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[CF] Blazblue CENTRAL FICTION: News and Gameplay Discussion

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1 hour ago, Devdan said:

Yes, let's split the tiny BB playerbase even more, ug. Nobody cared when Revelator didn't have a dub because Sign's dub was terrible. This is different...

I totally cared with Revelator, though. I enjoy the game way less than Sign.

I agree that it's even worse with Central Fiction.

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6 hours ago, MaximusMurkimus said:

But if they do so in order to get a dub, it'll be worth it. 

Best compromise they could do is release a sub-only digital version this year to appease the ones who want to play immediately, and a proper dubbed physical release next year. Hell, they might even get multiple purchases. 

But as it stands, they're not getting a single one from me. 

 

Inb4someonebuystwotomakeupforit

Or provide a dub with the inevitable Central Fiction Extend.

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I'm in favor of a quick Western release since it means you reduce the player base split that's created in the Western fanbase when there's a long delay, caused by some people buying the Japanese version of the game and others just waiting for the Western one. Also a faster release means we'll be able to see the conclusion to Blazblue's story more quickly.

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12 minutes ago, Leiopelma said:

How interesting. Where does that leave us on tracks?

Es, Mai, Nine, Hibiki, Naoto, Izanami character themes. Ragna vs Izanami theme. New opening theme. Astral theme probably. And, Nine has a special vs theme, no? That does make 10 unfortunately. Guess that deconfirms more characters to come. There's always hoping for Extend I guess..... (watch it not get an Extend as an excuse for Mori to not have to make Jubei playable, and i'm sure he'll get killed off in the story so Mori can be like "oh, he's dead, so, we can't make him playable now, sorry!")

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FUCK!

Looks like we got our answer. Figured it was a possibility. Not sure why it takes that long but they did it for CP.

The second part hurts the most though, now all hope is dashed.

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28 minutes ago, TekkamanArk said:

How interesting. Where does that leave us on tracks?

Es, Mai, Nine, Hibiki, Naoto, Izanami character themes. Ragna vs Izanami theme. New opening theme. Astral theme probably. And, Nine has a special vs theme, no? That does make 10 unfortunately. Guess that deconfirms more characters to come. There's always hoping for Extend I guess..... (watch it not get an Extend as an excuse for Mori to not have to make Jubei playable, and i'm sure he'll get killed off in the story so Mori can be like "oh, he's dead, so, we can't make him playable now, sorry!")

http://vgmdb.net/album/59650

How long i have to read all this whining about Jubei and dub?

 

 

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2 hours ago, Number 13 said:

Worth noting the BB mobile game back in June is technically the first BB game that didn't bother with an English dub.

I just said the same thing over the ASW Voice topic, so yeah, ironic, isn't it.

Either way, I'm surprised we're getting the LE stateside, that, and the Es DLC free for a limited time. But yeah, we get it on the no English dub thing, stuff happens, but oh well.

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5 minutes ago, Calamitus said:

How long i have to read all this whining about Jubei and dub?

Depends. How many sins did you commit in your previous life?

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52 minutes ago, Leiopelma said:

So November huh. Damn that Special Edition looks cool, especially that art book. Too bad I refuse to buy it because I won't support the game that much. I'll try and get the game used because I can't accept this but need to get closure.

 

8 minutes ago, Calamitus said:

How long i have to read all this whining about Jubei and dub?

I'm sorry, are you SERIOUSLY comparing our anger over the exclusion of an element that has been here since the beginning and is present throughout literally the entirety of the gameplay experience at the climax of the story to the people who complain about and bash every single character for not being the one they want despite Mori flat out explaining the difficulty with him?! Jubei bitching reoccurs with every single character announcement or the possibility of one due to a sense of entitlement born from a false concept of "roster slots" that makes them feel like they suffered because they didn't get what they want whereas the dub fans getting fucked over and losing something that has always been there is something that has specifically happened to us over the last two days (in fact the final nail in the coffin happened less than an hour ago). I'm not saying you have to like it but don't you DARE try and put those two things in the same boat, especially when they flat out rejected the one compromise that could at least somewhat appease both sides (a re-release/DLC with the dub)!

