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Zephyrion22

[XRD] Sin Kiske Video/Match-up analysis thread

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Well, since other topics have this kind of thread, Officially opening one here I guess !

This thread's goal is to use videos of Sin players and analyze their decisions when pitted against x or x character/player. This is pretty important for Sin. Since, you know, not having real setplay  means that you'll have to commit to playing an immaculate spacing game and consider their options all the time.

 

I'll open the ball with a textbook Sin vs Ky match between Zadi and Ain. I advise you to watch the match entirely once and then look at the timestamps and commentary

 

 

 

Ok, let's start this  !

5:07 Ain and Zadi are staring at each other round start

Spoiler

This is pretty much due to the fact that Ky's  slight step> 2D is very good at round start against SIn since it's a 7 frame move (+1 frame of walking if done right), therefore beating Sin's f.S and 2S. Here's the catch though, 2D is punishable by itself, and even if Ky special cancels it, he risks being punished as well (Sin's 236K passes under Stun Edge, both Stun Dipper and Greed Sever are punishable and Split Ciel whiffs at this range). Ky's f.S is one frame slower than Sin's S button, so it's not really a round start option against Sin. All the other options at this range are punishable or interruptable, so it's a high commitment as well. Therefore, Ain prefers to check what Zadi will do instead of exposing himself.

5:12 Both players do a dash barrier brake simultaneously

Spoiler

Barrier braking is very important for Sin since it allows him to be safer and play the spacing game better. This also applies to Ky for the exact same reasons. Both players are still "testing the waters" because they don't want to be caught pressing a button at the wrong moment.I recommend checking all the moments the players are Barrier braking  to get a better grasp of it !

5:14 Sin's backdash gets punished by Ky's f.S, even though he whiffed his 2K

Spoiler

SIn's backdash is great, but in  the Ky matchup it can be really risky to use, because of how damn good Ky's pokes are in term of range and recovery. This kind of thing may look unimportant, but it can easily tip the scales for Ky, which is just bad

5:20 - 5:23 Zadi uses his DP to stop Ain's offense, and then baits and punish a burst

Spoiler

This is a great read from Zadi, which allows him to steal almost half of Ain's life and completely reverse the flow of the match in an instant. Holding 1/4 after Elk Hunt is pretty much a free burst bait, and Ain learned it the hard way. Sin has many other ways to bait bursts, and the rewards he gets from punishing them is huge, especially in this kind of match-up where getting a hit is hard

5:32 :5:50 Zadi stays fullscreen and tries to lure Ain in, but fails and ends up the corner

Spoiler

A valid strategy, but Zadi was the first to make the mistake. When fullscreen against Ky, you either want to play conservative like this, or break his zoning using Beak driver (236H) and Elk Hunt(236K) .

5:53 - 5:57 Zadi gets punished for attempting a backdash and burst at the end of the combo

Spoiler

questionable backdash from Zadi, who probably baited something that didn't happen. Bursting at the end of a combo like that might seem dumb, but Ky can't bait the burst without an RC at this point, and the burst allows Zadi to break free from corner pressure and okizeme, so  it's actually a pretty clever decision

 6:14 Round 2 start

Spoiler

Zadi interrupts Ain's round start f.S with 2S, and gets a knockdown and corner carry. As said before, f.S is risky for Ky against Sin at round start, unless you're sure the Sin player will respect you

6:20 : Ain escapes while FD flickering

Spoiler

Great use of fuzzy jump by Ain to escape from pressure before it even begins. This is particularly efficient to escape loose blockstrings, and Sin has an hard time keeping people to block midscreen, so it was a  clever choice !  This happens a few other times in the match,  so be sure to check the flickers !

6:22 - 6:32 Neutral !

Spoiler

Zadi and Ain dancing around each other, Ain gets a f.S and a small blockstring but that's pretty much it for more than  10 seconds. Note that Zadi shifts to a much more agressive playstyle than in the previous round, actively trying to break Ky's spacing

6:35 Zadi does a j.D > YRC to bait Ain's 5H and punish it

6:37 ...and completely fails to capitalize from it and end up dropping the combo and eat at the Ain's face and get swept

Spoiler

A common misshap for Sin players.  More often than not, when you're not sure f.S/2.S >236K will connect, it's better to delay your 214H to avoid finding yourself in this situation !

