BBCF Izanami General

[Axiomatic]

1 hour ago, Corbenik said:

Is there a consensus a,one japanese players on how good she is?

Consensus? No, I haven't heard any unilateral views on Izanami. Poropicchi (a good CF Hakumen player) ranked her around mid-tier and the fact she is not a top 30  regular supports this, but that is circumstantial at best. We hardly agree on tiers here on DL, except for maybe the busted people (CP Terumi or CT Arakune etc) so I doubt you will ever find a "metacritic" or consensus of tiers even in Japan; the same people who felt Izayoi was crap (just ask SKD about it) . 

Sorry I can point you to anything substantial. 

 

 

 

If you're interested,here are my thoughts on Izanami (others can chime in to describe how good they think Izanami is as well or they think I'm smoking something):

My two cents on the matter is she's certainly not garbo tier, but she struggles against the top tiers. In CF the "good" or "higher than average tier" peeps are good at neutral or spacing (Jin, Izayoi, Rachel, or Nine) or can cover the gaps in their moves with their gimmicks (Arakune, Carl, Relius) to name a few. In contrast, Izanami's neutral isn't up to par and her gap coverage is basically glorified extra hits in her strings with the xCC moves or using her orthodox projectiles (XD); the exception being her spinning wheel special which is pretty useful by my observations. Ribcage and float help her be an offensive character, but she struggles from the same flaw all the momentum-based characters struggle from - getting in/staying in.

 

She ain't Naoto levels of the struggle, but when you're fighting the neutral gods, being average or above average isn't going to cut it. For a comparison, look at how Nanase does in UNIEL to see how far a "float"  gets you against monsters like Gordeau/Waldstein/Old Spaghetti Arms. Ribcage management seems to be the key for Izanami to handle neutral by my observations, but its hard to balance between saving it for knockdown pressure or using it for a chance to get in, since whats the value of having dirty damage if you can't take out the opponent? I haven't seen any #gamechanger tech from Izanami videos either, so until then, she's mid to upper-mid tier in my eyes depending on the playstyle of the Izanami (ribcage rushdown, faux zoner with xD attacks/wheel, or float mixup).

Take these as you will since I'm only one person. 

 

[Juraya]

Well, as far as I´m concerned I agree with almost anything Axiomatic said save a few things.

One thing is, that I don´t actually think, that it´s that hard to get in with her. Especially when you use projectiles to mask the approach like for example covering for 214A/B with projectiles or like you said the spinning wheel or even shizuku can work since you kinda stop the opponent from standing still and doing stuff for the time it circles around them, though that can backfire I know. I also think that some of her P-Mode Projectiles are quite undiscovered. For example that slow moving one when alle 3 go together, I think thats 4D might have potential. As far as I remember the aerial version of it did multiple hits at least on hit, dunno if it is on block also. So I don´t think she is that much worse off. If you put it together and look at both of Axiomatic´s points neutral and gimmicks, I think her strength is that she can offer both on quite a useful level.

My problem with her is more or less sticking on enemies and mixups. So far mostly the only one mixup I´ve seen is standing overhead D: I did not really see much use of float for mixups. I might have overseen it, since I´m sure I didn´t watch all the footage there is, but to me it seems that either her float sucks for mixups and people don´t use it or people just don´t know HOW to use it. When Izanami was just released there was a video on twitter which showcased the possibiliity for her to use sth like a wolfbreak but with the use of barrier, though I still haven´t seen it used altogether. Dunno if it is because it sucks or because it´s too hard. Also I´ve only seen one Izanami really make use of the command grab, both special and DD.

But yeah one last thing which I think is really one of the quintessences of the characters: the friggin ribcage management. The characters is nuts as long she has that.

So while I don´t think that my argument would change much about her standings, I think we can expect some more from the character when the console version will be released.

[TD]

Rib cage is sooo good. I just came here to say that. It balanced though. But damn it's amazing for this character.

[-Seo]

Anyone been able to hit float stuff 5C>2C>6C>fall>5C etc, I feel that whenever I go for this the unfloat pops me up a bit too high to land and hit the 5C.Is there a faster way to fall from float that anyone knows of?

[Myoro]

Stopped by for a lil' fun fact, during the command grab's timestop it appears that neither you nor your opponent can gain heat whatsoever. The grab also does not give the opponent heat upon activation, so you can remove a good shark bite out of their health bar without giving them meter to mount their reversal.

[Axiomatic]

On 3/18/2016 at 6:28 PM, -Seo said:

Anyone been able to hit float stuff 5C>2C>6C>fall>5C etc, I feel that whenever I go for this the unfloat pops me up a bit too high to land and hit the 5C.Is there a faster way to fall from float that anyone knows of?

