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Bandit Revolver

Ragna Critique and Self-Improvement Thread

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I'm posting this here because I consider it self improvement and some of the stuff I need help with is all around and not just specific to Hazama.

Alright, so I was using Ragna last night, and my friend plays with Hazama and I realized how tough of a matchup this is for me.


Can someone give me pointers? 

Its hard for me to apply pressure or to win the neutral game against Hazama. Here's Why.

Hazama's flashkick move has an insane hitbox, has invincibility frames, is air unblockable, and I cannot punish with any of Ragna's normals (Hazama goes waaaay too far back) when barrier guarded in the air. In fact, I can't punish anything of Hazama's because he goes way too far back on block or his moves leave him on + frame. This is the only matchup where I have found Ragna's appendages to be very unsatisfactory. Well, nu-13 is hard for me, too, but not this hard. Speaking of nu-13; that character just wins against me for free.

Hazama has air to air superiority in every way against Ragz. Hazama's rapid j.C beats out EVERYTHING, even if he's below ragna, above ragna, same height as ragna and I do j.B, j.C, j.D, belial edge, and blood scythe, it doesn't matter, Hazama's j.C is godlike, and when he mashes it and lands, his 5C is air unblockable, too, so now I gotta watch out for that, and I can't even punish it afterwards because he'll either cancel into stance or 3C beats all my normals.

Hazama's D movement is a pain in the butt, too. I was 6A'ing the hell out of it at first, but he got smart and started changing the movement, and baiting me with empty D attacks, and going behind me instead. I have no idea how to punish the behind attack because it happens so fast and it messes up my command input. I try Inferno Divider, but it does not auto correct sides and I end up whiffing and getting punished. The fast movement (I'm not familiar with Hazama's moves) started stuffing my 6A because it came out way too fast to react to after the snake bites. Also, I had to really think about the Anti Airs, because he kept poking with D and retracting them instead of moving so that I would whiff.

God, and after every match its so much disrespect when Hazama pokes Ragna's dead body and talks about my sister. -.-;

Someone please help me, how do I (in the words of Ragna the Bloodedge) "Kill that Sonnuva B####!!!" ?

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Hazama's flashkick move has an insane hitbox, has invincibility frames, is air unblockable, and I cannot punish with any of Ragna's normals (Hazama goes waaaay too far back) when barrier guarded in the air. 

 

dash 5B? that seems to work for me.

 

Hazama has air to air superiority in every way against Ragz. Hazama's rapid j.C beats out EVERYTHING, even if he's below ragna, above ragna, same height as ragna and I do j.B, j.C, j.D, belial edge, and blood scythe, it doesn't matter, Hazama's j.C is godlike, and when he mashes it and lands, his 5C is air unblockable, too, so now I gotta watch out for that, and I can't even punish it afterwards because he'll either cancel into stance or 3C beats all my normals.

 

hazama's aerial normals should be the least of your worries. i can tell though that since you're complaining about 5C being air unblockable, that you're spending way too much time in the air. ragna's neutral is best on ground, not in the air. you should spend most of your time on the ground. that way, if hazama does 5C afterwards, you have an easier time dealing with any followup he does.

 

Hazama's D movement is a pain in the butt, too. I was 6A'ing the hell out of it at first, but he got smart and started changing the movement, and baiting me with empty D attacks, and going behind me instead. I have no idea how to punish the behind attack because it happens so fast and it messes up my command input. I try Inferno Divider, but it does not auto correct sides and I end up whiffing and getting punished. The fast movement (I'm not familiar with Hazama's moves) started stuffing my 6A because it came out way too fast to react to after the snake bites. Also, I had to really think about the Anti Airs, because he kept poking with D and retracting them instead of moving so that I would whiff.

 

5A is a good alternative to 6A, as it's fast and often stuffs hazama's approaches. of course, hazama can still beat you out of 5A if he uses chain into j.A or early j.B, but there's no reason to be too scared of that. it's better to try and beat hazama out of any momentum rather than hazama set up all over your face.

 

in short, you have to start playing more patiently. hazama has much better space control than you, so in order to get in on hazama, you have to look for those golden opportunities to advance and wail on him.