6:39 Another instance of Zadi's "evasive defense"

Spoiler

Zadi loves to alternate between FD and IB constantly, even if it means risking getting opened. His goal is to force Ain to exhaust his pressure options with IB and force a whiff with FD. this way, he forced Split Ciel to whiff several times, allowing him to return  to the neutral game

6:53 - 6:56 Ain sees Zadi attempt a safe-jump, then backdashes and punishes it with a backthrow

Spoiler

This is what caused Zadi to lose the second round. Safe-jumping was not a bad decision in itself, but he could have used the DP OS at this point to avoid this ( safe jump 623K - S : doesn a DP when the j.K whiffs)

7:15 Round 3 start  

Spoiler

Ain learned his lesson : step 2D to avoid getting beaten by Sin's 2S. but Zadi was prepared and IBed the 2D.  Ain was punishable at this point, but Zadi probably waited for a special cancel to occur, and Ain preferred to walk away

7:28 Zadi burst at the exact same point as before

7:35 Zadi opened Ain with a frame trap after 236K

Spoiler

This frame trap actually grows stale very fast, but using it at the right moment can turn the tables easily, as shown here. In this matchup, mind the 5K that comes out in 5 frames, causing it to trade with Sin's K button. It loses to 2P but you will rarely be at range to use it (except if the opponent IBed 236K in which case you shouldn't ty to reset pressure)

7:37 Zadi's j.6H is blocked, and then he performs a dash 6H

Spoiler

Using 6H after j.6H this way is a very high commitment bait : it kills backdashes and buttons,but loses to throws and reversals. Here Ain chose to keep it simple and block, even if it means dealing with frame advantage.

7:52 : after staring at each other, Zadi commits to 2S, which gets beaten cleanly by Ain's 214K (Greed Sever)

Spoiler

An often forgotten use of Greed Sever. Ain saw Zadi getting antsy and hitting his 2S several times, and then caught up to it, and punished him hard for it.

8:08 Zadi, after attempting to fuzzy jump out of Ain's pressure several times and Ain reading them all perfectly, tries to get out by hitting j.S and fails, costing him the match

Spoiler

As you probably realized, Sin's air-to-air game is okay, but Ky's is vastly superior. So as a rule of thumb, you shouldn't try to contest it when you're on the defensive, unless you smell an airhtrow and want to stop it

 As a final note, great match from both players !  A few blunders from Zadi and a very solid  and unpredictable play from Ain allowed the latter to be victorious !

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Currently prepping the next match analysis for this Week-end probably  ! From now on, if you want a specific match or character to be analysed,or have any question or comment about what's in there, make sure to ask it here !

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Currently prepping the next match analysis for this Week-end probably  ! From now on, if you want a specific match or character to be analysed,or have any question or comment about what's in there, make sure to ask it here !

Great job getting this started! I'm working on one as well, I just wanna do actual voice over for it.

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Ok this next video is a match between min(Sin) and Sharon(Elphelt). This time, I picked a match that is everything but conventional. You should watch it once !
 
 
 
13:35 : Round start...with Bull Bash ? Actually, yes. Sharon is very conservative when he plays Elphelt, and jumps a lot to benefit from Elphelt's awesome air game. Unfortunately for him, he didn't expect something so wild as Bull Bash round start, got caught tensionless and ate it for big damage and corner carry
 
13:41 : min goes for a fuzzy airdash mixup, opens Sharon and... resets with j.D ??? Honestly can't say if he auto-piloted his pressure, or genuinely went for a reset since Elphelt lacks good reversal options. But it worked !
 
