[CS1] Hazama Gameplay Discusson

[Wolf Pup TK]

Has anyone experimented with RCing into ouroboros after a 214B chain? It might lead to some interesting results.

Hmm... Interesting indeed, though the total number of hits may be a limitation. I wonder if it's possible to pull off something like...

5B, 3C, 214D->C, 5C, 2C, 4D->D, j.C [x1], j.C [x1], 214B (RC), 4D->D, 5C, 2C, .....

Or something of the sort. I'm curious about the j.C[x1] because it looks like the first hit of each does most of the damage, so if you cut it out the following 4 hits of each, you've got an extra 8 hits to use (assuming you can successfully loop).

[JinSaotome]

IMO, its not really meter efficient, since a lot of Hazama's big damage comes off of Jayoku combos. Also, remember that RCing temporarily decreases your meter gain, meaning any C loops you try won't get you very much heat either.

[ghaleon109]

You can RC 214B into 4D~D, 5C, 2C. (I'm pretty sure the 2C connects, but won't go into 4D, or even j.C because of the length of the combo) but it's really shit damage for the meter you spend. I only do it if the 214B just isn't enough to kill them. For what it's worth you can do the same combo off of an air throw from pretty high up without having to RC.

[lunaris]

Has anyone experimented with RCing into ouroboros after a 214B chain? It might lead to some interesting results.

well, when you hit with an anti air ouroboros it's possible to simply do x(preferably one attack)>j.214b>rc>backdash/dj>4d~d>jyayoku or 5c>ouroboros air combo.

i haven't tested how much doing jyayoku can net you, but if they're low on health it's probably more likely to kill them than 5cx10. or you could use it to cement a life lead. chances are if you try to do a j.5c air combo before the j.214b, proration will prevent you from doing much of anything afterwards. whatever the case, if you're going to use 100 meter on a j.214b combo it had better be justified.

either way, if you have meter, instead of going for j.214b it's usually better to go for jyakou>rc, but sometimes the enemy's position relative to yours prevents you from doing so.

[Vans]

Indeed.

I've tried my hand at this a bit more, I've been able to connect up to two airborne ouroboros after the first RC but anything further just misses due to the opponent recovering. (Could probably connect another 214B here though)

This also seems to apply to the ground as well, any attempt to connect another BnB fails. (I can connect 5C => 2C like it was mentioned before, but anything further, nope).

Guess I would only see this useful as a trap to catch the opponent with his command throw if you expect a neutral recover in any case, but it's risky and I'd rather go for another Jayoku. :P

[JinSaotome]

on the topic of combo theory, the frame data says hitting people in the air with 236D causes wall bounce. Does this mean you can start a corner combo with something like 5B 3C xx 236D -> 5C -> ...?

[kazukifafner]

From my experience, 236D only causes wall bounce on CH in the corner.

[Dangle]

kazukifafner is correct, 236D slides/bounces on CH only, if it hits someone in the air and they wallbounced, they were trying something and got stuffed w/ 236D

[JinSaotome]

Aww, thats disappointing.

I didn't get a chance to test it in Japan, but I thought that would have been interesting.

[Digital Watches]

But it does seem to work from a FC situation...

[kazukifafner]

Yeah, you can get a combo off of it if CH; so it could be useful if delayed after a typical blockstring.

[JinSaotome]

oh, excellent! I'll definitely have to test that then next time I get access to CS.

I got to play Hazama maybe 5~ times in Japan so I didn't have very much time to test stuff.

but given its 100% proration, you could probably get some huge damage off of FC 236D -> Jayoku -> combo of choice

If anyone wants to try it out, lemme know how it turns out. :D

Also, does anyone have tips for not accidentally doing Jasetsu stance when trying to do 2C -> 4D? I dropped a lot of BnBs that way.

[kazukifafner]

I'll probably test it out later today.

Anyway, the problem that your having is that you are rolling the motion when going from 2 > 4 (so you're also hitting 1). Get into the habit of hitting 2, letting go, and then moving to 4. It'll make you're life a lot easier. A lot of people hold 2 throughout the duration of 2C (idk, I guess they think the move will change if they let go of the direction), but you can let it go as soon as the attack initiates. So you actually have a lot of time to go from 2 to 4, given 2C's animation.

[JinSaotome]

Yeah, I have that same habit of holding 2

Alright, I'll try to rain myself to go to neutral after 2C then. thanks!

