Zato-1 Ground Game: Combo/Pressure Advice and Assistance

[Antihero11]

If your spacing is right you can dash jump and do a flight mixup then -S- for the combo or to keep the blockstring going. Otherwise I tend to run in and start sandwich pressure with -P- into command grab unblockable or -S- unsummon combo. You should practise doing blockstrings with -S- instead of -K- because it uses a lot less Eddie meter so you can do multiple mixups. I recommend using -K- for the first move to get the opponent to block and then do -S-  or -P- for the rest of them. But I'm still learning so there are probably better strategies.

How exactly do you do -K- > 6P to bait DPs? I eat a DP every time I try. What's my blockstring for if they don't DP?

This I know the answer to, I practiced this in training mode since DPs are my number one pet-peeve. You actually need to delay 6P. It's counter-intuitive, but the head invulnerability frames on 6P come early. So you should do something like knockdown > -K- > slight delay on opponent's wakeup > 6P. If they respect it, you can do 6P > 2S > -K- again to go for a flight mixup. Or you can do 6P > 2S > -S- unsummon.

As a side note, I spoke with Marlinpie this weekend about Zato's worst MUs, his neutral, etc. So if anyone has questions, I may be able to help. I made top 16 at Summer Jam, but lost to a pretty strong bedman player from Virginia. I haven't grinded that MU enough. I also lost to Angryblack (a fairly strong May player). Once I learn both MUs, my performance can hopefully be better.

And listen to 9:02 PM, he's got a weird name, but everything he's said about Zato is 100% on point. Thanks for the informative posts friend!

[Toum]

I'm getting better at judging the spacing for the jump > flight mixup midscreen

If you do -K- > dash jump K > dj.KH and your double-jump hits, what kind of efficient -S- combo can you do ? I thought -S- was really useful when hitting someone airborne or after a 2D to launch.

(For now I still do -K- > dash 5P > 2D > unsummon, which isn't really powerful :p At least it pushes to the corner and let me resummon quickly)

 

EDIT > my bad, tested yesterday, you can j.KHD or j.KSHD after a ground -S-. So I presume you can do -K- > dash jump K > dj.K(hit)H > -S- > j.KHD. But you lose corner knockdown.

 

[Antihero11]

I would actually say simply dashing up and knockdown into unsummon is better than going for a -S- combo. Unless you're ending the match with the combo, it's usually better to knockdown into mixups, or unblockable. However, in the corner, doing something like j.K > 2D > -S > j.HS > j.D > shadow gallery can be really good. Since it adds tons of damage.

[PerfectInput]

, I may be able to help. I made top 16 at Summer Jam, but lost to a pretty strong bedman player from Virginia. I haven't grinded that MU enough. I also lost to Angryblack (a fairly strong May player). Once I learn both MUs, my performance can hopefully be better.

I play that bedman player A LOT he's a local in my scene, so he's picked up quite a bit of experience against Zato lately.  Bedman is so strong though so don't feel too bad.  He did take a game off MarlinPie too..

[Antihero11]

Yeah, I did some casuals afterward. And we went about 60/40. It's hard to find bedman players online. And my scene is me, a Faust player, and a Ky player. So MUs outside of online play are severely lacking.

Thanks for the encouragement. I've improved my Zato-1 recently by using summoning and unsummoning more reliably. I picked up Millia, since Zato's become a little dry and it's a nice change of pace.

[sparkanius]

I've played zato alot back when reload was a thing and had net play, I still play xrd, and the one thing I have to say is that you don't need to be ogawa to be able to win games, the one thing I think most people don't use enough is abusing the yfrc mechanic, and just basic footsies.
The fact that people play totally different from online, and what you get to practice in training.
I have a very "reactive" way of playing (loads of netplay experience), I will try and upload some vids, I'm just getting used to this forum thing.
My Nick I daniruru from Norway, play on the France region if any one wants to all or test stuff ?
Just thought I would chip in some thoughts^_^

[Antihero11]

Thanks bud. All our welcome here. There are many different ways to play Zato, and he's much different than his AC incarnation. But the fundamentals are the same. With Zato, you can play footsies, rushdown, and zone. But it's best to be able to adapt on the fly to all of his viable styles.

