[Other: Q&A] Rachel Alucard Gameplay Questions and Answers

[TD]

the more hits the more vaccuum and the higher the foe is. 1 hit of of 3c will make the foe hit the ground faster than 2 or 3 hits. so now the 2nd and 3rd hits will be for continuing combos and ending them, while 3c(1) is more of the combo ender.

[Amegashita]

So basically Rachel oki is still relatively the same as it was in 1.1 at least off normal starters?  That's pretty good.

[TD]

Basically. Even from short starter in the corner she should be able to go for pumpkin at least.

I've seen N-O do j2da jb 5cc 5b 6a 236a 6a 4b (3c) into summon, usually pumpkin. There is a small gap after 5cc which lets her move backward slightly, improving tech punish combos while still allowing oki with 2a OS.

[Golermecio]

What are her best after combo setups? What are the options she has for each of these setups? What are the things that she can do that are harder to react and block in time?

[Reshiram]

I'm having a really hard time doing this combo: j.C > 2D > jc > j.C > (land) > BBL.

Usually my opponent tech right when BBL is about to hit. Did I time something wrong? Or is it just that I didn't input BBL fast enogh? Any idea?

[TD]

What are her best after combo setups? What are the options she has for each of these setups? What are the things that she can do that are harder to react and block in time?

best after combo setups are usually just summoning pumpkin or frog and going from there. midscreen, after 5cc any summon will work with rachel's strategy. for 3c, you can summon frog and attempt to punish the foe's forward (to you) or delay techs with 5b. 6b can be used if you condition/know the foe will immediate tech, it will beat some dp's with proper spacing. 2a would work because of fast startup and recovery and options. foe back tech pretty much beats all your most threatening options after 3c frog. if you suspect this you can hunt  them down personally, or use the extra frame advantage to summon. whichever suits the situation.

 

rachel has unreactable 50/50's up close. after a jump-cancellable situation (after 5a, 5b, any situation where you can jump), you can perform a 12 frame instant overhead, and you do this by inputting 9+2d+ja in that order as quickly as possible. rachel will do a short hop, and nago will attack with his paw. before rachel lands, input jb to keep the foe in blockstun. you will then land and you can input a move quickly that will be immune to any attack the foe may want to do except guard cancel.

 

usually you will want to 5b here and then confirm a hit or not. if a hit, follow it up with a combo. on block you can do the IOH again, or you can use 2b for the 10 frame low option. done correctly, the foe literally has to guess which attack you will use after 5b. only crippling weakness is, every instant overhead needs 1 wind stock. cant use what you don't have. also ja has a short combo starter, usually confirms will be ..land 5b 5cc midscreen or ...after 5c dash 5b 6a 236a 3c summon in the corner.

 

I'm having a really hard time doing this combo: j.C > 2D > jc > j.C > (land) > BBL.

Usually my opponent tech right when BBL is about to hit. Did I time something wrong? Or is it just that I didn't input BBL fast enogh? Any idea?

 

you do the second jc as low to the ground as possible. you nead to land quickly, so using 2d asap after the first jc, more likely than not will give you the optimal combo situation.

[Hakkai_Requiem]

Hello! Newby Rachel player here!
Actually I'm a newby FG player as well.
With other characters like Tsubaki, just learning some B&Bs allowed me to play in a half competent way, at least against the CPU and in some not-ranked matches. With Rachel it really becomes more complex. Combos alone don't seem to bring me anywhere near consistent results.

Should I stick to learning B&Bs for now (I'm using challenge mode ones) or should I first improve the rest of my gameplay? I also saw a nice gameplay guide in this forum that explains both rushdown and zoning strategies. Which should I improve first?
I really have problems rushing into my opponent to net some damage safely but playing zoner game does not let me train my combos in actual fights.
Moreover, watching some gameplay videos, good Rachel players seem to close up on opponent more often than staying away from it, thus I thought rushdown was the first thing to improve... however Rachel IS a zoner after all so learning zoning tricks should maybe be my priority? I don't know. As a beginner I'm both amused and confused by all the possibilities Rachel opens as a character

[Kuuhaku]

This would probably go better in the Gameplay Questions thread.

But I think looking at Rachel as a zoner is kind of misleading. She can zone, but it's more like you should be looking at ways to use your tools to your advantage. For some characters that will be zoning, for others rush down, and for a lot of the cast it's more like a hybrid where you have to switch between both on the fly depending on resources, etc.

An easier way to think of her is primarily an oki/mixup character. You use your tools to force people to deal with the 50/50, carry them to the corner, and if all goes well they die there.

Her BnBs are the easiest thing about her to learn. For now focus on ones that end in ground knock down or corner carry. Also, I'd suggest spending time in training mode getting familiar with how to use wind aggressively and defensively.

Her tools also work in tandem. So for example you make someone block a Lobelia, you get out pumpkin and then you use the threat of the pumpkin to get out George. They airdash at you to not deal with George so you 6A them and convert that into corner carry or ground knock down. You re-summon pumpkin at the end of your combo, use it to cover reversal or mashing out and if they do neither, you do a 50/50 mix up. If it hits you corner carry or go for knock down and repeat the scenario again. Or you can do knock away and setup another approach.

