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[CF] Blazblue CENTRAL FICTION: News and Gameplay Discussion

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18 minutes ago, Airk said:

As long as BB keeps making money, they're not gonna end it.  Simple as that. And it's still making money.  All this "but...but... they could stop making it!" stuff is nonsense.  They COULD.  They could also decide that they want to fire their whole art department and have all graphics just be stick figures.  But they won't, because it would be dumb. :P

I agree that ASW has very poor planning regarding release dates, however.

Yeah, and Dark Souls 3 is making hand over fist making the most it's ever made. Doesn't change the fact that it's the definitive end for the near future. And that's a game that's actually making bank, not a 'somewhat profitable' release. Any way you want to try and flip this, everything points to Arcsys focusing on something new (not Blazblue) very, very soon. Between sprite-based artwork dying out (even the new Igavania game, "Bloodstained" is 3-D model based), the PS3 generation coming to an end, and Ragna's story ending, it's genuinely hard to fathom a new (non-extend) Blazblue after CFEX. Again, not that it could never happen, it'd just be a title on hold for Guilty Gear amounts of time.

Hell, I think a Guilty Gear X Blazblue game is more likely to come before a next-gen Blazblue.

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1 hour ago, ThatHiroGuy said:

Yeah, and Dark Souls 3 is making hand over fist making the most it's ever made. Doesn't change the fact that it's the definitive end for the near future. And that's a game that's actually making bank, not a 'somewhat profitable' release. Any way you want to try and flip this, everything points to Arcsys focusing on something new (not Blazblue) very, very soon. Between sprite-based artwork dying out (even the new Igavania game, "Bloodstained" is 3-D model based), the PS3 generation coming to an end, and Ragna's story ending, it's genuinely hard to fathom a new (non-extend) Blazblue after CFEX. Again, not that it could never happen, it'd just be a title on hold for Guilty Gear amounts of time.

Hell, I think a Guilty Gear X Blazblue game is more likely to come before a next-gen Blazblue.

Except they, you know, actually announced that this would be the last Dark Souls game, at least for now. So let me get this straight, somehow you are arguing that "because a series that made money but was announced as ending is still ending, that means a series that has been announced as not ending will end regardless of how much money it makes?" That is the most bckwards-ass logic ever. You are going into this actively assuming the developers are lying to you. If they say they're making more why would your first assumption be "but...but...but I have no proof they're going to make more until I see an official release or a trailer." Question, when CP was released and before CF was announced, did you assume that there would be no more BlazBlue games? OF COURSE NOT! You knew there would be another one because the developers told us CP wasn't the end. For some reason people think this is different just because it's a form of climax. It is the same with Kingdom Hearts. Nomura has been saying for years that the series will continue after KH3 and will still have Sora as the protagonist and that game is making boatloads of money AND is Nomura's dream project so there is zero reason to assume it won't happen. And if you were right about this being the last game, why would Arc System Works try to hide it? If this was the "grand finale of BlazBlue" wouldn't they hype that shit up? What better way to generate interest than to make the game seem as dramatic as possible. From a marketing perspective, it is in every way better to drum up publicity about a finale, and then come back to the series later with a continuation than it is to claim there will be more but then say "never mind just kidding." You are going out of your way to find every possible reason it could not happen ignoring the answer that has been explicitly given to us. Do you just hate BlazBlue and want it to end, because I see no other reason for such active negativity about this?

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I just want to remind you that the "Xrd Treatment" only exists because Guilty Gear didn't want to compete with Blazblue as a 2D Sprite Fighter. That means the inverse is also true. Whatever happens to Blazblue, it's not going to be the Xrd Treatment.

I think Blazblue might get a visual overhaul, with redrawn sprites and backgrounds to put them up to new graphical standards and effectively show that Ragna's not the protagonist anymore. Time for Linhua to take the spotlight.

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23 minutes ago, Volt said:

I just want to remind you that the "Xrd Treatment" only exists because Guilty Gear didn't want to compete with Blazblue as a 2D Sprite Fighter. That means the inverse is also true. Whatever happens to Blazblue, it's not going to be the Xrd Treatment.

Interesting, I haven't heard this before. Is there a source that I can read regarding this?

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3 hours ago, ThatHiroGuy said:

Between sprite-based artwork dying out (even the new Igavania game, "Bloodstained" is 3-D model based), the PS3 generation coming to an end, and Ragna's story ending, it's genuinely hard to fathom a new (non-extend) Blazblue after CFEX. Again, not that it could never happen, it'd just be a title on hold for Guilty Gear amounts of time.