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I won't deny that I do spend alot of time air dashing in. Its a fault of mine. Half the time I forget that I can't barrier guard cancel my air dash because I try to bait the flash kick and end up doing a j.B on accident. Dash 5B doesn't work for me unless I instant block or chicken guard with barrier. 

When I was complaining about 5C being an unblockable anti air, however, its not because I jump in alot, its because he'll end his combos with reset attempts in which he forces me above him, j.C's, land's before me and 5C's me while I'm just barely in the air, so I have to barrier guard. After my barrier, its his free mixup. When I caught on, I started ID'ing his mixup attempt so then he started throwing in the bait and destroying my whiff. 

Furthermore, my biggest problem isn't Hazama's damage output, its how insane of a reversal character he is. Me and my friend play offline, and his reactions/reads/yomi level are actually pretty godlike. 

I can't mix him up. His defense is outrageous. 

Here is what I try at the wall. 

Mixup 1> 2B,6B, 6A
Mixup 2> 2B, pause, 2B
Mixup 3> tick throw
Mixup 4> After a wall stick combo - 3C, jump cancel, j.C
Mixup 5> After a wall stick combo - 3C, jump cancel, empty jump, 2B (I see SKD do this alot)
Mixup 6> 2B, 5C, Gauntlet Hades
Mixup 7>  2B, 5C, 2D

And finally, 2B, 5D, Dead Spike, wait to see what he does and inferno divide whatever the F##K comes out!!



These all worked at one point, but after a few rounds, his adrenaline was pumping and nothing escaped his eye, making this matchup ridiculously hard. His neutral game is so strong, and Jabaki ruins me. Positive Frames, Sends me flying, puts me just the right distance to make him safe from my normals on block. 

I was a broken man. 
 

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I want to throw it out there that I was winning by double, because I put more time into the game, but it was annoying that he was able to keep up just with Hazama's reversals, lame game, and day 1 bnb's. 

So I'm here to just see if there's something wrong with my methodology. 

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When I was complaining about 5C being an unblockable anti air, however, its not because I jump in alot, its because he'll end his combos with reset attempts in which he forces me above him, j.C's, land's before me and 5C's me while I'm just barely in the air, so I have to barrier guard. After my barrier, its his free mixup. When I caught on, I started ID'ing his mixup attempt so then he started throwing in the bait and destroying my whiff. 

 

the only time i can see him "forcing" you into the air is when you tech after a combo. in which case you should probably change when and where you tech.

 

Furthermore, my biggest problem isn't Hazama's damage output, its how insane of a reversal character he is. Me and my friend play offline, and his reactions/reads/yomi level are actually pretty godlike. 

I can't mix him up. His defense is outrageous. 

Here is what I try at the wall. 

Mixup 1> 2B,6B, 6A

Mixup 2> 2B, pause, 2B

Mixup 3> tick throw

Mixup 4> After a wall stick combo - 3C, jump cancel, j.C

Mixup 5> After a wall stick combo - 3C, jump cancel, empty jump, 2B (I see SKD do this alot)

Mixup 6> 2B, 5C, Gauntlet Hades

Mixup 7>  2B, 5C, 2D

And finally, 2B, 5D, Dead Spike, wait to see what he does and inferno divide whatever the F##K comes out!!

 

the problem isn't hazama's reversal being godlike (because it kinda isn't, honestly), it's that ragna's mixup is really monotonous and incredibly straightforward. once a person gets to know ragna's mixups, you can expect him to be blocking just nearly every mixup he has. his mixup is just that bad.

 

what really separates the ragna players who win from the ones who lose is the unpredictability factor. you can't be using mixups that everyone sees/uses all the time (such as what SKD does). evolve your mixups from time to time so that your opponent never knows what to expect.

