[CS1] Lambda General Discussion

[zaeris]

well, i'm just going to say that if it stays like that and time outs keep happening, (not just for Nu, but i said before that i saw more time outs on the first day of CS than i had seen the whole time i've played CT) when the inevitable console version comes out, and people actually play like that, expect the online community to die in weeks. heck, people probably won't even stay around for round 2 if round 1 is won by a turtling opponent. because its retarded and not fun. the vast majority of people who buy this game don't play in tournaments or care about penalty frames. they pick a character they like and learn how to play them okay and have fun with the game. when they go online to a stat whore that turtles his way to victory, even after pulling off a few cool combos, but they don't win because the damage is zilch and the system promotes defense, what incentive is there to play the game?

i just hope they don't make the AI passive, because you know those 9's the reviewers were giving CT because of its "fast, fluid action"? they're not going to appear because the action is stagnant, matches are long and drawn out, and there's no pleasure to come from playing this game. i guarantee you reviewers will say that and many people will agree with it.

I don't know why you're getting your panties in a knot for. You honestly believe people are using time out because it’s valid? In most cases people do want to win and end it quickly but here you have characters that have a low and average DPS overall...

If you watch Top Tier (TT) character play the matches move along faster due to being able to output the higher damage. People only go into time out strategy in most cases because they didn't realise it themselves.

There is nothing wrong with turtle in general while I find it dissatisfying it doesn't mean everyone will adopt this strategy... unless its sf4 with turtle galore and yes people play sf4 which is turtle game... ever seen a full fireball zoning match..

[Kazikal]

Now we have Kaqn playing Lambda, I know it's only a random match, but he pull out some good combos and strategies. I wonder where are the Nu pro players like Reria and Tsukasa... any info on them?

[kriaser]

To change subjects, let's talk about usefulness of 236D and 236D~C since it's now changed. Currently, I often use a 236D after I do an air juggle and end with a j214D. This prevents them from rolling forward and using a DP or something. Would the new 236D still be useful in this sense? Any other tips or advantages to using the new 236D?

[AirMaster]

Breaks a primer or two. So I guess it's still useful in that regard.

[feri]

j214d has some funky ground bounce and wont KD so 236d for rolling is kinda a non issue unless your opponent decides to not air tech. Might as well gravity and see if a 214d~c is possible if they block/air block that then tack on a 236d if safe enough.

[BlackWing]

I guess there can be some mixups involved with 236D. You could go in and 2147D or 3C for a high/low mixup.

[severin]

Fun fact: I'll probably have a combo list and partial guide for CS up later tonight.

[YuYu]

:DDD Please do severin.

[Jigoku_Roa]

Fun fact:

I'll probably have a combo list and partial guide up later tonight.

If it's for CS, plz do so. Note: by watching CS videos, you can combo 5DD-4DD.

[severin]

Note: by watching CS videos, you can combo 5DD-4DD.

On crouch only.

[Locke815]

To change subjects, let's talk about usefulness of 236D and 236D~C since it's now changed.

Currently, I often use a 236D after I do an air juggle and end with a j214D. This prevents them from rolling forward and using a DP or something. Would the new 236D still be useful in this sense?

Any other tips or advantages to using the new 236D?

The new 236D and 236D C can instantly break 2(or more?) guard primers if it traps the other player and follow up by 2147 D, 214 D, or act pulsar C. In one of the new vids with the purple Lambda, he/she used Legacy Edge before 236 D then pulsar C for a guard break. Pretty useful for Lambda in CS imo.

[kenja0]

We know Lambda breaks Guard Primer like crazy. But the question shouldn't be how we can do it- that'll come easily on its own to us. The real question is, "What do we do when we break it?" A player is frozen for two full seconds on ground break. In those two seconds, we have enough time to realize their defenses have been breached and approach from slightly less than half a screen away. A lot of people shoot straight up C, but is it plausible to 236B/C/D or shoot swords. What about 4B into a standard air combo?

[kriaser]

We know Lambda breaks Guard Primer like crazy. But the question shouldn't be how we can do it- that'll come easily on its own to us. The real question is, "What do we do when we break it?"

A player is frozen for two full seconds on ground break. In those two seconds, we have enough time to realize their defenses have been breached and approach from slightly less than half a screen away. A lot of people shoot straight up C, but is it plausible to 236B/C/D or shoot swords. What about 4B into a standard air combo?

If you're able to notice the break and react accordingly, wouldn't 236C be the best of choices? It is a high launcher and it leads to some pretty dangerous combos.

[Arcade Fire87]

Hey, I've seen Lambda's new 236D but the way it works confuses me. Does it legitely combo from 5DD? I've seen the special kinda linger there, but it looked really slow. I'm wondering how useful her new saw would be coming from behind the screen through ~C. Do you like playing Lambda in comparison, Severin? How do you feel playing her more as a close up pressure character as opposed to zoning? I know she's not as powerful, but I'm looking forward to playing up close with her

[kriaser]

I think 236D places a saw blade roughly 2-3 character lengths out, whereas 236D~C places one at nearly 3/4 screen length. It's like a stationary saw blade that hits for 5 times I think. As for comboing, I'm not sure how it works. I've yet to see any Lambda use saw blade after anything other than a blocked 5DD.