From the combo thread:

(corner) (May need ~75% meter at least for the two CTs and DD) normal  2C(fatal counter)->normal CT->normal 6B,41236D (on 6B startup)->normal 214A->short 88 (41236D should now have hit the opponent)->float 5C->float 2C->ground 5C->(jump into float cancel)88->float 5C->float 2C->float 236A->float 5C->float 2C->float 6C->8(float cancel)->normal 6CC->OD cancel->normal 3C->normal CT, 41236D (activate during CTs startup)->normal 236236B (8312 damage)

Spoiler

2.mp4

Kou used a string similar to what you are describing (using a 6C ender rather than a 5C though). I attached a video of his timing for reference, but I know 5C's hit box is higher than 6C's. If the timing is the issue, it should be comparable (unless the startups differ more than I think they do). It may be that a 5C ender will work only if your float is low enough, since the starting float height can be vital. Did you enter float after 6A into a float cancel, during an aerial string, or did you start the combo in float mode? 

[-Seo]

Ah I figured it out today, inputting a super jump motion while floating causes you to fall MUCH faster, it's needed for those combos and overall is pretty damn useful.

[Davo87]

After watching this setup for Zawarudo I noticed ribcage stayed up despite barrier gauge is drained. I guess its either the perks of OD or Zawarudo itself. 

[oh no, he said]

Shouldn't it have also been broken by Naoto's drive there? That almost certainly seems like an OD perk.

[Zouf]

I don't think Naoto fully charged his blood repulser

[-Seo]

No, that's definitely fully charged.

[Myoro]

I think Ribcage dies to unblockables and grabs, but not guardbreak.

Anyone know/have footage of how it interacts with CTs and Plat's hammers?

[Davo87]

Not yet. But a glitch for time stop has occurred. Something about if Araragi hits during the activation causes this...

[-Seo]

On 23/03/2016 at 11:15 AM, Myoro said:

I think Ribcage dies to unblockables and grabs, but not guardbreak.

Anyone know/have footage of how it interacts with CTs and Plat's hammers?

Makes sense actually, I'd assume an attack that's unblockable and puts you in a hitstun state and an "unblockable" that puts you in a guard crush state are treated differently by the game.

[Axiomatic]

16 minutes ago, -Seo said:

Makes sense actually, I'd assume an attack that's unblockable and puts you in a hitstun state and an "unblockable" that puts you in a guard crush state are treated differently by the game.

For posterity now that you bring it up -Seo (if I interpreted what you were saying correctly):

Color Key:

1. red=100% meter
2. orange=50% meter

"Unblockable"/guard crush attacks  Ribcage should tank:

• Plat's special 5D
• Naoto's fully charged D attacks
• Hazama 623D AA
• Valk wolf 5C
• Valk wolf 5AAA
• Vlak wolf JC
• Terumi 100 meter 236236D/214214D

 

True Unblockables to watch out for in Ribcage mode:

• Amane's AA 623C
• Azrael upper/lower marked BHS?
• Bang's Astral
• Bullet 41236C command throw
• Bullet ground 623C
• Haku DD counter 236236D
• Max Haku Getsuga Tensho 63214C
• Tager Atomic Collider 623C
• Tager Astral
• Jin DD counter 236236D
• Kokopuffs black hole 632146D
• Tao 214214C pummel
• Naoto Phantom Pain
• Noel command grab 214A
• Noel astral
• Plat JD Lvl3 quake
• Plat special JD quake
• Plat special 5D quake
• Ragna OD 214214D
• Terumi counter DD

*Not up-to-date on Hibiki and Nine's moves

 

So if Myoro's  guess is true, we know what to watch out for during ribcage.

 

[Neriam]

I'm pretty sure I saw the ribcage getting recked by Terumi's OD 236236D. I'll try to find out the video where I saw it.

[GunBlazer]

1 hour ago, Neriam said:

I'm pretty sure I saw the ribcage getting recked by Terumi's OD 236236D. I'll try to find out the video where I saw it.

Makes sense. Terumi's OD 236236D is a true unblockable.

[oh no, he said]

Hibiki's 236A~C/Izuna drop should also bypass ribcage.

 

I don't think that Nine has any moves that can bypass the ribcage, Nephrite can be barrier blocked iirc.

[Zouf]

Can't you just throw her? Since it's armor, you can cancel your move by a throw. And i'm pretty sure it comes as normal throw, not blue.

 

[Juraya]

On 22.3.2016 at 5:16 PM, Davo87 said:

After watching this setup for Zawarudo I noticed ribcage stayed up despite barrier gauge is drained. I guess its either the perks of OD or Zawarudo itself. 

This one looks nice. But I realized there, that za warudo could really have some use actually. Since people´s reaction is usually running away, when you activate ribcage in neutral you can punish this by going za warudo an free hit them if they cant reach you in time, which is hard since you can zone them with the wheel :O

[Zouf]

What happens when stop time activates and the opponent is mid air?

[-Seo]

They got stopped in mid air.

[Zouf]

It could be a good counter to it, jumping high in the air before it activates.

She could still deal some damage, but not nearly as much as on the ground.

[Juraya]

Well that poses the question, is her float actually affected by timestop?

But otherwise yeah, it would at least cost her some damage, since she has to refloat.

[Myoro]

Fun fact about stopping them in the air, you can just land and charge fireball on them and it does a fair bit of damage.