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just remember that neutral isn't always about who gets a hit on who, it's about controlling space and understanding when you have small advantages and taking advantage of them

 

spoiler, you're ranga so in most matchups the advantage in neutral is with the other player (even if you're both doing nothing), since ragna doesn't have good ways to control space

 

against characters like hazama, since he's better at controlling space than you, you need to try and figure out how to use their decisions in neutral to get yourself into the area that you control best

 

this is more general fighting game neutral advice than ragna advice, but yeah, you know, whatever. bb is a neutral heavy game and i see too many ragna players going full dumb ass to not think that this advice will be helpful.

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bb is a neutral heavy game and i see too many ragna players going full dumb ass to not think that this advice will be helpful.

"Just DP dawg"

 

 

But seriously everything these two just said pretty much nails it.

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Thanks for the help guys. I know all you can provide is general feedback without me having footage, so I'll set up my hd capture card one of these days. 

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I need to learn to TK aerial Blood Scythe, right now my midscreen combos feel to fall short and end with DID prematurely. I hate it 'cause it's so inconsistent, I can do it cold 90% of the time but in the middle of combos I always end up getting the slow version :|

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Try the input:

2147D, or if that's the one you are currently using, try 7214D (whilst buffering the 7). I personally used to use 2147D, but then I switched it up to 7214D as I found it to improve my consistency.

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I've tried both but still the same problem, doesn't work mid-combo. I guess I'm pressing the button too soon. They should just make it aerial only like Valk's 214B XD

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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kjLHWyzomPw&list=UUSWFwW7yDCCwwajY97IaZ3w

 

Hopefully I'm back in action of uploading again. This is not entirely organized but a good mixture of some Ragna and Bullet in action. Enjoy or feel free to critique. A part 2 of this will be uploaded next week.

 

Not much to say about the Ragna but that you're doing a nice work with him. Decent mixups, good neutral and a very aggressive style.

Gonna suggest learning better corner routes for now.

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Thanks for the advice as usual Tong, I'll go ahead and browse the corner route just to open up the play floor. Maybe I'll start skimming some BK set-ups since that's going to cost me one of these days not knowing them.

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHDUZU9V4sc&list=UUSWFwW7yDCCwwajY97IaZ3w

 

Last video for the week, feel free to critique or just enjoy the show.

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5XUS-ekqg9s&list=UUSWFwW7yDCCwwajY97IaZ3w

Just supporting the cause as your daily Ragna. Feel free to watch or critique if need be.

 

Hey man, watched a couple of your videos, and from what I'm seeing, your ground and air-to-air game are fine.  What you should really work is confirming from, and doing, anti-airs.  I saw you call out a few jumps with 6A, but didn't confirm off it.  The Jin and Azraels I saw you play pretty much go to jump around on your head all day.  Gotta make them respect that area.

 

Other than that, fine job tbh.

 

P.S. Run-up Crush Trigger on their wakeup.  Bad habit, or missed input?

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Before I dive into critiquing your matches, I'd like to first re-iterate that this is a critique thread and that the information I'm about to give you serves no other purpose than to help you with your gameplay or to point you out to a couple things. In no way am I trying to change the way you play or put you down for the things you may or may not be doing. I write this for the intent to help you, not offend you. Remember that these are just suggestions, and you're free to do as you please following the critique.

At first it was difficult for me to come to grip with what was going on in those matches because everything was just happening randomly and too fast. I feel that your play with Ragna was a tad sloppy in the sense that you were just throwing normals out here and there, you literally ran into the opponents normals, several dropped combos, and just a whole bunch of other random stuff going on. Now I'm not saying that Ragna needs to be played in a specific way or less randomly, but it seems as though there was no thought behind the majority of actions you took when playing those matches. It looked like a mindless Ragna just mashing several buttons. That's just what it looked like to me. On the flip side I could be wrong, because there was a point during those matches where I thought you were sandbagging your opponent, maybe that's the reason for all that randomness going on? I don't know, but it did carry on for several games. I'm not really going to talk much about combos because I know you know better routes than most of the stuff you were doing, we talk about combos all the time on twitter!

I think your neutral could be a tad better too, you didn't look too dominant at neutral, and there were times that you'd let your opponent get in for free. Especially in the mirror match, well spaced normals and a good neutral game is imperative. Sometimes you were a bit too patient when there were opportunities to go ham on the opponent. Again I can't fault you for that because maybe he's conditioned you to being that way?

