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[CF] Susanoo General Discussion

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combo thread is up go ahead and fill it and ill paste it once i get home saturday night, if the format can be made a little more intuitive let me know

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Couple questions, from people who have gotten a hang of Susan. 

What do you think of him so far? Thoughts? Is he lacking or in a good spot/hope on the horizon?

 

And is there any sweet high level matches I can watch of him? So far I've only seen some combo vids. I wanted to see how he fares against people.

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Hes not the best amazing i can stomp the match as people first guess he would. He struggles in the beginning due to severely lacking options but his neutral game. 6A and DP (when unlocked) hes a force to be reckoned with. Until that point he relies heavily heavily on smart neutral play and abusing his normals such as his 5B, 5C, 6A. staggered use of 5B  and mixing between 6B 1and 2 with 6C and 2C 1 and 2 with 5D 2D 6D CT etc. you have to play neutral even harder than Hakumen does resulting in the feeling of a gimped character. Youll generally have to expend more than what other characters have to do in order to gain the ability to properly fight back.

 

once youve unlocked "enough" youll be able to easily 3-4k average so long as you adhere to the rules of his combo system using the earliest contenders that will drop if done too late suck as 6B and 6D. Keeping track of your block strings,markers, enemy options vs your fluctuating options may appear daunting since if an enemy doesnt want to give you space at the start some characters really dont have to and theres not much you can do.

 

Hes strong but suffers, requires momentum and to generally out play the enemy since this character doesnt have "guaranteed" unlocks considering the moving reticle, you wont see any high level matches until they patch him in the arcades and/or ppl get used to him. The oens that are left anyway since his population dropped pretty hard.

 

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Any tips for dealing with Susanoo's pressure? His overhead actually seems very hard to react to for me, so I've just been playing Susanoo's with 50/50 defenses and taking 4k meterless when I guess wrong, then he's right on top of me on wakeup for more pressure. It's a bit frustrating, especially since I know he's supposed to be working for it, but I just can't block him properly. This is netplay, which does make it a little harder, but I get good enough connections that I don't think it should really be making a difference with overheads.

He has good frame traps for anything I try to do against the overhead, as well, if I predict wrong... Are there any tips on that axe kick overhead? I know I just need to learn it, but I've been trying and I just can't tell it very well until the kick is already coming down.

I mean, I know he's easy to keep out, I play Es, and it's easy to space him out a whole match, but on the other hand, I get tapped once and then I spend the rest of the match failing repeated defenses until I'm KO'd two and a half combos later.

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20 hours ago, Indigo said:

Any tips for dealing with Susanoo's pressure? His overhead actually seems very hard to react to for me, so I've just been playing Susanoo's with 50/50 defenses and taking 4k meterless when I guess wrong, then he's right on top of me on wakeup for more pressure. It's a bit frustrating, especially since I know he's supposed to be working for it, but I just can't block him properly. This is netplay, which does make it a little harder, but I get good enough connections that I don't think it should really be making a difference with overheads.

He has good frame traps for anything I try to do against the overhead, as well, if I predict wrong... Are there any tips on that axe kick overhead? I know I just need to learn it, but I've been trying and I just can't tell it very well until the kick is already coming down.

I mean, I know he's easy to keep out, I play Es, and it's easy to space him out a whole match, but on the other hand, I get tapped once and then I spend the rest of the match failing repeated defenses until I'm KO'd two and a half combos later.

Record your matches. Look at the setups he does. Record those setups in the training mode. practice blocking them and test EVERY option you normally have available. To be honest, it just sounds like you need to get better at blocking.

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3 hours ago, solidscheme said:

Record your matches. Look at the setups he does. Record those setups in the training mode. practice blocking them and test EVERY option you normally have available. To be honest, it just sounds like you need to get better at blocking.

Well, yeah, I'm asking to get better at blocking. I'm far from great at blocking, but I am very defensive so I do know how it works, but I think my reaction speed is slightly below average, so I try to really learn the tells. I have looked into dealing with his pressure a bit, but that overhead in particular has been hard to distinguish in an actual match for me, I guess because it starts up similar to a normal standing attack. And all my options I experimented against it get beaten if he goes low instead. 

Not really sure what I'm looking for as an answer, since I know it's all down to my own skill, maybe something like if it's less damaging if I just take a low hit at a certain point of his strings, or a common move before the overhead in a blockstring, anything to lessen getting totally blown up by it.