[sparkanius]

Here are some public matches, keep in mind that I'm not the best, and it's unedited, so you need to skip some parts, but for the most you can see what I mean about using yfrc to your advantage
https://youtu.be/JJwSaid91uo

[Antihero11]

Your neutral is definitely pretty decent Spark, but a lot of the players you were facing weren't respecting your anti-airs and they were air teching way too soon.

Optimal setups would help you a lot. Like learning unblockables, safe eddie summons and unsummons, etc. If you just let the shadow meter run out like that, good players will blow you up.

Just trying to be perfectly honest, I do think your neutral is fairly strong though. Do you have a local scene you could play where lag and mashing isn't as prevalent?

[PerfectInput]

having some trouble landing an unsummon combo after 6D with eddie out.  Any tips/advice/ easy setups you recommend?

[xXavierx]

having some trouble landing an unsummon combo after 6D with eddie out.  Any tips/advice/ easy setups you recommend?

The fastest possible way to unsummon is to jump cancel the 6D animation. You can input the unsummon during the end of the animation of the wallstick so it should look nearly instant if you do it right. From there you can just do a short combo into knockdown. 

[GuruguruMawaru]

Hello, I have 2 questions.

1. I finally was able to perform Sako's combo and I want to know if there are any practical uses for it. Does it have any advantages compared to regular mawaru corner carry combos?

2. Is there any use for iad combo (or blockstring) patterns like this:

 ...5S, iad, -P- ,jS, -P-...

Also can it be started with 2D, iad... (if opponent is blocking ofc), or there will be a window?

 

Thanks in advance.

[PerfectInput]

What is a safe unsummon block string on the ground for zato/eddie? is ending in 2S the best option for unsummoning?

[www.keeponrock.in]

1 hour ago, PerfectInput said:

What is a safe unsummon block string on the ground for zato/eddie? is ending in 2S the best option for unsummoning?

I believe ending in nobiru is the best for unsummoning.

[PerfectInput]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlKNmD12bjA

 

The point in this set up, after the wall splat I'm having a very hard time landing the resummon combo.  I can see whats happening but as far as execution I'm a little lost.   I can never get shadow gallery to combo after the ground portion of the combo.  I see -a- 2k -a- 5a -a- shadow gallery -s-        is it just tight timing or am I missing something in here?  I'm assuming you have to tigerknee the shadow gallery from the 5a but I cant get it to all connect.   any advice?

[Antzer]

I keep having a weird reoccurring issue with Eddie during unsummons. When I go for the unsummon combo off of a 5d or after a nobiru (sometimes with even a near full Eddie gauge), the Eddie meter will go into the red recovery state instead of white. This happens to me randomly in training mode an in actual matches. Does anyone have an idea of what I'm doing wrong? 

[Flick]

you might have release D before doing the unsummon. Next time, make sure you still holding D down when doing unsummon motion

[Nemroth]

Hey guys! I was wondering what's the best way to summon eddie ? Is it best to use direct summon or should i just do 236HS -button-? I keep asking myself if we get a faster startup.

[DrKatz]

On December 29, 2015 at 0:20 AM, Nemroth said:

Hey guys! I was wondering what's the best way to summon eddie ? Is it best to use direct summon or should i just do 236HS -button-? I keep asking myself if we get a faster startup.

It depends what you want to do. In a blockstring, it can be better to summon with 236S if you think they'll jump at you or IAD. Summon with 236P if you want to catch them mashing since startup is pretty quick. Summon with 236k if you're feeling confident they'll respect you , or you're close enough that they probably won't have time to jump or mash out.

236HS is usually best used for full screen so you can load buttons during the animation. So you could do something like 236HS (Hold S), so you're ready to anti-air if they jump in. You can do the same in blockstrings if you don't want to commit to a certain option. Generally 236HS is better since it provides you with more options. But 236S is pretty solid as an anti-air if you read them or want it out in case they try to rush you.