13:45 : Empty jump 2P hits...into dash corner throw ??? Sharon was probably so mindfucked he didn't even tried to mash out, resulting in yet another reset
 
13:49 min does the burst safe variation of the combo...and waits for a burst that doesn't come out
 
13:51... only to late leap into yet another reset leading to a dizzy, then resets the combo with a burst safe charged Beak Driver
 
14:00 Round 2 start, min not afraid of Elphelt's options in the slightest, goes for a ballsy f.S,  backdashed by Sharon
then he proceeds to harass him, not missing an occasion to leap above grenades
 
14:06 min whiffs his jump-in because of 2S and it's insane low profile, and gets thrown. The Elphelt classic, that works incredibly well against Sin because of how crappy his jump-ins are. j.H at low height should beat it, though, so if you expect it to happen, modify your jump-ins accordingly
 
14:09 Great backdash through Elphelt's 6H from min ! Try to do it whenever you can : Even if you mistime it, she'll only get a knockdown from it which is bad, but almost just as bad as blocking it to end up being shotgun pressured. Also sends the message again to Sharon "I'm not going to respect you in the slightest, stop me if you can"
 
14:12 After getting out of the corner, min calls out the air Bridal with a well-timed 6P and forces Sharon to burst. Sharon could have saved his burst, but probably felt compelled to burst early because of min's agression.
 
14:30 Sharon does 6H into Pineberry, and gets caught by a reactionary f.S from min, losing his chance to push him further into the corner. Sharon often loses chances to go ham and prefers to reset the neutral game, and min exploited that too !
 
14:31 Air Bridal whiffs and is properly punished with a 2K into a small combo
 
14:38 Backdash YRC into X move is the best way for Sin to interrupt Shotgun pressure if you call out a pattern, which min did.
 
14:41 min goes for a cross-up jH into 214S to open up Sharon, but fails his confirm
 
14:45 min after knocking down Sharon, goes for exactly the same mixup, and Sharon failing to react, loses the match
 

This match was "Yolo" at its most quintessential level ! But this utterly wild way of playing shook Sharon's footings,who failed to adapt during the match, and in Japan, one match is enough. min also showed he knew both the Elphelt matchup and Sharon's habits. We can't know how much of the BS displayed is deliberate or not, but a part of it certainly is; and it worked ! So when everything else fails, embrace the yolo !

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any video that properly shows how to deal with Milia and zato match ?
also potemkin. i know its a good match-up for sin. Except if that potemkin player is super good.

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any video that properly shows how to deal with Milia and zato match ?
also potemkin. i know its a good match-up for sin. Except if that potemkin player is super good.

Well, I have a few videos in my mind for those MUs, I can send a message with  some links for them. If it's for a real MU analysis, though, It'd be great to choose one specific MU, since it's a bit time-consuming and all !

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Here comes the Potemkin MU !

A lot of people would call this Match-up free for Sin, but even if Sin does have the advantage, It's still a relatively finnicky MU for him !

I decided for this one to pick one video. featuring FAB against Zadi !

 

7:19 Round start : FAB does 2P and Zadi respects it

 

  Sin can't contest this reliably : You either have to block it, backdash, jump back, or try to jump forward to apply pressure. the latter is not recommended since Potemkin recovers in time for a 6P, and if he didn't commit to 2P round start you're screwed

7:23 After backing off from Potemkin and doing dash FD brakes, Zadi uses his first 236H

 

This is actually quite important if you want to deal with the MU. 236H is an incredible tool against Potemkin : blows Hammer fall clean, controls space greatly, and is super safe. Be wary though, a good Potemkin player can and will blow you if they predict it, and/or you slightly miss the optimal spacing. So you'll have to know when NOT to use 236H. Also, don't always use it even if you're at the right spacing, being unpredictale with it makes it all the more useful !

7:24 -7:27 Zadi pressures for a little bit then resets neutral

 

Potemkin  Buster is to be feared in this Match-up : it's a 3 frame command throw with insane range, meaning that most of Sin's frame traps revolving around Elk Hunt, 6H and 2P are a lot more risky. Zadi plays it safe and goes back to Beak Driver range

7:29 After having applied 236H pressure, Zadi baits the Slide head into an optimal punish, and forces FAB to burst

 

This is what it means to not always use Beak driver : Once Zadi established that FAB had to do SOMETHING to deal with it, he called it out and blew it.

7:45 FAB Hammer Falls through 236H's second hit and YRC it regain advantage. Zadi denies that by using Staff Rain follow-up:

 

a Good Potemkin player can and will use a well-timed Hammer fall to absorb the second hit of 236H while making the first one whiff. When that happens you can either YRC your 236H or use the follow-up to stop him in his track

7:47 - 7:59 Zadi does everything to stay at optimal range, and doesn't use Beak driver until he gets there

:

Considering Beak Driver as a panic button is a very bad idea, you'll see why soon, don't take unecessary risks because...