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So, I've been playing Susano'O for roughly a week now and hot damn do I love being able to pull off his stuff (though my combo repertoire be limited indeed). But I am also noticing a lot of drawbacks to him as well, the most glaring of which being that unless you unlock his DP ASAP, most characters can just run a train over him until he dies. Even with 50 meter, his 632146D is not as good a reversal option since the opponent can just jump/bait it out. The fun doesn't stop there either, since most people know you need that DP right away and they know that as long as they jump over the standard 5B>5C>5D, then you're left wide open. His normals have range, but not the best speed.

One thing that also bugs me is his anti-air options. I've been trying to use 2C for this but the move moves him forward and most of the time, its vertical hitbox isn't enough to him people trying to jump in on you. Am I doing it too early or is 2C even the dedicated anti-air in the first place? On the opposite spectrum, his jump-in j.B and j.C are easily anti-aired out meaning that his approach from the air is not the most beneficial. How should I be handling his approaches in this regard?

This is also a bit character specific but, how should a Susano'O deal with Izanami's bone shield? Outside of trying to grab her of course? Because it seems like it outright shuts down virtually anything you might have unless you grab her or use the command grab yourself. Or is that true for most characters and Susano'O isn't the only one with this issue?

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On 11/7/2016 at 9:22 PM, Luminos564 said:

So, I've been playing Susano'O for roughly a week now and hot damn do I love being able to pull off his stuff (though my combo repertoire be limited indeed). But I am also noticing a lot of drawbacks to him as well, the most glaring of which being that unless you unlock his DP ASAP, most characters can just run a train over him until he dies. Even with 50 meter, his 632146D is not as good a reversal option since the opponent can just jump/bait it out. The fun doesn't stop there either, since most people know you need that DP right away and they know that as long as they jump over the standard 5B>5C>5D, then you're left wide open. His normals have range, but not the best speed.

One thing that also bugs me is his anti-air options. I've been trying to use 2C for this but the move moves him forward and most of the time, its vertical hitbox isn't enough to him people trying to jump in on you. Am I doing it too early or is 2C even the dedicated anti-air in the first place? On the opposite spectrum, his jump-in j.B and j.C are easily anti-aired out meaning that his approach from the air is not the most beneficial. How should I be handling his approaches in this regard?

This is also a bit character specific but, how should a Susano'O deal with Izanami's bone shield? Outside of trying to grab her of course? Because it seems like it outright shuts down virtually anything you might have unless you grab her or use the command grab yourself. Or is that true for most characters and Susano'O isn't the only one with this issue?

I would test 2C against a variety of jump-in's in training mode to get a feel of how to use it. have the opponent do regular and instant air dash-ins to see what's what. It's all about experimenting like a scientist.

I tried Susan out first on my quest for a main. I came the conclusion that he shouldn't be jumping at the opponent until he unlocks Hunter's fang. His air normals seem only good when jumping straight up or retreating. They're not fast enough for aggressive approaches. Treat him like a more patient Hakumen. Unlocking moves using 2-4 hit combos at first. Learn to do normal/air grab combos immediately to deal with early rushdown. I call his early game-plan: The Pigeon Peck. Remember, 2-4 hit combos (clean or blocked) to unlock (5D) moves. Another thing is not every one will go for the same moves, figure out what 2-3 moves you need immediately and start practicing doing those unlock-combos from an unselected drive meter (nothing highlighted). 

Go into training and see what moves you have that stop the shield. That's the best way to find out. Be a scientist. 

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On 11/7/2016 at 7:29 AM, Indigo said:

Well, yeah, I'm asking to get better at blocking. I'm far from great at blocking, but I am very defensive so I do know how it works, but I think my reaction speed is slightly below average, so I try to really learn the tells. I have looked into dealing with his pressure a bit, but that overhead in particular has been hard to distinguish in an actual match for me, I guess because it starts up similar to a normal standing attack. And all my options I experimented against it get beaten if he goes low instead. 

Not really sure what I'm looking for as an answer, since I know it's all down to my own skill, maybe something like if it's less damaging if I just take a low hit at a certain point of his strings, or a common move before the overhead in a blockstring, anything to lessen getting totally blown up by it.

Practice blocking his strings that bother you until you're visually aware of his moves and counter them the best way you can. Only you can prevent forest fires.

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