Sol vs I-No

[VR-Raiden]

Let's discuss the Sol vs I-No matchup in Xrd.

 

Video Database:

Eng: http://dustloop.com:6608/?character1=so&character2=in

JP: http://horibuna.web.fc2.com/GGXrd/GGXrd_SO.html#IN

Frame Data:
Sol: http://www.dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=GGXRD/Sol_Badguy/Frame_Data
I-No: http://www.dustloop.com/wiki/index.php?title=GGXRD/I-No/Frame_Data

 

[SynikaL]

I could've sworn this matchup was discussed on this forum at some point?

In any case - I loathe this matchup, so let's galvanize discussion, please. I'm looking for some help. 

I used to think this matchup was pretty even but I'm not so sure anymore. Granted, my competition has improved recently and I'm standing in still waters due to taking a break from the game. 

Neutral: This is where this matchup seems deviously antagonizing. I'll just offer some admittedly sparse cerebrations on the matter (mostly the areas I personally have the most trouble). 

HCL ruins my day. Yeah, Sol has various movements that innately tech crouch HCL; but to think this provides some suitable or significant advantage in the concrete matchup is a bit of a misreckoning, IMO. YRC HCL is worse, of course. If blocked, the inclination is for I-No to AD in, at which point a reaction with 5k or VV takes care of that, since this is not a true block string. Offering that response instigates a Yomi set that sees her thoughtfully ending more block strings with Note and STBT, partially in hopes to free up her HCL option for the desired KD (if anyone could provide more insight as to why I-No would choose to use her other options I'd greatly appreciate it).

The Note option has to be hard read to be dealt with. STBT can be reacted to with 2K/2D. 

When Note is used at "Neutral" Neutral (i.e., when I-No is 3/4 of the screen away), she can set it about Sol's head-height, completely killing any of Sol's approach options outside GV. She can set it slightly lower, and watch the skies with her Air Command Grab, which has hilarious range. I haven't been able to consistently beat it with any button. And of course, she can make a hard-read with a high Note, if she feels as though Sol is looking to react to the Note by Dash Jumping over a lower option. This is her most risky option and will likely be least used as Sol can just Dash into her face if he reads this. 

I really find it hard to see where Sol outstrips I-No in the Neutral game, outside f.S. Gunflame's range, startup and position on the screen lose to HCL and doesn't do much to manipulate her in general. 5K is good for stopping her AD approaches but only if she's being mindless about it without frame advantage. Mild clairvoyance tells me that 6P would be a good tool, I'm not exactly sure where to apply it, specifically. It typically loses in the places where 5K works, in my experience. 

 

Oki: I generally prefer BR Oki to VV whenever possible and this matchup is no different. However, sometimes I find using VV enders unavoidable, to which I find the Oki situation... unsavory, to say the least. If Sol has momentum, Sol can end up at point-blank range from I-No with relatively weak frame advantage or even sailing over her and crossing-up into the corner if executed from mid screen. In the former case I often habitually execute cross-up j.K, which often loses to 6P/Throw OS  just as often; and in the latter case I often just attempt to escape the corner. YRC Gunflame Oki also seems weak in these instances. Noticeably, this isn't I-No specific. But because I-No is floaty, I find myself in these straits more often and end up improvising sloppy Oki that goes nowhere. 

This is all long enough so I'll stop here, for now. Hopefully, others can offer some helpful advice on the matter. 

 

- Kimosabae 

 

[LockedAndClush]

Been a while since I fought a competent I-No, but there was a time when I frequented that matchup, so I may be of some help. 

At poking-range neutral, 2S is your friend. You will go under HCL, get a counter hit against STBT (convert to 6HS for knockdown with good okizeme), it's plus on block and even whiffed recovers very fast. It will whiff a lot thanks to her hoverdash, but the fast recovery helps. Don't get too button-happy after she hovers over 2S though. Throwing out 6P in attempt to beat HCL also goes a long way, since the reward on CH is huge. The risk that comes with lengthy 6P recovery is definitely worth it, if you keep your attempts to a reasonable number. 

As for note at neutral/fullscreen, you have to respect it. Don't expect to get her for using it, focus on not blocking it. You won't get too rush her down for free when she throws it out, but you have plenty of options to avoid it. 2D for example, if it's done at the height you mention, it will go over your head. Obviously that doesn't give you the advantage and she will approach you, but you should recover on time to contest her approach then (keep in mind her YRC might screw this up, since 2D has plenty of recovery). She might get encouraged to do notes very low then, but that opens her up to a free IAD, and you being in her face on your terms is her worst nightmare. This way you can force her to attempt to use not just two, but three "variants" of the note, greatly increasing the chances of choosing wrong. 

Can't exactly help you with okizeme though, since I never had much issues with it against her. Barring using 50 meter for a super or DAA, she has no answer to anything at all. Safejumps mixed up with empty jump lows and even a simple grounded approach looking for things like 2S>Fafnir or tick WT are good enough, since she sucks damage up like a sponge. Don't overcomplicate it and try to predict these 50 meter option. You can even throw the startup of her ground Overdrive after superflash, which is optimal since it's unpunishable. 

[KenDeep]

You can run under HCL. Else use a lot of YRC to slow her down in Neutral, her HCL, STBT and Notes are only very annoying because they cover the screen quite fast. You also don't need a lot of meter for Setups and Hitconfirms since she lacks a really good reversal meterless, so you can opt for jump in->airdash/2K even without gunflame. You might give up a little bit on damage with not spending meter for confirms but it's completely worth it in the defense and neutral.

[SynikaL]

@LockedAndClush

Didn't know 2s could catch the low-profile of STBT and low profile HCL. That's really helpful! 

What kind of Oki do you like to do after CH 2s>6H? 

Is safe jump j.s a good enough setup for grabbing the Overdrive Reversal?

 

@KenDeep

I find that Airdash Oki loses a lot more to 6p/throw OS nowadays so I've gone away from it. I only go for it after I've qualified or disciplined them enough to stop using it. 

 

 

[VR-Raiden]

A few notes

Neutral

- 2S is indeed useful, not only because it hits STBT and crouches HCL, but it recovers decently fast in case she dashes in over it. She can hit you out of it with her own, faster 2S though.

- Sol can run under HCL but keep in mind if she does lowest TK HCL you get hit. Downside to TK HCL is it gives her more recovery.

- Neutral jumping with j.P/j.HS seems pretty good for space control in this match, she doesn't have a lot to hit upwards diagonally, and can't easily run under and anti-air you like other characters.

- Her 6P has very good invul properties so yeah you won't be landing j.K much if ever. Our j.HS does avoid it pretty well though.

Offense

- Definite best oki off CH 2S > 6HS is a delayed cancel to GF. You can get it super high advantage for no tension cost.
- Safejump does land you within throw range incase she uses Overdrive to dodge the safejump, just throw it right after flash (or Gold Burst). GV after flash also works, more useful at farther range.

Defense

- Against her simple 2D(?) > downward note oki, reversal HSVV can hit her for immediately dashing in but that's a guess since she can simply FD. A wrench I like to throw in is reversal Blitz the note then VV if you saw them dash in with an attack, and don't if they baited.
- Mashing VV/5K/6P at the right times in their pressure can turn the game around if you convert properly. On defensive you just have to be on your toes and not let her go crazy with pressure resets.

Side note I feel like this matchup is pretty even personally, and if any slight leaning to one side it's probly Sol's favor. I would say if any it's slighter advantage than some previous GG where it seemed harder for I-no from what I gathered (5K into SW loop and whatnot)