8:00 -8:09 Zadi tries to air-to-air against Fab, gets KOed by his j.D, and eats two Potemkin Busters in a row, completely reversing the flow of the match

 

As he was nearing the corner, Zadi tried to get some breathing room by knocking FAB away. But FAB didn't miss this long-awaited chance of getting a good hit on Sin. This results in the grappler mindgame and Zadi lost 2/3 of his life to it. Mistakes cost very dearly for both sides here !

8:11 Zadi proceeds to backdash YRC to escape from the blender

 

Sin's DP is easily baited and punished by Potemkin on whiff, so the safest option is to backdash to get out of throw range and then YRC to avoid getting hit by a f.S or a 2D

8:17-8:21 After getting cornered,FAB neutral jumps and tries to get out while Zadi constantly charges 236Hs

 

Corner is terrible for Potemkin in this MU, not because of pressure and lockdown (Potemkin can deal with Sin's pressure pretty well) but because he has no way of repositioning himself to beat Beak Driver with Hammer Fall, Slide Head or Mega Fist (the hopping punch). If you had to use Beak driver sparingly before, at this range, you can go ham and force him to just deal with it !

8:29 Zadi fails to confirm his charged Beak Driver, and gets thrown

 

Mistakes on your spacing cost dearly, but drops do all the more. Potemkin doesn't have anything that can be low-profiled reliably, and his Anti-Airs are really good. His lack of mobility sure is bad for him, but it also means his normal mobility  options are perfectly safe. That means you won't get a lot of good clean hits on him, so every bit of damage you can squeeze of openings is worth the trouble

8:35 Zadi IBs FAB jD and punish it with a throw, sending him back to the corner

8:37 -8:50 After a war of attrition, FAB mega fists, and reverses Zadi's FD input, causing him to 6H into the megafist and lose the round

 

Zadi's decision to break the spacing is debatabale but also understandable. As you've probably guessed, eating on neutral against Potemkin is fairly risky because of Hammer Fall and Slide Head. So he probably felt antsy  tried to end the match before running out of calories

9:01 Round 2 start ! FAB with 2P, and Zadi this time jumping back

9:15 9:19 Zadi decides to pressure FAB, pushing him in te corner and harasshing him with charged Beak Drivers...

9:20 ...Then eats, YRC, sees a Hammer Fall Brake that didn't come out in time, and punishes it with a Beak driver Counter Hit

 

This is how strong Beak Driver is in this MU when used at the right times : Don't forget that two Counter hits from Beak Driver with good confirms lead Potemkin to the brink of death, so exploit that to your advantage !

9:22 FAB bursts to corner Zadi, who quickly proceeds to escape from the corner

 

Stating the obvious, but don't get cornered by Potemkin : Sin's backdash is one of the only sure ways to deal with Potemkin's command throw mindgame, and this option is pretty much out of the way for Sin in the corner, as a well-timed 6H  with the following combo in the corner can kill, or nearly kill almost everybody in the cast if it dizzies

9:28 Zadi calls out Slide Head with 236H and gets another counter

9:42 and 9:49  After cornering FAB and pressuring him, Zadi YRCs and reposition himself the first time, and YRCs and tries to Anti-air the second time, resulting in a Danger Time clash

 

This is a trend of the Match-up and in GG in general that Zadi takes to the extreme : FD and YRC are invaluable in this game, and keeping your tension for them is a good idea. but Zadi almost always hog all of his meter solely for those. FD allows him to jump safely, do FD brakes to space his Beak Drivers perfectly, and push back Potemkin whenever he can. YRC acts as a safety net whenever he feels there's even a slight chance he might get blowned for not playing the spacing game right, as well as making his backdashes safer. check those throughout the match !

10:13 After getting cornered by FAB Zadi does a ballsy dash under Potemkin's jump-in, and then backdashes to re-establish neutral

 

Obviously a very risky thing to do, but since you're bound to get your ass handed to you in the corner, might as well try to do everything in your power to get out when you have the chance !

