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Final Ultima

[XrdR2] Sol Badguy Changes Discussion

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Location Test #1 Changes

SOL BADGUY

5K - Attack start-up time is slower.
6HS - Ground normal hit effect changed to standard hitstun.
Bukkirabou ni Nageru - Does not come out if input contains any upward direction during command completion.
Gun Flame (Feint) - Receives the effects of dash momentum.
(DI) Gun Flame - Receives the effects of dash momentum.
(DI) Grand Viper - During the rush forward, the hit effect of the flame pillar portion always blows the opponent towards Sol.

I don't think I need to say what we're probably all already thinking regarding that 5K change. Everything else seem decent enough though. 6HS's change applies to a situation we wouldn't have seen a whole lot before. It's a nerf in meterless situations insofar as we don't get the knockdown off CH 2S anymore (and if it's standard hitstun, it'll be horribly minus on hit), but it does give us some small perks in regards to possible Roman Cancel conversions, either off CH 2S or for edge case long range hits. (DI) Gun Flame gaining dash momentum is pretty great as far as optimal Dragon Install combos are concerned, the corner carry should be even better than before. The (DI) Grand Viper change may as well be considered a bugfix, really.

Tweets from Dogura (@maneater_dgr), translated by greatfernman (@GREATFERNMAN):

Quote

6H doesn't knockdown on regular hit, counter hit is the same as before. Slight nerf?
5K is only slightly slower but feels extremely uncomfortable.
Others: I don't really understand the other changes

Slight nerf to Sol?

Quote

Sorry Sol got an amazing change.
When he lands wild throw, the camera zooms in.

Tweet from Kazunoko (@kazunoko0215):

Quote

Sol standing K
startup 3F→5F?


Location Test #2 Changes

SOL BADGUY

5K - Attack start-up time is slower.
6HS - Changed to a new move.
Gun Flame (Feint) - Receives the effects of dash momentum.
(DI) Gun Flame - Receives the effects of dash momentum.
Aerial Bandit Revolver - Changed to a 2-hit move. Attack level has been increased, knockback direction has been changed.
Bukkirabou ni Nageru - Does not come out if input contains any upward direction during command completion.
(DI) Grand Viper - During the rush forward, the hit effect of the flame pillar portion always blows the opponent towards Sol.

Most of the listed changes are repeats from the previous location test. The new changes are for 6HS and Aerial Bandit Revolver. There's not a whole lot to say about the new 6HS until we get some idea how it works, but I wouldn't be surprised if it functions similarly to the old 6HS. There'd be no real reason for them to change 6HS in the previous location test if they were just going to replace it completely anyway. The Aerial Bandit Revolver change could be interesting, but we don't yet know how the knockback has been altered exactly, so it could mean anything. We'll just have to wait for the location test proper.

Tweet from Hiago (@HiagoXYZ).

Quote

Everyone saying Sol's new 6hs has more hitbox than it appears

Tweet from majinobama (@2dJazz).

Quote

im told it is exactly the same as old 6h just new animation

Tweet from Maruhan (@reinashiobu), translated by Bears (@AMurderOfBears).

Quote

Sol 5K 6P 5H sjiad jKD air bandit knocks down, can RC from there into jD fafnir for extension

Tweet from Shinogi (@s_n_g_iex), translated by Bears (@AMurderOfBears).

Quote

Sol 5K is 5F. Tested by trying to link from bandit crouching hit on Millia. 5P (4F) links but 5K doesn't.


Location Test #3 Changes

Same as Location Test #2.

Tweet from Hiago (@HiagoXYZ).

Quote

Sol and Jam also seem unchanged.


Final Changes

5K - Attack start-up time has been increased from 3F to 5F. First hit is now active for 1 frame.
(DI) 5K - Attack start-up time has been increased from 3F to 4F.
6HS - Changed to a new move. See details below.
Gun Flame (Feint) - Receives the effects of dash momentum.
(DI) Gun Flame - Receives the effects of dash momentum.
Aerial Bandit Revolver - Changed to a 2-hit move. Attack level has been increased, knockback direction has been changed.
Bukkirabou ni Nageru - Does not come out if input contains any upward direction during command completion.
(DI) Grand Viper - During the rush forward, the hit effect of the flame pillar portion always blows the opponent towards Sol.