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1 minute ago, Ogiga99 said:

I'm sorry, are you SERIOUSLY comparing our anger over the exclusion of an element that has been here since the beginning and is present throughout literally the entirety of the gameplay experience at the climax of the story to the people who complain about and bash every single character for not being the one they want despite Mori flat out explaining the difficulty with him?! Jubei bitching reoccurs with every single character announcement or the possibility of one due to a sense of entitlement born from a false concept of "roster slots" that makes them feel like they suffered because they didn't get what they want whereas the dub fans getting fucked over and losing something that has always been there is something that has specifically happened to us over the last two days (in fact the final nail in the coffin happened less than an hour ago). I'm not saying you have to like it but don't you DARE try and put those two things in the same boat, especially when they flat out rejected the one compromise that could at least somewhat appease both sides (a re-release/DLC with the dub)!

Well technically, the dub hasn't been there "since the beginning" since it's something added for the English release, for English speaking players. A lot of fighting games don't even have dubs, or have on and off dubs, so it's not like we're entitled to a dub. Sure, we've had dubs all this time, but it's not like ASW has had a great track record regarding the English releases since CSEX, and the recent GG release didn't have one either.

Frankly, as someone who almost always plays with JP voices, I would say that I am more concerned about the quality of the translation or the presence of the Library than whether or not the English release is given a dub. When BBCP came out and did not have the Library, which legitimately is something that was supposed to be there and imo was way worse than not including the dub because they didn't even bother to announce that it was cut out, I certainly didn't see as much vehement and righteous complaining about its absence than I'm seeing from some people, who are basically spamming Aksys' twitter and saying they should all be fired for something that they clearly didn't have control over. 

DLC for the dub, while sounding good on paper, probably wouldn't be able to even pay even for the cost of the dub itself simply because not that many people would be willing to pay for it. 

If you really can't stand the game without the dub, then all you can do is buy it used or import. Or just don't play at all. 

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You know though, something I've always wondered is how much of the localization issues are Arc Sys's fault, and not the fault of game sales. Some of the issues seem to have nothing to do with cost, like the nonexistant QA of CS:Extend

 

Localization is a bit of a technical art, quite a bit more goes into it then just translating a script.  For example, I heard Ni No Kuni was a horror to translate because each writer had programmed their own system for text, and it wasn't well documented.  How difficult a game is to translated is often times due to how the original studio treats localization.  A studio that is localization aware makes game much easier to port than one that tries to get it ported after the fact.

 

With that in mind, I've always wondered how Arc Sys handle's their localization jobs.  If Arc Sys is a terrible studio to work with, that might explain some of the issues.  It might explain why Aksys stopped localizing after the 2nd game; why CS:Extend had so many issues after taking so long to come out, despite having minimal additions, and so on.  The issue might not just be cost and unit sales, but also might be an efficiency issue as well. (I'd love to hear someone from Aksys talk about their experiences with Arc Sys from back when they localized CT and CS!)

 

The idea isn't crazy either.  Remember that time when Guilty Gear got released on PSN with an untranslated Move list and it stayed like that for over a year?  Arc Sys has had odd localization issues for years.

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1 hour ago, Ogiga99 said:

...flat out rejected the one compromise that could at least somewhat appease both sides (a re-release/DLC with the dub)!

I wouldn't say "flat out rejected". They said there are "No plans... [at the moment]" which suggests there is a chance it may happen if there is enough demand for it.

 

What I'm worried about however is how many people will actually buy said hypothetical dlc. I'm willing to, but all I have is a PC, and if ASW ever releases CF there -which they might- it'll be at a much later date, so whatever willingness I have to pay for a dub may not be relevant for this timeframe.

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6 minutes ago, edscissor said:

I wouldn't say "flat out rejected". They said there are "No plans... [at the moment]" which suggests there is a chance it may happen if there is enough demand for it.

 

What I'm worried about however is how many people will actually buy said hypothetical dlc. I'm willing to, but all I have is a PC, and if ASW ever releases CF there -which they might- it'll be at a much later date, so whatever willingness I have to pay for a dub may not be relevant for this timeframe.

The DLC would be $30 on top of a $60 game, so no one would buy it.  You know such a DLC would be priced like that and for $30 you could buy a good game that's already in English.

 

I wouldn't be half surprised if Story mode is untranslated.  (That would create a ***storm the size of Texas if it did.)

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1 hour ago, Calamitus said:

Thanks for the link. A pity it won't include Mai's theme. I hope that Mai's theme will get a vocal version though, since Saori Hayami is a great singer.