10:25 As the timer runs out, FAB tries to break Beak Driver's pressure, but this time Zadi is ready and welcomes him with a 6P

 

Great decision from Zadi, but suboptimal confirm that actually didn't kill because of Potemkin's high guts. as I've said, squeeze all the damage you can get !

10:33 Zadi closes it out by calling another Slide Head

10 38 Round 3 start ! FAB with yet another 2P and Zadi this time neutral jumping it. to try and force him to block j.6H, FAB recovers in time to Slide head, but Zadi also recovers int time to block it

 

This is why 2P round start can't be messed with. Even when Potemkin does something incredibly risky, it is still hard to catch up, and you take a lot more risks than he does when you try to blow it. Just bow to the mighty 2P and wait for your chance later !

10:43 Zadi Leaps on FAB to apply some pressure, manages him to open him up and gets a combo

 

Like in pretty much every Match-up, Leap is risky to use, but it is a fairly invaluable tool when you use it sparingly to apply pressure, or whiff punish certain moves

10:50 -11:00 Charged Beak driver x N with some YRC sprinkled

 

Didn't mention it earlier, because this is the most apparent here : on top of building a huge amount of RISC, charged Beak Driver drains a ton of tension when you FD it, and builds a fair amount of meter for Sin. This means more YRCs for Zadi while being safer; and Potemkin gets less occasions to YRC his own stuff to be safe or blow Sin

11:00 11:15 Zadi continues his war of attrition, but this time mixes up several options while continuing to Charge Beak Drivers : Bull Bash to stop high jumps, Leap j.6H to push FAB in the corner, normal 236H to blow jump-outs

 

  FAB spent 20 seconds in the corner or near it,lost 1/5 of his life to Chip damage and 1/3 to random hits, and ended up with a bit more than 50 tension, spending the rest on FD. Conversely, Zadi did 4 YRCs with the tension gain from  236Hs. This strategy is incredibly efficient, but requires a very solid play to keep up with though !

10:08 Zadi FDs the incoming Hammer Fall, but chokes and get countered into RC combo for big damage

 

Don't know exactly why that happened : it could be because of the fear of Hammer Fall YRC shenanigans, or simply a misinput, but it still happened regardless, and ruined 20 seconds of hard work keeping FAB in the corner

11:36 Zadi does a 2P>2K>2D blockstring. FAB IBs everything and Potemkin Buster  between the 2K and 2D

 

FAB is an extreme example of how scary Potemkin Buster is in this MU, but it is still good to know that Potemkin can do it. Potemkin buster, 6P and 2H will negate most of your pressure options and any loose frame trap (more than 3 frames gap on IB) potentially mean a Buster in your face.  When in doubt, it's better to play it safe than gettin blown up for playing fancy

11:45 Zadi, not daring enough, doesn't go for the 6P and triple YRC ends up with him getting thrown and losing the match

Final words

This is pretty much the classic way of dealing with the Match-up. Nauturally you can adapt the way you approach it to fit your playstyle, as long as you remember all the things we talked about :

-- FOOTSIES ! No really, your goal here is to learn to hit everything from max range, whether you jump, walk, dash or whatever. every inch of leeway you give to Potemkin is an inch closer to eating one of his buttons/special/command grab.

 As long as you mind Potemkin's options, you can be more agressive with the way you play but keep in mind that Potemkin has reliable ways of dealing with your pressure and approaches, and that he wants you to get close to him to give you big flaming hugs. If you fear you could fall victim of this kind of affectionate but painful displays, stay away from him

- Giving Potemkin the driver is often a good idea. Careful though : because of how strong Beak Driver is against Potemkin, it can be tempting to screw it in his face all day everyday. As good as it may sound, don't, or at least be ready to YRC if things didn't go as planned, because if Potemkin catches you Beaking him all day, you'll probably end up eating a Hammer Fall, Mega fist or Slide Head, and deal with his offense, which is a huge nope for Sin. Immaculate spacing is the key here !

-Drops are always a no-no, especially in Guilty Gear, but they are a huge no-no when you play against Potemkin. Do yourself a favour and pick Potemkin as yourtraining  dummy for a while if drops happen too often

-If Potemkin drives you to the corner... Best of luck. Pretty much jump, block, mash or attempt a backdash YRC, praying that you guessed right, and if you didnt...