[Wolf Pup TK]

A few questions to helpfully help me not drop some critical combos.

1) After Jayoku (not corner), do I need to step back to be able to connect [6D~A]xN? I've been trying to connect without moving but never could land it.

2) On some lighter characters (like Tao), I have trouble landing the j.CxN after 5B/5C, 3C, 214D->C, 5C, 2C, 4D~D. I seem to go to high to connect. Any tips on that?

Thanks!

[FlyingVe]

1) You have to step back to connect the 6D~A x N but it's not quite a full back dash (or at least I don't do a full one).

2) You can pretty much just mash out the jC's after pulling yourself up with 4D~D and hit the small characters, but even if you go to high and wiff the first jC, keep mashing, more often than not I hit them with the second one and can continue the combo.

[Segretezza]

I'm having difficulties connecting one of the BnB combos for Hazama...

5D~C, j.5B, (land) 5B, 3C, 214D~C, 2C, j.Cx5, (land) 2C, 4D~D, j.Cx5. dj.Cx5, dj.214B

That 4D~D is giving me some grief... I get the Nu syndrome and either mash D to much causing it to retract before it hits OR my timing is off and after the 2C the Ouroboros doesn't come out until the combo is over.

Any suggestions in order to get this combo done properly? Or should i just go 5C, 2C, 623D and end it?

Also, I'm curious about combos ending with 623D where you can apparently end that with 632146C. Whats the timing with that?

[kazukifafner]

From what I've tested, 236D CH combos do roughly the same amount of damage as the typical BnB combos.

@Segretezza

The reason that 4D~D is giving you grief is because it shouldn't work in the first place. The "4D~D" in "jCxn > 2C > 4D~D > jCxn > JC > jCxn > j214B" only connects if there are no more than 2 hits before the 214D~C used to set it up (though, my experience seems to indicate that it considers "5C(2 hits)" as only one, though I'll have to check to be certain).

As for 623D > 632146C: They have to be high enough (otherwise, there isn't enough time to connect). For the timing, it's best to figure out that kind of thing yourself (because people have different methods of dealing with strict timing). Also, I'd only use that if you want a flashy way to finish a match, because 623D > 66 > 3C > 236236B is a far better option.

[Segretezza]

Ok thanks, hes gonna take some time getting used to...but luckily messing with Tao makes the drive moves a little easier.

Now with the combo thats in the Hazama section for BnBs,

5B/5C, 3C, 214D~C, 5C, 2C, (JC) j.B, j.Cxn, dj.Cxn, 214B

Every time I try to land j.B they are too high to hit. Perhaps im not JC soon enough for the kick to hit? Would it be better to leave out 5C and just JC right after 2C?

[kazukifafner]

Honestly, at that point it'd be better just to do:

5B/5C > 3C > 214D~C > 5C > 2C > 4D~A > 4D~D > jCxn > JC > jCxn > j214B

Though, it'd still be better to use the standard BnB, but the above one actually works in the corner and does close to the same amount of damage (albeit, with less heat gain).

[lunaris]

are there any videos of people using this crossup? or have people around here started using it? i've never seen it so i figured i'd post it. i searched for "crossup" and never saw anyone talk about this method specifically.

vs an enemy in the corner:

5d>C activation>j.2c(front)/slightly delayed j.5b(back)

the crossup itself happens very fast. i'm not sure if it's possible to frame trap them if they try to jump away on reaction to being hit by the drive, though. instead of doing j.2c it's possible to simply whiff a throw and do 5b, which will net you more damage but will be slower.

i found you can also do it by using 2d directly above them, but i'm not as positive on the method for that. i suppose that would make it more ambiguous, but it generally seems like you have to delay it in order to get the xup.

[kid viper]

on a random note: Me and Kensou have qualified for SBO as Team Kamen Rider. We will be representing Hazama and Bang accordingly.

[kazukifafner]

on a random note: Me and Kensou have qualified for SBO as Team Kamen Rider. We will be representing Hazama and Bang accordingly.

Congratz! Hopefully, some vids will be posted up. I'm expecting great things. Great. Things.

[redsilversnake]

Are there any good ways out of pressure when you don't have heat? Right now, all I do is jump and use Ouroboros to escape.

[kid viper]

block your way out or urobouros out