That's a pretty watered down version, but generally when you play you try to think 2-3 steps ahead.

[gamester]

Note: merged the thread. Sorry for the inconvenience caused while sorting that out.

[kirbster]

I will never forgive you gamester

[Leopold]

Hi I'm have extreme difficulty landing her 3C micro dash after a lobelia.

One good example would be ...j.A, J.B, 5CD, 6C, j.C, 236A, 3C....

Can I please get some help on when is appropriate to micro dash as well what's the micro dash input? I have been on the lab for over 3 days and I still can't land it not even once. Please help me.

 

Thanks 

[gamester]

I'll try my best to explain. I've been well out of touch for a while now but hope I can help in some way.

- When the 236A hit connects, the lobelia needs to catch your opponent at the highest point they are in the air (hit connects). When you get that timing and you get the feel. You can microdash pretty much as soon as you've finished inputting 236A.

- Micro dashing is just like normal dashing (input 66) but you cancel into 3C asap. I'm not explaining it well sorry but I guess I would input it as 663C, so a quick flick of the 66 input and then staight into 3C. Usually I follow up with Sword Iris to connect the rest of the combo.

Going by your post I think you might be having a problem with the lobelia hit height. But 

- Another thing to note is that 236A > 3C doesn't work as well with some characters due to how they fall. I forget off the top of my head which characters exactly these days, but I'm assuming you're using Ragna as the training dummy. He's simple to practice on I find.

Hope this helps and my apologies if this causes any confusion, may be someone can explain it better than me.
 

[Leopold]

2 hours ago, gamester said:

When you get that timing and you get the feel. You can microdash pretty much as soon as you've finished inputting 236A.

 

Thanks for the reply.

I have been inputting the micro dash ASAP but I think 236A seems to have huge recovery frames which causes to ignore the micro dash inputs or just recognizes 3C alone. Is there any way around this?

I have been using Jin as my training dummy but I'm sure Rags could be also good. I managed to land it a couple of times today but it still seems far fetched as far as difficulty goes for a simple BnB part in game. 

 

Edit"

I went back to check and yes, you can't even buffer a dash until the 236A recovery is done. So the micro dash can't be inputted right away after the 236A.

[TD]

Get used to the recovery frames of 236a. Do 236a and hold 6 or 4 to get used to it. She will begin walking immediately after the last recovery frame of 236a.

youre doing this so that you can learn the buffer timing of the micro dash 663c. You input 66 within 5 frames of a move ending, and the character dashes the first frame they can. That's 5/60th of a second.

[Azure Grimoire]

Guys, i'm having a lot of trouble learning Rachel's j.2c combo. The one where she bounces the player in the air. Yeah, any tips for landing this combo? I'm stuck on challenge 14 and i really want to learn this combo... Thanks in advance!

[gamester]

^ Please take any questions to the FAQ next time, or feel free to ask about the odd route or two in the Combo Thread.

[Moved your post into FAQ]

If I find the time I'll do my best to explain J.C lvl 2 as soon as I can (busy atm) unless someone beats me to explaining it.

 

EDIT: (Sorry for the inconvenience caused when trying to merge the threads. Dustloop doesn't make it easy to move stuff about sadly)

[Frodlex]

So, I apologize if this is in the wrong place, but I've been practicing Rachel because her zoning game looks fun but I am having trouble getting j.C to knock the opponent into air during 5C >  5D > 6C > j.c > 6A > (So on) 

Can anyone give me some advice?

Edit: Oh, I see. I was inputting 6D instead of 5D and they have different properties, good to know.

[gamester]

This is the FAQ thread. Feel free to ask anything here  

(I'm well out of touch with things in game and on this forum. Sorry about that all)

@Azure Grimoire

My explanations are long winded and all over the place but hope I can help in some way. Someone may be able to explain things better and/or correct my mistakes. Sorry it has also taken a tad while to get round to answering your question.

First I wouldn't try learning j.2C Lvl 2 in Challenge Mode. Set up training mode and practice it there until you understand/get the feel of it. Here I would just do a basic route that leads into j.2C Lvl 2. Like the following:

5BD > 6A > 5B > jc > j.B > j.C > j.2D > jc9 > j.2C lvl 2

The bit you might be having trouble with is where I have put "j.2D > jc9" part.

After the j.C you are using wind to get the momentum needed for Lvl 2 and the jc9 (jump cancel forward) has to be done to get your positioning right in order for the j.2C to connect and bounce your opponent. It takes a fair bit of consistent practice and it can seem like you have to do things fast.

 

In training mode make sure the training dummy doesn't tech and feel free to blue beat your combo attempts while you try to figure out the timing and feel of the lead up to the J.2C Lvl 2 

If you're struggling with the j.2D > jc9 inputs I learnt that by focusing on it alone by going into training mode. Jumping forward in the air, do the j.2D and try jump cancelling forward again until I felt how to do it, I sped up my input when I was getting comfortable with it then tried to apply it in a full combo like I listed above.