-YRC and FD are your friends, cherish them, love them, always think of them whenever you take a peak at your gauge. Remember they are here for you during hard times, and that you're safe as long as they are here for you. Dedicate your whole gauge to them if you feel the need to !

 

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any video that properly shows how to deal with Milia and zato match ?
also potemkin. i know its a good match-up for sin. Except if that potemkin player is super good.

This x2.

Also this thread is awesome, I look forward to seeing the Potemkin video.

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Sin vs Potemkin is up ! Hope this will be helpful/informative !  Again if you have another specific Match or Match-up to request, feel free to do so !

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Since it was one of the requests from kmhxspider, here is an analysis of Millia vs Sin, one of our most dreaded MUs

I chose a video of lesser-known top players this time : Kagegiwa no DC as Sin pitted against Eki-chan's Millia ! Sorry if it's harder to navigate than other videos because the archive is longer. To compensate for this there are video links highlighting key moments/MU specific tactics


1:41:29 round start : Kabegiwa jumps out but Eki-chan calls it out with IAD j.P

 

Generally you don't want to poke out too much against Millia because of the pin's constant threat. Millia can also IAD over to punish most of your classic pokes, so playing conservative may not be a bad idea. Kabegiwa porobably went for his usual round start back jump j.P falling j.6H but got exposed for it.

1:41:31 both are in the air : Kabegiwa whiffs his j.6H while Eki whiffs his pin, but the later gets the advantage and runs towards a cornered Sin

1:41:32....and opens him with a 2K and get Millia's vortex going

 

Taking the fight to the air is a valid strategy whenever Millia has Silent Force (the pin) on her, as this completely negates your Beak Driver and 6P and, to a lesser extent the rest of your ground moveset. Sin's air-to-air is not bad per say, but limited in the sense that it wins when you jump after the opponent because of all the good moves hitting above/in front of him but very bad if you jump before the opponent (bad hitboxes below him, no meterless way of changing air momentum, hard to convert from anything). Kabegiwa jumped before Eki and paid the price this time around

1:41:33 Kabegiwa bursts the 236S confirm

 

pretty much the only burst point in Millia's combos where she has to use meter to deny your burst. be on the look-out for this if you want to escape. OTG bursts are also useful to deny disc oki !

1:41:34 : Kabegiwa misses the air throw window and get a j.6H to whiff

 

Don't miss an occasion to air chase Millia as you can get a knockdown from any stray air hit/throw. Additionally, Silent force is much harder to confirm from there, and j.P is strong but can be contested. It's not a guaranteed win, but better than getting skewered trying to play our usual ground game !

1:41:35 Kabegiwa whiffs a fullscreen Bull Bash, gets tagged by Eki's secret Garden and get KOed into Secret Garden midscreen oki

 

Generally Bull bash is not very useful in this MU : the reward you get on it is great but still not worth the almost guaranteed punish Millia gets and resulting vortex if it whiffs. It's also very easy for her to make it whiff because of her sheer speed. In any case, this Bull Bash wasn't warranted (everybody makes mistake) and it cost Kabegiwa dearly

1:41:39 Kabegiwa backdashes and gets out of the way by high jump IADing over

 

Midscreen Secret Garden is a mindgame. You can't contest it because the orb doesn't disappear on hit but it doesn't hit meaty and Millia can't follow it to do mixups unless you just stand there. However, she can call out one or several options by changing the orb pattern. You can either jump, backdash or run forward to try and avoid the orb. If you choose the wrong answer you'll have to take the mixup though so be sure to watch the Millia's player preferred patterns

1:41:44 Kabegiwa gets a j.6H to hit CH and proceeds to knock half of Eki-chan's life down.

