it.

Video example:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PQnjiZLZV9Q&t=9m8s

[Justice7541]

So using the hold auto-set now:

 

S > P > Stinger: Balls travel in a < pattern.

- If you use H Stinger and then S > P > Stinger again you will get a 3-way spread.

- If you use S Stinger the ball will bounce back to right in front of you so you can 5P it for slow forward-moving ground coverage.

- If you put out the H Stinger the moving balls usually get you enough time to charge a level 2 S Stinger so you can ricochet it off the H Stinger ball still floating out front, for a full charged set ball.

[Lynxfort]

In wiki c.S is -8 i think that for the 3rd hit which whiff if opp was crouch.. in this case what about second hit ?? how much it on block ??

[DaiAndOh]

In wiki c.S is -8 i think that for the 3rd hit which whiff if opp was crouch.. in this case what about second hit ?? how much it on block ??

While this is calculable...it's a lot so don't. Cancel it.

[Lynxfort]

I see..Another questions
 1- What is my best options after  S Stinger YRC ??
 2- And how about a separate Oki and setups thread ..?? since oki and setups are important part of Venom's game..

[DaiAndOh]

1- Depends on the spacing of it. S Stinger YRC is best in close and mid distances though and will usually be resetting your pressure by rushing back in.

2- There is. You just found it.

[SnowMonkeyFunky]

So XrdR had/is having(?) its first loctests. All I heard about Venom on Twitter from Fino is that he "thinks" Dark Angel was changed a little more but other than that the same as 1.1.

Should we really expect a huge overhaul to how Venom functions? Or for that matter any changes at all since, barring the lack of AC 6P, this is the "dream version" of Venom right now?

[BurkishMan]

Did he mention if it was better or worse?

[BurkishMan]

Did he mention if DA was better or worse?

[SnowMonkeyFunky]

My Japanese is borderline nonexistant, so I had to rely on Google translate. All he said according to that was "changed." Whether he thought it was better or worse was lost in translation.

[DaiAndOh]

It sounds like everything is exactly the same outside the new mechanics. Of course those will have an effect on Venom (I'm actually a bit excited for a potential midscreen knockdown off Dust! Make it more rewarding!)

Also Burst-Enhanced Dark Angel....more hits/chip could be great to close out a round but more damage.....ehhhhhhhh depends which direction they take it I guess.

Given though that seems to be it...not sure a new thread is necessary at this point.

[SnowMonkeyFunky]

I feel like this current loctest is moreso to get a feel for how people approach the new system mechanics and to get a handle on balancing the new characters. If we see any kind of overhaul to the current cast, it will definitely start to show at the next loctest.

Everybody spam the JP Venoms on Twitter to demand AC 6P back in the loctest feedback.

[Justice7541]

I'd rather have 6K although I'm fine with both.