Hope that clarifies or makes sense?

[Nemroth]

On 30/12/2015 at 7:58 PM, DrKatz said:

It depends what you want to do. In a blockstring, it can be better to summon with 236S if you think they'll jump at you or IAD. Summon with 236P if you want to catch them mashing since startup is pretty quick. Summon with 236k if you're feeling confident they'll respect you , or you're close enough that they probably won't have time to jump or mash out.

236HS is usually best used for full screen so you can load buttons during the animation. So you could do something like 236HS (Hold S), so you're ready to anti-air if they jump in. You can do the same in blockstrings if you don't want to commit to a certain option. Generally 236HS is better since it provides you with more options. But 236S is pretty solid as an anti-air if you read them or want it out in case they try to rush you.

Hope that clarifies or makes sense?

Can't make it any clearer. Thank you very much for taking the time to answer my question. This will help me a lot in the future!

[DrKatz]

Hello fellow Zato mains. I finally got into the habit of using -P- in blockstrings instead of mawaru. But people keep jumping out preemptively. 

I was wondering how you deal with people who up-back vs Zato all day? I can't seem to find any reliable way to punish it.

I was also wondering what Zato's optimal punishes are for a baited burst or dead angle. I've tried going for his command throw, but I still get mashed out most of the time. And it seems like people can block immediately following a baited Dead Angle.

My last question is what are some good pressure strings to practice in training mode which don't involved mawaru midscreen but are still frame tight? 

I'll be forever in anyone's debt if they can answer these questions!

[xXavierx]

If they want to jump out you can use -S- to get an air combo if they're not using faultless immediately. Once you are better at -p- blockstrings you will know at what points your pressure is frame tight and when it is not so you can begin planning for jumps better. Air throwing is always an option as well if the player is consistently jumping at the same point in your pressure. The safest option would be to do -S- and unsummon. On hit you can continue to air combo but on block you are still positive. 

The frame data for blocked dead angles vary for the cast but you should at least be able to punish with jab to a short combo. If the dead angle doesn't hit Eddie and you block it you should punish with a simple combo to knockdown. If it hits Eddie you can punish with whatever you want since you won't be in block stun.

Zato punishes on bursts depend on if Eddie was hit with it or not. If he was, you won't really get too much damage unfortunately but you can keep momentum and begin stalling for Eddie's recovery. The easiest way to pick up a combo after a burst is with standing P so you can construct a combo based around 5p > Jp > Jhs > Jd. You could add in Executor for a hard knockdown if you want to spend meter. If you're really close when they burst you can add in a close slash but generally you're pushed out a bit too far. If Eddie avoided the burst and you are able to do tk shadow gallery loops you should try to go into that. More commonly though Eddie will die from the burst so I wouldn't worry about that too much in the beginning. 

The basic pressure string to practice is 5p/2p > 2k > dash while -p- hits > repeat. This is frame tight if done correctly and acts as a 50/50 because you can mix in a command grab when you want. This also goes back to the original point of knowing when your strings are no longer frame tight as this is when they'll start trying to jump away fearing the command grab. If the opponent is sandwiched between Zato and Eddie you won't have to dash but hold 3 sometimes during the string to move Eddie back to keep the sandwich since -p- will move Eddie throughout the string. 

[DrKatz]

Thanks for the feedback. Sandwich pressure is pretty easy for me to establish and execute successfully. But I have a lot of trouble doing 2P > 2K > -P- > (dash) 2K > -P- and repeat.

I always miss the timing after 2K or -P-. How tight is the timing?

[KurlyBandit]

You can delay the -P- after the 2K quite a lot since 2K is + even on block. Aim to release -P- during the dash. Also make sure you know the timing for when 2K recovers so you can dash as early as possible

[DrKatz]

Thanks it seems that 2K has massive hitstun because it leaves you at +3. But -P- has very little hitstun, so you need to chain 2K immediately after it, right?

My stick setup isn't the best either. I use the default configuration. But I'm too used to it now to change it.