Jump to content
Chaoschao222

Central Fiction Arcade Plot Discussion (spoilers)

Recommended Posts

I have to add something important regarding Es quote VS Terumi: 

Spoiler

HRy5uDx.jpg

I remembered, after a little conversation with Abyss, that in one of Hakumens quotes against a certain character the content of the textbox differed from what he said; he mentioned Kokonoe while the textbox didn't brought her up (or that it didn't fit against the character he fought). This means there is the possibility that some of the quotes in demo were switched (or that it was just very loosely translated...)

My, and Abyss, guess is that the above one belongs to Kokonoe, Izayoi's "Spirit" quote to Terumi and Kokonoes "Good and evil" one to Izayoi. Again, it's just a guess of us. The other quotes however should be fine.
This week Es will be also playable at WNF in SoCal and it would be great if someone who attends this event could check these again (and take pictures of Bangs quotes against her and vice versa too).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I know the highest being in a story typically requires no explanation, but I'd love it if Mori can explain what the hell is up with Amaterasu exactly.

It's one of multiple "Units", yet it's the highest of the 3. It managed to make Noel essentially its physical incarnation without her knowing of it (and Mu-12 doesn't seem to identify herelf as such either), but Izanami needed a vessel in comparison. It doesn't want itself to have a "bad ending" and does multiple Phenomena Interventions to prevent this, but certain story-altering events in each game manage to go through untouched. All the villains have tried attacking the satellite that is supposedly its physical incarnation, but it turns out Noel was the one they needed to attack all along.

Is any of this clarified in the information we already know so far?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
7 minutes ago, MaximusMurkimus said:

I know the highest being in a story typically requires no explanation, but I'd love it if Mori can explain what the hell is up with Amaterasu exactly.

It's one of multiple "Units", yet it's the highest of the 3. It managed to make Noel essentially its physical incarnation without her knowing of it (and Mu-12 doesn't seem to identify herelf as such either), but Izanami needed a vessel in comparison. It doesn't want itself to have a "bad ending" and does multiple Phenomena Interventions to prevent this, but certain story-altering events in each game manage to go through untouched. All the villains have tried attacking the satellite that is supposedly its physical incarnation, but it turns out Noel was the one they needed to attack all along.

Is any of this clarified in the information we already know so far?

What's going on with Amaterasu is one of the big mysteries of the series and everything we have seen so far of Central Fiction makes it very clear we will be getting the answers. However, in answer to your specific points.

  • All of the Units have different functions. Amaterasu is the highest because it has the greatest power, essentially being god.
  • The Izanami thing is a completely different issue. Whatever happened to make Noel = Girl inside Amaterasu is different from Izanami needing a vessel. The Master Unit did have something physically inside of it before it became "empty" (either the girl's body is now gone or just her soul left). On the other hand, Izanami is just the Drive of this girl, a manifestation of her soul's power using the Azure. There is nothing odd about the manifestation of such a thing not having a physical body.
  • The issue of events going untouched is because of the inherit limit on the power of Phenomenon Intervention. Phenomenon Intervention can only choose between event that are "possible," it cannot let the user do whatever they want (only the Azure can do that). The entire reason for the time loop in Calamity Trigger was that Takamagahara made Take-Mikazuchi nuke Kagutsuchi and there was and would never be a timeline in which Takamagahara decided not to do so. Everyone dying was a bad ending for Amaterasu so she had to reset. The reason the story altering events involving the villains happen is because she can't stop them from doing it. She can't just wipe Terumi out of reality and she can't pick a timeline where he stops being evil because that is an impossibility. CT and CS are the result of events being the best they possibly can for her, good enough to stop the immediate instant-lose condition and let things move on but not good enough to solve the big problems.
  • There is nothing that suggests that attacking Noel was needed or connected to the Master Unit at all before Central Fiction. The stuff with Noel being the Absolute Entitled, devouring possibilities and the Master Unit being empty are all recent developments. We've seen Noel die in timelines before (which can't even happen at the moment aside from Kushinada's Lynchpin or Immortal Breaker) and nothing happened to Amaterasu or her retcon powers. The very fact that Amaterasu is currently just floating right in the middle of the sky and Izanami isn't attacking it pretty clearly shows that the situation has changed since the end of CP.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, MaximusMurkimus said:

I know the highest being in a story typically requires no explanation, but I'd love it if Mori can explain what the hell is up with Amaterasu exactly.

It's one of multiple "Units", yet it's the highest of the 3. It managed to make Noel essentially its physical incarnation without her knowing of it (and Mu-12 doesn't seem to identify herelf as such either), but Izanami needed a vessel in comparison. It doesn't want itself to have a "bad ending" and does multiple Phenomena Interventions to prevent this, but certain story-altering events in each game manage to go through untouched. All the villains have tried attacking the satellite that is supposedly its physical incarnation, but it turns out Noel was the one they needed to attack all along.