[severin]

None of the wheels combo from anything as far as I know. (maybe a CH 5D?) As far as my impressions of the character (I'd take these all with a grain of salt, wednesday was my first time playing CS), well, all I can say, is that the subtle changes are going to take a lot of getting used to. In my case, it was a lot of the movement nerfs that got me. With her slower airdash, shorter backdash, and what seems to me like a slower forward dash acceleration, I'm going to more or less relearn my movement game with her, not to mention the lack of JC-able 5D. Also, raw 2C as a poke is gone. It still works as an anti-air of sorts, but 2C j.C j.2C etc now does around 1500 or so, and with a similar speed (perhaps slower) to 6a, I see no real reason to use it as an anti-air, though it can still probably catch jump-outs. Few quick notes on combos: 2DD > 6C > Dash > 2DD > j.C > j.2C > 2DD > j.DD > j.2DD > j.214D still works. Does around 2800 236C on counterhit combos into 2DD > 6C > dash etc. Didn't get damage figures for that though. Mike mentioned something about being able to combo into itself on CH, but didn't get a chance to test that. 5D pickup after a corner j.214D feels pretty spacing specific. I'm sure there'll be plenty of near corner fun discovered. The reversal field combos I've tried have all done around 1.7 - 1.8k. Mind you, I haven't seen much in the way of videos, so I was trying things like: 214A > 2DD > 2147D > Land > 5DD > 2DD > 6C > Dash > 2DD > j.DD > j.2DD > j.214D Throw > Dash > 6B > 5C(n) > 6C > 2DD > j.DD > j.2DD > j.214D does around 2400 if I recall correctly. I need to compare this to dash 6A > 6C I didn't manage to land the corner throw > (6a > 2147D)xN loop, but I see this as potentially pretty decent damage, as only two reps did 2400 or so. I'll probably play a bit more mid-week.

[kriaser]

The 6A > 2147D corner loop seemed kind of pointless to me, but you saying it did 2400 damage after only 2 reps makes me curious. I also haven't seen any videos of this corner loop going past 2 reps. Are the old corner combos gone? I can only assume so since j214D is nerfed on its knock down.

[Jigoku_Roa]

By watching CS videos (through the game, not camera), it looks that Lambda's corner loop stops after the second go around and dissipates the combo and after rapid canceling, the third does less damage (I think is due to the combo damage limit of Lambda). Not sure if any Nu's corner combos exist with Lambda in CS.

[Arcade Fire87]

Thanks for the info, Severin I'm sure there's quite a bit to be discovered by her I guess more questions is how you felt about her Zwei moves. Like, as opposed to being so used to the 5D strings and such what did you think of her icecar movements? Did they seem useful, more likes pokes? Did you make much use of her DP? It'd be nice to replace what we'd usually backdash for and replace it here and there with a DP, which would be sweet

[Halcyone3]

from what ive seen, she gets some mix-up out of the zwei moves. A low hitting one, an air unblockable 1 (that breaks primer), and 1 that u can then follow with 2147D or a throw. From what ive seen, it just gives her mix-up from a distance. I also see lambdas escaping kinda well after using the hitting versions of zwei (B and C i think), dosent seem like its rly punisheable, though i havent seen a single lambda vid in weeks, not sure if that's still like that or if ppl have started punishing her for those.

[Effenhoog]

Does 6C still wallbounce on counterhit? I mostly liked using it to punish Tager if I predicted a sledge.

[arvelous]

Well... here japanese arcade mode is out http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CsvJns9yU7c&feature=sub or http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm9068739

[Arcade Fire87]

But Lambda has tons of mixups from far away in CT, like the standard 5DD>4DD>Wheel, 5DD>wheel, 5DD>4DD>TK cresent, 5DD>4DD>TK feint>any option Interesting that her one Zwei is air unblockable, seems scary to jump too much against her I get the feeling Zwei C might not be so safe, there was a video where Kahn RC'd a blocked Zwei C. But then again, everyone says it's pushing people far enough that it is safe, so I don't know

[kriaser]

Zwei C is the air attack one, which is relatively safe in most situations, but I have seen her poked out of it, most likely due to luck. Zwei C does not combo from 5DD from what I've seen (I would willingly be wrong on this). Only Zwei B does. Also, in regards to Zwei C, it goes a set distance. You can high jump over it, but if you do a normal IAD, I'm pretty sure Zwei C hits them. All in the timing, of course. The push back from Zwei C as usually been seen from barriers and normal blocks. I've yet to see what result of an IB'd Zwei C, which could have devastating results for Lambda.

[Arcade Fire87]

Exactly, which is why that move may have to be used sparringly. Icecar is harder to punish if barrier blocked, but IB that and Jin's in massive trouble