Kabegiwa loves to fish for that j.6H confirm, and it's quite an efficient strategy as long as you use it cleverly. Given that Millia can deal with Sin's neutral very well, flailing around and being ready to confirm from any stray hit that may occur is not necessarily a bad idea, as long as you don't follow predictable patterns or do something that is punishable on cue (i.e random Bull Bash)

1:42:00 Eki-chan, after confirming his first(of many) successful dusts with a relaunch combo, goes for Secret Garden oki without 6H

This is arguably one of Millia's strongest okis, and it works incredibly well against Sin : his wake-up speed being slow, he can't high-jump Blitz of it if the setup is perfect (it"s the usual answer to avoid dealing with the mixup). The orb not disappearing on hit means Sin's DAA and DP are utterly useless. In other words, Sin is one of the unfortunate who can only do his best not getting opened up by this.

1:42:02 After blocking 6K, Kabegiwa gets opened by another Dust

5D is one of Millia's only reactable overheads. Its main use is to beat throws and backdashes in the corner. One of its perk is that it's safer to pull off than her other overheads when there is no disc or orb protecting her, and you can freely confirm into an oki from it. Know how to block it, it is still a fairly dangerous tool and Kabegiwa learned it the hard way.

1:42:07 after the Dust knockdwown Millia goes for another Dust, but YRCs it and catch Kabegiwa reacting to it this time around with a 2S

Obviously, reacting to Millia's mixup is just hard or downright impossible in some situations, So you have to play mindgames. Here Eki successfully conditioned Kabegiwa to be overly aware of the 5D only to get trapped by this mixup

1:42:09 Kabegiwa uses his burst to try and do a comeback

While Millia is a fairly oppressive character for Sin, keep in mind that ANY hit can give you an unexpected win, so going all-in even if you risk losing the round is not necessarily a bad idea.

1:42:14 Kabegiwa attempts a ballsy Bull Bash on Eki's wake-up but Eki's Gold Burst goes through it and Kabegiwa ends up in a disadvantageous situation that costs him the round

1:42:24 round 2 start : Kabegiwa jumps back again, this time with j.S, clashing with Eki's jump forward j.P, then backdashes out of the clash and get a successful j.6H

Kabegiwa in this round starts to get used to Eki's super agressive hell mary playstyle and uses a lot more spacing moves and tech traps and it works for him !

1:42:28 After a successful air throw, Kabegiwa proceeds to  mix Eki up and succesfully lands a hit for big damage

Since  the way neutral is handled in this MU is different from most other MUs ( Most of your specials are not used nearly as much to control space, as Millia can stuff them all relatively easily) you end up with a lot more calories than usual. Since landing a hit against Millia is so damn important, it's better to use most of your knockdowns to get some pressure going than get a refill and lose that much needed advantage. Only eat when you really need to !

1:42:39 after a left/right mixup, Eki attempts a throw/tries to bait a DP (can't honestly say which it is) and gets hit by an abare 2P from Kabegiwa into a knockdown.

A proof that hitting buttons is a good thing when done at the right moment. Eki always went for DP safe okis throughout the match. Since the disc setup was already used at this point he probably tried to bait a reversal, by FDing or attempting a delayed throw, but Kabegiwa probably caught up to his habit and made his choice accordingly !

1:42:44 Kabegiwa gets some pressure in the corner and uses Leap as a pressure reset

Leap, unlike in most of the MUs is generally an okay pressure reset here since Millia has to choose which anti-air to use and you can adjust leap's trajectory to account for that. It also beats fuzzy jumps, which is Millia's main way out because of her dominance in the air. Of course you still need to vary your pressure as Leap is still not even close to a cure-all !

1:42:47 Eki escapes pressure by spending all of his tension in FD

The other main way out of Sin's pressure. Be wary of it, since if you whiff something at Millia's face, it's return to neutral against Millia at best, or punish into knockdown at worst !

1:42:54 Great IB throw punish into round-ending combo from Kabegiwa !

1:43:03 round 3 start ! Kegiwa with again jump back j.S and Eki catching up to it with High jump IAD over.

What gave Kabegiwa some leeway before puts him in an unfaorable position here, orcing him to backdash and get closer to the corner, where you absolutely don't want to be against Millia. Thankfully, 2S saved the day !

1:43:08 Kabegiwa hits Eki out of his backdash, but loses the advantage by cancelling it into Bull Bash thinking it would be blocked.