(Note: While previously unconfirmed, the camera change during Bukkirabou no Nageru present in Location Test #1 is not present in the final version.)

Tweets from Kedako (@kedako_faital), translated by greatfernman (@GREATFERNMAN):

Quote

Sol 6H
Atklvl 4
Startup 17f
Total 45f
Special 20f hitstop
Knockdown on air hit, ground bounce on CH
Total duration shorter than before (53f)

Quote

Sol 5K
Startup: 1st hit: 3to5f, 2nd hit: 5to6f Total: 23to24f

Air BR
Startup: 1st hit: 4f, 2nd hit: 18f
Total: landing+12f
Knockdown on hit

Additional notes about 6HS: Stun modifier has been removed. (DI) 6HS has start-up 10 and is +4 on regular block.
Additional notes about Aerial Bandit Revolver: Opponent can tech after second hit if hit at around "high jump into double jump" height or higher.

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Wouldn't this nerf to 5K make it hard to pin down the opponent in the corner while pressuring him with the constant fear of WT? Maybe jump outs are easier now. But still 1st location test.

6HS change could be not that bad at all, at least with 50% tension.

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C3jgXcDVYAAJM4i.jpg

New move incoming. Next location test starts February 11, so we should get some more details then.

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I was wondering if this new move is a command normal, and if it will replace one of his current ones. I doubt that he would get a new special move, but I do think it kind of resembles a forward-facing version of Order Sol's Fafnir...

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Location Test #2 Changes

SOL BADGUY

5K - Attack start-up time is slower.
6HS - Changed to a new move.
Gun Flame (Feint) - Receives the effects of dash momentum.
(DI) Gun Flame - Receives the effects of dash momentum.
Aerial Bandit Revolver - Changed to a 2-hit move. Attack level has been increased, knockback direction has been changed.
Bukkirabou ni Nageru - Does not come out if input contains any upward direction during command completion.
(DI) Grand Viper - During the rush forward, the hit effect of the flame pillar portion always blows the opponent towards Sol.

Most of the listed changes are repeats from the previous location test. The new changes are for 6HS and Aerial Bandit Revolver. There's not a whole lot to say about the new 6HS until we get some idea how it works, but I wouldn't be surprised if it functions similarly to the old 6HS. There'd be no real reason for them to change 6HS in the previous location test if they were just going to replace it completely anyway. The Aerial Bandit Revolver change could be interesting, but we don't yet know how the knockback has been altered exactly, so it could mean anything. We'll just have to wait for the location test proper.

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I wonder if the air Bandit Revolver change could let us do the BR 5K BR loop again. Just as a guess with knowing as little as we do so far, it sounds like they're trying to make the air version a little more useful, which is always a good thing.

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Kedako's rundown of Sol's frame data changes. It's worth pointing out that according to these changes, 5K(1) is now active for one frame rather than two, so the second hit comes out faster, relatively speaking. This means that 5K(2)'s utility as an anti-air hasn't been weakened to the extent that many of us feared. Also, because of the significantly reduced total duration of the new 6HS, it must have better recovery than the old one. Whether or not this affects the cancel window for meaty Gun Flame remains to be seen.

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The old values are just there for comparison, "3to5f" means "changed from 3F to 5F". As for ground hit 6HS, it's been confirmed to have standard hitstun. Sol has basically stayed the same since Location Test #2.

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Got a question about his new 6H... does it still lead to high damage on Counter-hit? (Also is it a Mid or a Low?)

i.e. 6H (ch) Bandit Bringer >Fafnir > 6P> 5H > j.D > Kudakero (both hits) > VV > VV knockdown?

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Aside from causing standard hitstun on ground hit rather than knockdown, the new 6HS is functionally identical to the old one. It's still a mid, it still knocks down on air hit, still ground bounces on CH. There are some other changes such as a shorter total duration (recovery) and presumably a slightly different hitbox and hurtbox, but that's it really.

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Also noticed Air Bandit Revolver got changed... what exactly happened there?  It was actually useful in mid-air for air tech grabs at times.

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Air BR knocks down now, and it has good corner carry. It may give a bit more time for oki than the VV followup.

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