Is any of this clarified in the information we already know so far?

Yeah that's what I'm getting at as well since this is getting crazy every time I take note of it but hopefully by next month, we'll have all the answers to this question as well as how this came to be plus I would like to see if Mori could explain this to us.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Drives got weird once they became in-story plot devices just as much as they were in-game mechanics.

Izanami is a drive that has a Drive.....Driveception?

People got confused because she seemingly came out of nowhere because of the Japanese mythology her namesake is from, wonder if that was intentional. "Lol, they'll never know I'm actually one big bad Shadow self"

Either that, or Mori played Persona 4 and was mad that they did it first. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
17 hours ago, Luminos564 said:

To be fair, he could also be doing it to push her buttons and have her go really unhinged against him.

True, what Azrael said could simply have been an attempt to goad Bullet into attacking him. But it is a fact that he annihilated her squad even though they were too weak to actually be a threat to him. I suppose Azrael is rather like the Predator from the Schwarzenegger film; it wouldn't bother killing non-combatants but would happily slaughter anyone it considered a combatant, even if it was one of those non-combatants who happened to pick up a weapon that posed no real threat to it.

I agree that Azrael is not stupid; he has a clear understanding of what's going on but he simply doesn't care about any of it. All he cares about is finding enemies to fight.

15 hours ago, TekkamanArk said:

Azrael is like Akuma. Not inherently evil per se, but a chaotic force of nature that cares only for strength and the thrill of battle.

I'll disagree with you on that. I think Azrael is quite clearly evil. He casually injures and kills people for no reason other than his personal pleasure, he feels no compunction or remorse over the way he treats others and he is intelligent enough to know the consequences of his actions. If that's not evil I don't know what is.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
4 hours ago, Leiopelma said:

True, what Azrael said could simply have been an attempt to goad Bullet into attacking him. But it is a fact that he annihilated her squad even though they were too weak to actually be a threat to him. I suppose Azrael is rather like the Predator from the Schwarzenegger film; it wouldn't bother killing non-combatants but would happily slaughter anyone it considered a combatant, even if it was one of those non-combatants who happened to pick up a weapon that posed no real threat to it.

Funny you should mention the Predator. I remember reading several years ago (I think it was covered in the Expanded Universe) that the Predator of P1 was considered a "renegade". It was exiled to Earth by its hunting tribe for breaking one of their sacred rules and customs (evident since it has no ship to decorate with its trophies). You might think this too light a punishment (since humans are statistically inferior to a predator in both physical prowess and technology)...until you learn that the Predators themselves consider humans to be a far superior and more dangerous entity than the xenomorphs. And sure enough, Predator in P1 got itself rekt'd by a lone soldier, who had no prior experience fighting them.

Anyway the point I am trying to laboriously make is that you're on the right track, but I'd equate Azrael to the Predator of P2 instead. That one, while every bit a vicious hunter, follows its tribe's rules to the letter when hunting humans. It spares a pregnant woman, despite her being armed. Doesn't attack one of the humans because it saw the cancer growing inside of him, only retaliating when he opened fire. It also double-checks the targets, evident when a child points a toy gun at it and he prepares to fire as well, until recognising the gun to be a toy and thus not an actual threat.

Azrael's kind of the same in that regard in that while he'll fight anyone who knows how to fight (even if they are not an actual threat), he does seem to draw the line from time to time. If we take his victory quote against Platinum, while he will happily demolish the Nox Nyctores, he effectively spares her. His quote to Taokaka is more or less a life lesson on why she couldn't beat him. Make no mistake, he's definitely dangerous and a vicious "hunter", concerned only for finding his next target but he isn't the sort to just kill. I don't mean that to justify his actions, no siree. What I am saying though is that it'd makes no sense for him to do so. He lives to fight, especially people who might actually hurt him. Killing people just for the sake of killing lies contradictory to his simple, singular philosophy.

4 hours ago, Leiopelma said:

I agree that Azrael is not stupid; he has a clear understanding of what's going on but he simply doesn't care about any of it. All he cares about is finding enemies to fight.

That much is a given. But it's also something I haven't seen in some time when it comes to games these days. I tire of unrepentant monsters that eat babies for a laugh and mind crack enemies just because they can. Azrael is a breath of fresh (manly) air for BlazBlue...at least to me.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

While we're on the Azrael bandwagon, there's also the bit in "Teach Me, Miss Litchi" where he says he despises bullies.

An additional +10 manly points for Azrael.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well...

 

Azrael is the sort of villain who has only one possible end, getting himself killed by the very thing he aimed to fight against, he simply won't stop until finding a predator stronger than himself.