1:43:11 Kabegiwa gets 6Ped out of his j.6H by Eki

Air to ground is generally not a position Sin wants to be, and Millia has a good amount of moves that can act as Anti-airs. If you take it to the air be ready to FD if things didn't go as planned

1:43:12 Eki attempts another 6P to catch Kabegiwa hitting buttons while techign, and then cleverly cancels it into Digitalis> throw to open him up

Whenever Kabegiwa gets a chance to block Millias pressure, he will often resort to FD to push her away and prevent her from mixing up using overheads or Digitalis follow-ups. While this is often the best answer, be careful with mixups attempt early in pressure, as they are easier to escape/mash out of, but FD won't be sufficient to push her away enough in this case

1:43:17 After successful blocks from Kabegiwa, Eki ends his pressure with 236S (-1 on block) and tries to jump-in to apply more pressure. Kabegiwa reacts to it and airthrows him to reverse the tide and get a needed refill

1:43:20 But then does a Greedy Bull Bash allowing Eki to high jump IAD other him to side-switch and punish into corner oki

Bull Bash is a high risk move in this MU but can be used in some instances. While the idea was good, Kabegiwa didn't have enough tension to YRC it in cases things went wrong. Generally in this MU, you don't want to commit to Beak driver or Bull Bash unless you have a YRC safety net !

1:43:25 Eki succesfully opens up Kabegiwa by going for another TK Bad Moon instead of mixing up his options, like he did during round 1

1:43:26 Kabegiwa bursts as soon as he gets it back, catching Eki unawares

1:43:32 Kabegiwa attempts to set his ground game by using f.S then 2S, but Eki makes the f.S whiff and forces him to block the pin, and then does the exact same thing to punish 2S, and slowly pushes Kabegiwa in the corner in the process

what happened here is pretty much why Kabegiwa never bothererd to attempt setting the ground footsies game : Sin's linear pokes don't mesh well with Millia's air options, at all !

1:43:35 Dust special, again !

1:43:40 seeing Kabegiwa didn't have his burst and was low on life, Eki went for Chroming Rose okizeme for almost assured destruction, and takes the match

 

Final Words.
 

A few "stats" on the use of our main pokes on neutral. This can be interpreted in different ways, and can be partly explained by the interaction of Kabegiwa'a aerial playstyle and Eki's agression. It still reflects a general trend of the MU

6P : 1 (beaten by pin)
f.S : 1 (whiffed)
2S:  3 ( used defensively : two of them hit CH, the other got punished by pin)
236H :  0
236K : 0
214S : 1 (the ohers were oki jump traps but failed anyway))

In other words, the tools on which we rely on a great deal in most of the MUs are not as useful here, so you'll have to learn  how to play in the air with Sin even if he is not very good at that. Ground moves are useful but knowing when not to use them (which is more often than one would think as Kabegiwa showed with Bull Bash) is key. Keep enough meter for YRCs because they can come in handy in many situations.

Gauging when it's worth exposing yourself is basically how the MU goes : Kabegiwa played very safe and non-comittal, focusing on the few moments he could actually turn the tides, and it worked to an extent. Some bad mistakes and fails on blocking Dust didn't allow him to overcome Eki, but he certainly had a shot at winning there !

In a nutshell, play conservative, and only expose yourself when you think it's REALLY worth it. you'll be pressured a lot, but outside of setups, Millia's pressure is clearly one of the more manageable in the cast. Of course there are many different ways to play depending on the Millia you're facing, but "don't let her get the hit" will always be the core of your strategy

 

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there is a thing i found about zato. if you hit eddie and RC you get a YRC and not a RRC. pretty interesting might come in handy.

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can you mash in between the blockstun of milia's orb?
Another thing. how do you deal with I-no match-up? her projectile zoning pretty much destroys sin's physical zoning/neutral game.

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1. hold secret garden unless you can like backdash a bad setup midscreen (if they can secret garden you legit midscreen, the setup is probably not bad either lol)

2. There's more detailed stuff in the MU thread. Sin handles I-no pretty well in neutral.

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On 13/11/2015 at 11:17 AM, edollarports said:

There's more detailed stuff in the MU thread. 

isnt this the only match-up thread for sin?

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On 05/01/2016 at 3:37 AM, Valas Phoenix said:

This should be a Video talk/discussion, to discuss match ups click here on the matchup directory

 

okay thank you.

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