When you had opportunities to deal heavy hits on your opponent for whiffing a DP, you most of the time punished with 5B. There were a couple of 2Cs, no 5D(1) > CT. In the end I think you ended up dropping the punishing combos iirc. Take your time with punishes, especially when baiting ID. You have plenty of time to think and act accordingly. You need to break out of autopiloting 5B when you punish something.

I lost count on how many times you autopiloted 6A AA > GH. Now I understand the benefit of doing that, but you need also consider the risk in that autopilot and other options. 6A is a big normal to commit to as an anti-air. If you hit with it, great, you can confirm into GH. If it happens to be blocked and you autopilot into GH and that's blocked (which happened countless times), you'll end up being punished. Sometimes I suggest leaving the 6A hanging because that way you can see if you get a CH and followup with a better combo (5C or 3C). That too comes with it's risks, because if it's blocked, you can also be punished on a stand-alone 6A. This is why I believe you should alternative between GH and hanging 6A, to condition the opponent to expect either or, and not just press buttons carelessly. Most people won't act fast enough to punish a stand alone 6A, compared to increasing the risk of being punished after using GH.

If there are opportunities to punish with 5A instead, go for that, which you correctly did on several occasions when you confirmed into 5A AA > 5D. That was pretty sweet.

On a last note, I believe using CT in a combo is only worth the meter if either one of the two criteria are going to be met:

- you are going to kill the opponent

- the resulting combo does at LEAST 500 extra damage

You did a Throw > CT combo that did ~300 extra damage than what the normal throw combo would have given you. I don't think that was worth using CT. That's just my personal belief regarding the use of CT in combos. You're free to agree/disagree.

I don't really have much else to say at present. I need to look over the last couple of matches and see If there is anything else~

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A very long set of Ragna mirrors:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5uAhP5C3Pzk

 

Feel free to evaluate my peformance since this is the point of the thread :p

 

Your buttons lack conviction. You must understand that they each have a beginning, middle and end, like all things do. If you couldn't defend each and every button press in a court of law, you should reconsider pressing it in the first place.

 

They are each unique, you bring them into existence and you will be judged by those who look into the past through them - they are your children. Nothing happens without a reason, and I even began to think you were just pressing buttons for fun. You're throwing your helpless babies against a brick wall.

 

In other words, that HF>Tsuika>RC>HF combo was an abortion.

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Hey man, watched a couple of your videos, and from what I'm seeing, your ground and air-to-air game are fine.  What you should really work is confirming from, and doing, anti-airs.  I saw you call out a few jumps with 6A, but didn't confirm off it.  The Jin and Azraels I saw you play pretty much go to jump around on your head all day.  Gotta make them respect that area.

 

Other than that, fine job tbh.

 

P.S. Run-up Crush Trigger on their wakeup.  Bad habit, or missed input?

I notice I get a lot of 6A confirms too but I don't react on enough of them unless they're counter hit, I blame myself for lack of committing on the hit confirm without the CH state. When it does hit I momentarily hesitate whether to follow up with jC or go into Gauntlet Hades depending on how far they are, the hit stun is so short I miss the opportunity to roll with it but in hopes that the opponent respects the are and tries a different approach. The dash up crush triggers or random ones are just finger slips so there's some salt when that happens but I gain heat like a madman so it isn't much of a loss. I apply CT mid-combos or blockstring if that helps out any.

 

Thanks for the input, I'll find a comfortable universal route very soon for most of the cast when it comes to 6A.

 

Tong

 

I speak with you all day on Skype so you have my two cents on your style. There's a couple of bumps in the road to go through before you're legitimately terrifying but I believe you'll reach it, the whole Bloodedge group is knowledgeable with Ragna through-and-through and this is how far I've gotten thanks to the help. 

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8B_9aatE7sM&feature=youtu.be

I'll watch your videos soon kid and critique them myself if you still want some insight on your style. I didn't know you posted in here because I was too busy playing P4U2 to know that the Ragna boards still existed, I'm a few weeks out of practice but please enjoy. Critique if you find it suitable.

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