1 hour ago, terizent said:

DLC for the dub, while sounding good on paper, probably wouldn't be able to even pay even for the cost of the dub itself simply because not that many people would be willing to pay for it. 

Yup. Dubbing is the most expensive part of creating a localization. Spending all that money on a DLC that only a small minority of players would buy would be a terrible business decision.

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Maybe they will dub it in the inevitable extend version if we give them the money, they have chosen not to do one but it doesn't mean they will do one later because this is the same situation that happened with CP.

P.S. We may have to keep mailing Arcs about it to get through to them, and make them understand that even though dubs are expensive it is worth it.

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3 hours ago, terizent said:

Well technically, the dub hasn't been there "since the beginning" since it's something added for the English release, for English speaking players. A lot of fighting games don't even have dubs, or have on and off dubs, so it's not like we're entitled to a dub. Sure, we've had dubs all this time, but it's not like ASW has had a great track record regarding the English releases since CSEX, and the recent GG release didn't have one either.

Frankly, as someone who almost always plays with JP voices, I would say that I am more concerned about the quality of the translation or the presence of the Library than whether or not the English release is given a dub. When BBCP came out and did not have the Library, which legitimately is something that was supposed to be there and imo was way worse than not including the dub because they didn't even bother to announce that it was cut out, I certainly didn't see as much vehement and righteous complaining about its absence than I'm seeing from some people, who are basically spamming Aksys' twitter and saying they should all be fired for something that they clearly didn't have control over. 

DLC for the dub, while sounding good on paper, probably wouldn't be able to even pay even for the cost of the dub itself simply because not that many people would be willing to pay for it. 

If you really can't stand the game without the dub, then all you can do is buy it used or import. Or just don't play at all. 

Don't try and get smart with that "technically" thing. I am talking about the beginning of the English releases. That is the version I am taking issue with, the Japanese one is irrelevant. Plus that isn't entirely true since at least CP (not sure about the ones before it) had the English voices for the battle dialogue in the Japanese release. The dub is a feature that has been a constant for the English speaking players so we are still losing it. Whatever other fighting games do is irrelevant because they are other games. It's not entitlement, it's the omission of a feature that has been in the game for all 6 previous releases. In comparison Guilty Gear only had a dub for one, it is completely different in terms of scale of fans and expectations. We are being asked to pay the same price for a game that has a major feature removed (again on that you are hearing every single second you put into the game). Arcsys's track record has not been good true, but the actual dub performances has still been great so they're failure at localizing is the problem, not an excuse.

As you said, this still won't fix the quality of the translation but rather, makes it worse because of the discrepancies between the Japanese and English scripts. The dub uses the flawed translation so we cannot tell if anything is off but for the Japanese track I can spot many of the blatant screw-ups even with my 1st grade level Japanese which sours the experience. I can attest to this from playing XBlaze where they talk about the "Origin of the Grimoire" (should be Original Grimoire or Grimoire of Origin but apparently they don't know how possessive nouns work when it is the exact same issue as if Ragna had the Azure of the Grimoire) and Touya's mother Suzuko Kagari in CE (how can you possibly screw that up when you can clearly hear the name Ryoko and they sound nothing alike). I am not saying that the Library mode issue was not stupid and insulting but since the dub is something that is "supposed to be" in the English release (and especially so for CP since, as I said earlier, the English battle dialogue was in the Japanese version) it is still a major issue and objectively affects a much larger portion of the player experience. Library Mode didn't have as big an issue (even if the way they handled it was worse than now) because it only mattered to the hardcore story enthusiasts who are super invested in the lore. A dub is felt by every single player who prefers the language track, be they pure gameplay, casual story fans or story-first and again is felt for the entirety of the time you play the game. Of course there are idiots who do not make our position look good with their attacks on Aksys but that doesn't invalidate our point. The reason they gave is understandable, even if it is a result of the switch to Strangely Compelling that led to localization at a snail's pace.

Even if DLC wouldn't pay the cost, since it would force you to pay more money and make it less desirable, a full re-release probably would. If they announced that I would buy the Special Edition and then buy the game again on it's dub release, even if it took 6-8 months, just to support them for doing the best compromise they could. Of course the other side of the issue is how much of an effect the number of people who care about the dub and either don't buy it, import it, buy it used or wait for a price drop will have on sales. I honestly believe that if they had announced the reason for the lack of dub and added that they will fully re-release the game with the dub in 6-8 months that the game would be more successful because at least some of the people who are refusing to support the game will be able to accept this and change their mind and simply buy the game at that point plus there will be people who will buy the game twice, meaning more sales overall. They have made it clear that the issue with the dub is time, not budget, so the additional option (even if it was Digital only to save on production) can only make the number of sales go up if this happened.