Not that it's a bad thing though, even if we can reasonably guess that he will end up eaten by the Black Beast while giving it massive internal injuries, we can still enjoy the ride regardless of the destination.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Variable Heart, in which Mai gets really defensive when told she's not a human and worries that she might lose her humanity, made me think that we have quite a few characters in Blazblue who grapple with the issue of whether they're human or not.

We have Ragna who knows he's not a natural human but has resolved to live and die as one, Noel who worried about whether she was truly human though she too decided that she is after taking inspiration from Ragna, Lambda and Nu who are slowly becoming more human in CF but probably aren't really capable of self-reflection yet and Izanami who questions what she is. Es also awoke to her emotions and humanity in Xblaze. Rachel has resolved to act like a human and struggle to create a better world. Also there's Arakune and Tager who have lost varying amounts of their humanity, though they don't seem to care.

It certainly seems to be a common theme in Blazblue.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So, according to this tumblr post by Zedar (at least I assume it's Zedar, sorry, if I'm mistaken), Naoto's arcade winquote against Terumi is as follows:

Quote

This feeling… No, it couldn’t. No way I would meet an associate with the Terumi here… I shouldn’t

 I thought it was established, that our main antagonist is not really associated with the clan in question, and that "Yuuki Terumi" isn't even his actual name. But according to Naoto here not only he is associated with the clan, apparently he is just so Terumi, you can outright feel it. Now I'm confused.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
54 minutes ago, In&Out said:

So, according to this tumblr post by Zedar (at least I assume it's Zedar, sorry, if I'm mistaken), Naoto's arcade winquote against Terumi is as follows:

 I thought it was established, that our main antagonist is not really associated with the clan in question, and that "Yuuki Terumi" isn't even his actual name. But according to Naoto here not only he is associated with the clan, apparently he is just so Terumi, you can outright feel it. Now I'm confused.

He may not be part/descendant of the Terumi clan, but maybe he's using their powers somehow, as you know Yuuki is a guy that uses everything to complete his objectives.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe the alias itself has some significance when it comes to terumi, and as stated he's probably using some latent form of the older clan's powers or something involving their energy.

 

or it's just rubbish. If the latter, the devs had better get to explaining themselves out of this one.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, NoelChan101 said:

 

What did Nine Say to Noel @ 3:37

Take this with a huge grain of salt since my Japanese is 1st grade level at best but it's something along the line of "This is our appointed meeting (in the context probably along the line of the meeting being destined or inevitable). I'll give you destruction, Ms. Doll." Noel's response is "I'm a... doll?" Can't really help you with anything else though. A lot of the dialogue is above me, not helped by how loud the music is.

 

11 hours ago, heavymetalmixer said:

He may not be part/descendant of the Terumi clan, but maybe he's using their powers somehow, as you know Yuuki is a guy that uses everything to complete his objectives.

Terumi has already used Magic, Alchemy, Observation, a Nox Nyctores, an Azure Grimoire, one of the Sankishin, a whole slew of abilities with no confirmed origin such as his spirit form, his ability to possess others and fuse with vessels plus the weird dark energy he summons in most of his gameplay attacks and story battle sprites that can also let him replicate the power of the Susano'o Unit (and possibly Ouroboros to explain how he had an incomplete version in PS1 before Nine gave it to him as well as how both Hazama and him can have it at the same time in CF), and as of CF, potentially Hihiirokane as well. It would hardly be surprising for him to also have powers connected to the Terumi Clan. Although come to think of it, we actually know very little about what the powers the Terumi Clan actually has aside from the Hunter's Eye that only the heads of the clan get (Naoto's Bloodedge and Saya Terumi's Soul Eater are their own individual Drives). My only guess would be the Terumi Clan has a derivative of Mei and the Amanohokosaka Clan's Exorcist techniques. It's also possible the Art Saya Terumi used to temporarily boost her power and speed is a Terumi Clan technique but we haven't seen Yuuki Terumi use anything like that.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Mai's trailer certainly emphasizes her hatred of Relius. I guess this might be triggered by specific events within the story, but Mai's attitude makes sense based on her background. Variable Heart shows that Mai detests people who that treat humans as objects due to the fact the villain of the manga treated her as a thing after her body had become a grimoire. Considering how Relius treats people it's natural that Mai will absolutely loathe him. I just hope that this won't cause her to bite more than she can chew.

By the way, I also liked how upbeat Mai's theme is; it fits her personality since she's pretty cheerful.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well...