Don't be silly. If Bloodstained "3-D model based" SO IS BB - have you ever read about the process they use to create the sprites?

PS3 generation seems pretty irrelevant, since this is an arcade title first.

Story is horsecrap. :P

If you seriously think Arcsys is going to let BB go fallow, you are nuts.

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But... wasn't there something about Mori wanting to take a break from fighting games? I could easily be mistaken, but if I'm right... are you guys ignoring it or have you written it off as "It's just gonna be a small pause."?

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3 hours ago, Ogiga99 said:

And if you were right about this being the last game, why would Arc System Works try to hide it? If this was the "grand finale of BlazBlue" wouldn't they hype that shit up? What better way to generate interest than to make the game seem as dramatic as possible. From a marketing perspective, it is in every way better to drum up publicity about a finale, and then come back to the series later with a continuation than it is to claim there will be more but then say "never mind just kidding." 

You're missing the all important phrase, "For the near future", when I say Dark Souls is ending. Making the assumption that I don't feel the same exact way about that as I do about this. I made the comparison because profitability is not always the concern when it comes to followups.That's to say, within reason obviously, profit doesn't 100% determine if Blazblue gets one or 5 more games. The same way that profit doesn't determine if Dark Souls continues. It's not backwards logic at all. This goes towards your point. At a certain threshold, it becomes more about what a developer/director wants, when, and how they want it to happen.

I actually like Blazblue more than any other fighting game out right now or in the near future, despite everyone around me moving on from it. I still think the same about Dark Souls what I feel about Uncharted, what I feel about Kingdom Hearts, Blazblue, and any other game in this situation though. They don't have the greatest amount of restraint, and want sequels/more money, but they also want to at least try to stay true to their vision in the story. They need to be able to hover around the idea of a continuation, as an easy cash grab, but to be able to do so without being held to any definitive statements or release/dev windows. Not to mention, (good) developers tend to want to experiment, and push the envelope in their genre, or others.

Ultimately, I'm just saying that this whole, "It's only the end to Ragna's story" thing is something you (probably) shouldn't just take at face value, in the way that you are, because it's left very ambiguous. Uncharted and Dark Souls directors at least gave their fans general criteria or ideas for if their franchises continue, and how after what they consider to be the, "End" of their stories. Dark Souls director even straight up said he wanted to work on other things for now. With Blazblue, what else is there to glean from their statement? They want it to continue after Ragna? It took 10 years for anything to come of statements like that from Nomura with Kingdom Hearts 3. Exaggerated situation because SE sucks, but you get the idea.

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11 minutes ago, Steve-Fiction said:

But... wasn't there something about Mori wanting to take a break from fighting games? I could easily be mistaken, but if I'm right... are you guys ignoring it or have you written it off as "It's just gonna be a small pause."?

A) I don't remember that

B) Mori isn't actually super important to the game

So...yeah. Not super deeply worried, frankly.

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2 minutes ago, Airk said:

A) I don't remember that

B) Mori isn't actually super important to the game

So...yeah. Not super deeply worried, frankly.

Thanks for the reply. I got it.

I looked up where I got that from and... it was Kotaku. And it was also worded very carefully. 

Quote

“Mori has said to me, ‘the next game I make won’t be a fighting game.’” indicating the current producer was looking to take a break from the genre.

If there are no other sources for this, you are probably right, and there is nothing to worry about.

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21 minutes ago, Steve-Fiction said:

Thanks for the reply. I got it.

I looked up where I got that from and... it was Kotaku. And it was also worded very carefully. 

If there are no other sources for this, you are probably right, and there is nothing to worry about.

Here is the japanese source for it: http://www.inside-games.jp/article/2015/05/13/87570.html

Mori said that after Central Fiction, he will rest and the next game he will make will absolutely not be a fighting game and will probably have nothing to do with BlazBlue.

Whatever there will be another BlazBlue or not after Central Fiction, it's likely that Mori will have less to do with it.

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2 hours ago, Rotlung said:

Interesting, I haven't heard this before. Is there a source that I can read regarding this?


It's from this presentation, go to 7:00.

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2 hours ago, Rotlung said:

Interesting, I haven't heard this before. Is there a source that I can read regarding this?

It was an interview that happened around Sign's release, so I can't really remember where I found it. You should be able to find it if you do a quick search though. Edit: SixWingedAngel got it. Nice one.