I am aware of this but the fact is they chose the absolute worst time to do this. Central Fiction is the climax of everything that has come up to this point and as a story fan first I am trapped by that. I can't import because that would mean no story at all and I can't not play because I am way too invested at this point to walk away. I do intend to get the game used if possible but that's all I can do.

 

2 hours ago, edscissor said:

I wouldn't say "flat out rejected". They said there are "No plans... [at the moment]" which suggests there is a chance it may happen if there is enough demand for it.

Perhaps that is true but it is a very slim chance. I have messaged both Arcsys and Aksys to politely explain my support of a dub re-release and I encourage others to do the same.

2 hours ago, Leiopelma said:

Spending all that money on a DLC that only a small minority of players would buy would be a terrible business decision.

This is why I'm annoyed that everyone is ignoring the tweet mentioning multiple releases and focusing on DLC. On forces you to pay a larger total sum for the dub at all while the other gives people the option of waiting and getting the games with dub at a normal price or double dipping if you are willing to do that. Everyone acts like dub fans are a small minority but that is bs. If they handle this properly they could save many of the lost sales and the fan base has proven willing to double dip just by looking at the number of people who import but then buy the English version to support the localization.

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13 minutes ago, Leiopelma said:

Thanks for the link. A pity it won't include Mai's theme. I hope that Mai's theme will get a vocal version though, since Saori Hayami is a great singer.

I'm sure they will include it in the complete CF soundtrack, Song Interlude is just a bonus for LE after all. Personally I would like to hear a vocal version of "YOMOTSUHIRASAKA".

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42 minutes ago, edscissor said:

I wouldn't say "flat out rejected". They said there are "No plans... [at the moment]" which suggests there is a chance it may happen if there is enough demand for it.

My guess is that they want to sound vague because if they say "it's never happening", then that will piss people off even more.

10 minutes ago, Ogiga99 said:

Everyone acts like dub fans are a small minority but that is bs. If they handle this properly they could save many of the lost sales and the fan base has proven willing to double dip just by looking at the number of people who import but then buy the English version to support the localization.

I didn't mean to say that dub fans are a small minority. But I suspect people willing to pay for a dub DLC are.

7 minutes ago, Calamitus said:

I'm sure they will include it in the complete CF soundtrack, Song Interlude is just a bonus for LE after all. Personally I would like to hear a vocal version of "YOMOTSUHIRASAKA".

Yomotsuhirasaka is a good track. Bloodline is great too.

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26 minutes ago, Leiopelma said:

My guess is that they want to sound vague because if they say "it's never happening", then that will piss people off even more.

I didn't mean to say that dub fans are a small minority. But I suspect people willing to pay for a dub DLC are.

Is false hope really better though? People might be mad if they say it won't happen but those are most likely lost sales anyway. At the very least these last two days have shown that they are actually trying to be open with us for once so why tarnish that with vagueness in the tweet that is specifically supposed to be "for clarification" unless there is at least small possibility that it will happen later depending on how the release goes (namely the sales of the initial release and fan demand)?

Again you're completely ignoring the idea of a full re-release that Aksys themselves brought up. The number of people willing to pay for DLC might be small but the number of people willing to wait for a version with dub at regular price would be much higher (perhaps they could only release it digitally to not have to spend the money manufacturing a whole new set of physical copies and throw in the DLC characters as an added incentive). Both of those will make up a fair percent of the sales they have lost from the current situation.

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12 minutes ago, Ogiga99 said:

Again you're completely ignoring the idea of a full re-release that Aksys themselves brought up. The number of people willing to pay for DLC might be small but the number of people willing to wait for a version with dub at regular price would be much higher (perhaps they could only release it digitally to not have to spend the money manufacturing a whole new set of physical copies and throw in the DLC characters as an added incentive). Both of those will make up a fair percent of the sales they have lost from the current situation.

Even if they don't go to the expense of releasing a second physical set of the game, announcing that they're releasing another version months down the line with added content would simply encourage people not to buy the current version. Seems to me that they'd be shooting themselves in the foot. And trying to sweeten the deal by handing out DLCs for free would simply cost them more money.

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