1 hour ago, Leiopelma said:

Mai's trailer certainly emphasizes her hatred of Relius. I guess this might be triggered by specific events within the story, but Mai's attitude makes sense based on her background. Variable Heart shows that Mai detests people who that treat humans as objects due to the fact the villain of the manga treated her as a thing after her body had become a grimoire. Considering how Relius treats people it's natural that Mai will absolutely loathe him. I just hope that this won't cause her to bite more than she can chew.

By the way, I also liked how upbeat Mai's theme is; it fits her personality since she's pretty cheerful.

Beware of Relius and his tendencies of turning boobie ladies into dolls.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
22 minutes ago, 1337 H@x0r said:

Beware of Relius and his tendencies of turning boobie ladies into dolls.

Mai in her trailer apologizes and says that she needs to go search for Relius. Seems like she's really out to get him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

BlazBlue Logic No. Mad Puppeteer:

 

When Relius wants something, he gets it and conducts all sorts of experiments on it. It's not just limited to being turned into dollies.

 

You have the Azure Grimoire? You're strapped to some "X" shaped thingy. You dance and look pretty? You're put in some cage made for shaming. You're a squirrel beastkin? Into a ball you go! Lady of justice? Oh he has some interesting plans with your body. Puddle of sethir? You're treated like a chemical and heated in some science tube thingy. Witch? Bath time in a pot of blood(?) Kid with the power to use blood? Blindfolded and chained to a chair! Two souls in one body? In a barrel at risk of being stabbed in multiple areas! His son? Turned into a marionette! Catgirl scientist? You're mind is being examined! Saya clone? Prepare to be... Whatever he's gonna do. Goddess of Death? Your body gets disabled and some sort of ritual is performed on you!

 

No one is safe from THE Relius Clover...

 

 

With that out of the way, on to the sweet Mai: So wait, when do Remix Heart & Variable Heart take place in the timeline? I'm kind of behind since I don't have CPEX [yet]. Cause now I'm intrigued on where Mai was before she came running into CF.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
29 minutes ago, BlazGearRegalia said:

With that out of the way, on to the sweet Mai: So wait, when do Remix Heart & Variable Heart take place in the timeline? I'm kind of behind since I don't have CPEX [yet]. Cause now I'm intrigued on where Mai was before she came running into CF.

The Remix Heart manga takes place during the first year of Noel and her friends at the Military Academy (AKA high school). Jin at the time was a third year.

The Variable Heart manga begins in June 2197, right after the end of the Ikagura Civil War. It starts with Mai still being a student alongside the other girls, but at this point in the manga Mai is on the run from the Zero Squadron while being assisted by Sector Seven. So it's hard to guess what will end up happening to Mai over the intervening two and a half years.

We'll either have to wait for Variable Heart to finish or maybe Centralfiction will mention what Mai has been up to.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Zedar has translated what's said in Mai's trailer:

http://amatsumugi89.tumblr.com/post/150448873043/i-gave-an-attempt-to-translate-mais-pv

The words that flash on the screen (e.g. Hazuki family) are related to Mai's backstory, while what she actually says seems to be related to what she's doing in CF. Looks like she does hate Relius for treating people like objects and wants to go after him for the sake of her friends.

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Leiopelma said:

Zedar has translated what's said in Mai's trailer:

http://amatsumugi89.tumblr.com/post/150448873043/i-gave-an-attempt-to-translate-mais-pv

The words that flash on the screen (e.g. Hazuki family) are related to Mai's backstory, while what she actually says seems to be related to what she's doing in CF. Looks like she does hate Relius for treating people like objects and wants to go after him for the sake of her friends.

 

So she's basically makoto 2

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
25 minutes ago, Dovahkyon said:

So she's basically makoto 2

There are similarities between Mai and Makoto. Both of them needed the help of their friends to learn how to open up to others and both are now cheerful, friendly and value their friends above everything else.

Their backstories however are pretty different. Makoto had closed herself off because she was abused due to her race. Mai simply never had an opportunity to make friends because her father prevented her from doing so. And of course Makoto was from a poor family and only made it to the academy due to her physical abilities, while Mai is the heir to one of the 12 families ruling the world and got put in the academy by her father under a fake name. Makoto had to grapple with the inferiority complex caused by her being a beastkin, while Mai had to deal in Remix Heart with the fact her father seemingly rejected her and that she had become a woman, while in Variable Heart she has to deal with the fact that her body has become a grimoire which raises questions about how human she is or will be in the future. Also their personalities are not the same either. Makoto is very energetic and loves teasing her friends, while Mai is much more earnest and polite.

Based on what we've seen Mai's motivation in CF does appear to be to help her friends, though her role will be different from that of Makoto. Makoto's objective has been to keep Noel and Tsubaki from killing one another and to reconcile them; Mai's objective seems to be to neutralize the threat that Relius represents.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest
This topic is now closed to further replies.

×