 

Now regarding Mori and breaks, isn't that how we got XBlaze in the first place? I vaguely remember something about Mori taking a break after a Blazblue release to do a non-fighting game and then XBlaze popped out.

Of course Arc Sys won't live off Guilty Gear and Blazblue forever, so investing in a non-fighting game can be a solid choice for a third flagship.

This is also good for us because it lessens the financial need for patches and revisions, so we get to flesh out metagames better without the fear of "Hey Extend was announced! My main is complete garbage right now, so instead of trying to bust out some new tech, let me learn how to play Ragna again." (Ragna is never bad at Extends. :v:)

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Yeah, gonna be honest, I'm super tired of yearly-ish updates, as much for the "Well, I'm just gonna wait for the next version before starting to play..." factor as anything else,  so if this game is actually stable for a bit, so much the better.

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Exactly. And this is the point I've been trying to make. I think they're aware that the landscape for the fighting game genre is evolving, or at least trying to. This is their time to innovate, and do what they did with Blazblue, just with a new IP. It could still be a fighting game, and I'd like to think if they took a break from Blazblue, it would be. They need to let this series breathe in a major way. It's good for everyone involved.

It's a new console generation, there's new tools and precedent for a new engine, Esports is on the rise and able to be integrated in interesting ways, etc etc. Blazblue isn't pushing an envelope in any way right now. Even Xrd is doing some interesting things as far as tutorials, and teaching goes. They either need to go back to the drawing board for a long time with Blazblue, or make a new fighter, or focus on Xrd.

 

 

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4 minutes ago, ThatHiroGuy said:

Exactly. And this is the point I've been trying to make. I think they're aware that the landscape for the fighting game genre is evolving, or at least trying to. This is their time to innovate, and do what they did with Blazblue, just with a new IP. It could still be a fighting game, and I'd like to think if they took a break from Blazblue, it would be. They need to let this series breathe in a major way. 

It's a new console generation, there's new tools and precedent for a new engine, Esports is on the rise and able to be integrated in interesting ways, etc etc. Blazblue isn't pushing an envelope in any way right now. Even Xrd is doing some interesting things as far as tutorials, and teaching goes. They either need to go back to the drawing board for a long time with Blazblue, or make a new fighter, or focus on Xrd.

Okay, I have no idea why you've spent your last 5 posts complaining and doomsaying then.

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On further reflection I also realize that not having a new game in the new future and CF not being the end of the series are not mutually exclusive since BlazBlue has spread out to be more than just a fighting game, spawning light novels, visual novels, manga and a terrible anime. It's entirely possible that the story will only continue in those mediums for a while. At the very least we need a continuation of BE because Naoto keeps referencing things we have never seen.

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28 minutes ago, Airk said:

Okay, I have no idea why you've spent your last 5 posts complaining and doomsaying then.

It's all in your interpretation, or frame of reference I guess? I certainly don't see complaining, or doomsaying. I'm not saying anywhere here that I dislike either route they take, just explaining why I personally think one route makes more sense than the other. Listen, just because you like something doesn't mean you have to deny the right to think critically or realistically about it. Just because I think something should take a long hiatus, and can point out the logical reasons why it would, doesn't mean I want it to. 

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41 minutes ago, Ogiga99 said:

On further reflection I also realize that not having a new game in the new future and CF not being the end of the series are not mutually exclusive since BlazBlue has spread out to be more than just a fighting game, spawning light novels, visual novels, manga and a terrible anime. It's entirely possible that the story will only continue in those mediums for a while. At the very least we need a continuation of BE because Naoto keeps referencing things we have never seen.

Let's be honest here, when did Naoto reference something things we've seen? :v: I even thought Bloodedge Experience was a Cash Grab Experience until Naoto got announced for CF.

 

Y'know what would be really cool? An official translation of all these novels most people couldn't read, or at least a legit Visual Novel adaptation so we can at least understand what's going on.

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9 hours ago, Airk said:

As long as BB keeps making money, they're not gonna end it.  Simple as that. And it's still making money.  All this "but...but... they could stop making it!" stuff is nonsense.  They COULD.  They could also decide that they want to fire their whole art department and have all graphics just be stick figures.  But they won't, because it would be dumb. :P

I agree that ASW has very poor planning regarding release dates, however.

They could put it on hiatus though.  Putting a series on break a bit, before releasing it can increase sales a bit and extend the life of a franchise.  It's what Capcom inadvertently did with SFIV (And what sory of bit them in the butt when then didn't understand why the same thing didn't happen with SFV).  That said, I'm not sure that Blazblue is popular enough for it to work well.