 

Hope this helps, my apologies if this sounds a bit odd. It's a bit of a rush job putting this post together but any more questions feel free to ask away

 

[Frodlex]

So concerning her zoning game, what are her best tools for keeping someone at full screen? I've been using 236B > 5D/ 234C > 22B (on block) and throwing out pumpkin/ frog when 22B is active mostly because it seems to reliably keep the enemy at bay and give me an easy enough punish game if they carelessly air dash; however I'm looking for more optimal screen control if there is and would love to get good at her zoning set ups.

I mained Hazama since his release and leaned the game with him, so the high but limited mobility is not really a issue for me and I have yet to really have an issue running out or getting cornered, but is there anything I really need to learn about the wind mechanic?

What are her best rush down options without traps? Namely stuff like air to air and ground to ground and how can I jump in effectively for close range follow up?

 

[Rotlung]

Since this is the FAQ thread, I think I'm just gonna throw some stuff out here.

I'm actually fairly new to fighters in general (didn't play much until the release of MK9 on the PC), and even more so for ASW ones. (basically a beginner)

I'm currently playing BBCPE. I found Rachel really cool (and seeing really good Rachel players like Brkrdave and LPT in action is very inspiring) and wanted to try to learn how to play her, but I found her tools to be really indirect and difficult to use. It gets bad enough that handling the AI is even a struggle. I often find myself in the situation of managing to put some distance between myself and my opponent, and then thinking "eh, what am I supposed to do?"

How should I go about learning to even play her decently? More specifically:

1.) How should I use the pumpkin? I have a lot of trouble understanding how the pumpkin fits in Rachel's gameplan. On one hand, it seems good to just have one around to scare the opponent off with the threat of wind that damages them. But using wind with the pumpkin feels like a very large investment for very little damage. As a result, I find myself using the pumpkin very rarely which, based on what I read around here, is definitely not the right way to play her.

2.) Lobelia strategy: I often don't have a good idea of what I want to do with the lobelias. I know that they're projectiles+traps+potentially barrel lotuses, but something about them feels very awkward to use. Related to my earlier concern with not being sure what to do once I have some distance, I'm just throwing out lobelias while in the air, and what am I looking for? Getting barrel lotuses?

3a.) Learning combos: Should I be spending time learning the combos in Challenge mode? I've read that some combos are considered impractical for the execution requirement. I'm still struggling with clearing challenge #9 even once, but should I practising something else?

3b.) Wind during combos: When do you normally tap D during a combo? In between inputs, or together with an input?

I'm guessing it's possibly because I'm still pretty new to the game, but every Rachel player has to start somewhere. Feel like giving up sometimes and focuses on someone much more familiar and intuitive like Noel or Jin, but I'm still hoping I can get some rewarding play out of Rachel.

Would really appreciate some answers to get me on my way to better understanding everyone's favorite tea-drinker.

[TD]

Read the Rachel guide it covers everything you ask.

[RurouniLoneWolf]

Pretty much what TD said is right for the first 2 questions. That said, I feel like I should take this opportunity to point out that Rachel is arguablely tied with Carl for the hardest character to play. You can read the guide, watch a lot of match videos of N-O, Rinhime and Momoiro but ultimately, it's going to take a lot of actual match experience to get comfortable with her toolset and how best to use it. So I guess what I'm trying to say is that you should just hop into matches and start experimenting with them yourself. Make sure to take mental notes of what worked and what didn't as well as analyzing how best to improve. You're probably not going to be all that good with the character for like the first few months but you'll get there eventually. If you ever want to talk about specific situations you're having trouble with, go ahead and bring them up in the gameplay thread and we'll do our best to help you out!

For combos, Can't remember what the challenge mode was like but it's probably better to check out Rachel Combo vids. There's 3 you can look at in the combo section of her wiki page. In the end though, taking note of combos you see top Rachel players do in real matches is probably the most practical way to find combos to learn. You usually end up killing two birds with one stone this way since you usually learn something much more important in the process: How to get the first hit of the combo in neutral or open them up in pressure to begin with.

As for how to input wind during combos, it depends on the combo part. Stuff like 5C > 5D you can do just by pressing both buttons at once but other stuff might require other inputs or delays in between. If you want to know about inputting a specific part, feel free to ask in the combo thread.

[Rotlung]

Thanks! I've seen the guide (it's really helpful), I guess I just need a lot more practice to get her game plan to feel more natural. Funny that you mention taking a few months to get decent with her, since I've only just started playing BlazBlue with CSE this February, got a long way to go!

[MrAbyss]

If my opponent can mash out of my 5B jA, does that mean I am doing jA to slowly?

[TD]

8 hours ago, MrAbyss said:

If my opponent can mash out of my 5B jA, does that mean I am doing jA to slowly?

Yes.

 

its possible to instant block and dp her 5b ja even when done quickly. Mashing shouldn't be possible though