Ultimately, even if it's making money, sometimes good business sense says to do other things: Branch out, try to make some new IPs, prevent your old ones from burning out, and so on, unless you want to be...Capcom with all three of franchises that's its making right now (SF, Resident Evil, and Monster hunter), two of which are doing poorly at the moment.

 

That said, ArcSys really isn't a big company, so I'm not sure they have the resources to risk not making another BlazBlue.  I think we'll see more Blazblue in the near future, probably with a fresh coat of paint.

I don't think it'll be 3D though.  They've already gone and said that they made GG 3D because of how nice the BB sprites were.  I think they'll keep the sprites for the sake of uniqueness (and portability.)

EDIT

2 hours ago, Volt said:

Y'know what would be really cool? An official translation of all these novels most people couldn't read, or at least a legit Visual Novel adaptation so we can at least understand what's going on.

Honestly, I'd find it much cooler if they just gave some much needed editing to the story and cut most of the necessary parts out.

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7 hours ago, ThatHiroGuy said:

Exactly. And this is the point I've been trying to make. I think they're aware that the landscape for the fighting game genre is evolving, or at least trying to. This is their time to innovate, and do what they did with Blazblue, just with a new IP. It could still be a fighting game, and I'd like to think if they took a break from Blazblue, it would be. They need to let this series breathe in a major way. It's good for everyone involved.

It's a new console generation, there's new tools and precedent for a new engine, Esports is on the rise and able to be integrated in interesting ways, etc etc. Blazblue isn't pushing an envelope in any way right now. Even Xrd is doing some interesting things as far as tutorials, and teaching goes. They either need to go back to the drawing board for a long time with Blazblue, or make a new fighter, or focus on Xrd.

they could always do that Idolmaster vs. Love Live

4 hours ago, Narroo said:

That said, ArcSys really isn't a big company, so I'm not sure they have the resources to risk not making another BlazBlue.  I think we'll see more Blazblue in the near future, probably with a fresh coat of paint.

I don't think it'll be 3D though.  They've already gone and said that they made GG 3D because of how nice the BB sprites were.  I think they'll keep the sprites for the sake of uniqueness (and portability.)

well, GG's sprites were more than a decade old (they came from games that ran on the Dreamcast-based NAOMI hardware), so they had to do something new with it to woo in new audiences.Alternatively, they could do the Skullgirlls method for future BlazBlue sprites by making them literally hand-drawn.

4 hours ago, Narroo said:

They could put it on hiatus though.  Putting a series on break a bit, before releasing it can increase sales a bit and extend the life of a franchise.  It's what Capcom inadvertently did with SFIV (And what sory of bit them in the butt when then didn't understand why the same thing didn't happen with SFV).  That said, I'm not sure that Blazblue is popular enough for it to work well.

The reason why it took forever for a new Street Fighter game between III and IV is because the fighting game scene was in a slump across the 2000's. SNK went OOB, 3D "sidestepper" fighting games oversaturated the scene (thanks to Tekken, Dead or Alive and SoulCalibur), and Sammy vs. Capcom never took off. 

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5 hours ago, Domayv said:

The reason why it took forever for a new Street Fighter game between III and IV is because the fighting game scene was in a slump across the 2000's. SNK went OOB, 3D "sidestepper" fighting games oversaturated the scene (thanks to Tekken, Dead or Alive and SoulCalibur), and Sammy vs. Capcom never took off. 

I know, the whole thing was "inadvertent."  Some companies do realize that giving an IP a bit of a break can be beneficial if done right though.

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18 hours ago, Ogiga99 said:

and a terrible anime.

not gonna lie, that anime put me off anime for months and made me rethink why I liked Blazblue in the first place. i still have nightmares about the pace of the whole thing.

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1 minute ago, AchedSphinx said:

not gonna lie, that anime put me off anime for months and made me rethink why I liked Blazblue in the first place. i still have nightmares about the pace of the whole thing.

But the Terumi quality faces D:

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What you guys talking about? The Blazblue anime showed how terrible Blazblue's story really is as well as providing us imgur galleries of all the animation mistakes. It was truly a post-modern avant-garde masterpiece that didn't bind itself to pedestrian concepts like "pacing", "characterization" and "not being a pile of shit."

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I blame all the hatred you guys have against the anime to your habit of pausing to see the quality faces. If you just let the horrible pacing do its work of moving on fast enough for your brain to not notice the Quality you'd actually not want to claw your eyes out. :v:

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