GG:AC Official Tier List Thread

[Henaki]

Kurumster I've never even heard of you. (PS the only way Baiken has some sort of advantage is if shes blocking something for more than a second which means your mixup failed!).

[Doren2k]

Ok. 2/3 for 20 bux.

[Henaki]

Ok. 2/3 for 20 bux.

In fact, 2/3, 15 bucks as well.

[vegta12]

ill 2/3 for 20bucks as long as u are a favorable match-up for ino

[krazykorean456]

When did this become a MM thread??? :P And thanks POScrub for the translation :3 I might as well put in my two cents XD

Ok. 2/3 for 20 bux.

Yo Doren, how about a match with a better Millia than Kurumster :P

And not for money. I wanna match you for the BEST JAM ALIVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! title with my Millia

[Hellmonkey]

did we still need those lists translated?

[POscrub]

Teyah: Fixed the defense thing. Hellmonkey: 8-ball points to Yes.

[Hellmonkey]

Kurumster needs to go on time out.

[Hellmonkey]

ABA, Eddie, Zappa, Faust, Bridget, Millia those are left?

[Hellmonkey]

Eddie:

• Average Damage S: Rank drops if Eddie can't dizzy.
• Max Damage S: Not much different than his average damage, overwhelmingly S+
• Pokes C(S): Drills and skull together are very strong. If you don't stick out 2S early it will lose. 2K is strong in AC but it is a bit weak.
• Pressure/Lockdown B(S): It is very tension dependant but the advantage frames of drill special is too good. Mawaru is good for locking down, making his lockdown A rank.
• Mixup S+: Unblockables, lol.
• Okizeme S+: ^
• Against ground B: Flying early j.K and his air game in general is strong if used well.
• Anti air C(A): Slow 6P and early little eddie slash. If it lands, the return is huge but it's not especially strong.
• Breaking out of pressure C: Throwing out 2P can be annoying, but that's it.
• Defense D: This is his weakness.
• In general C+(S): There are no complaints?
• Overall rank S+: ^
• Good matchups: From okizeme unblockables into unblockables.
• Bad matchups: People say Baiken but it's 50/50. Really only himself.

Some parts I wasn't exactly sure of, they don't really say much.

[POscrub]

Hellmonkey: Yeah, all those except Millia, feel free to check Millia though, I did that one in a hurry. I think I did Eddie's average damage a while back, I think I came up with, "Rank drops if Eddie can't dizzy."

[Hellmonkey]

Works for me. I didn't really feel like whoever wrote this knew Eddie well.

[Kasou]

after reading tgs's post it just confirms what kurumster said - that it is a hard matchup for millia because she has to step her game up.

[Rift]

Well I can see the matchup being in Baiken's favor, but not by more than 5.5-4.5 for Baiken. It's not like Baiken's counters trump any sort of oki or pressure, else venom would have like a 100000000-0 matchup in favor of Baiken. I mean, if you're not willing to change your gameplay drastically for every matchup, you (not specifically anyone I'm referring to, by "you" I mean everyone in general) should play a simple character, or maybe a simpler game even, because that's what GG is about.

[Kasou]

i still think it's about 6 for baiken. I mean the scary thing about fighting against a millia, and what makes millia playable, is that if she knocks you down you're in for some serious trouble. But baiken pretty much cuts that game down pretty effectively with her counters (or at least dumbs it down). Then you've got a millia who can't get in on the ground against baiken (since her ground game isn't that strong to begin with). Worse still she can't even really get in from the air with pin. Which leaves her only true guarantee damage option from anti airs/air throws and random knockdowns (which doesn't do much damage). Then she gets her okizeme, but again it's effectiveness is already cut down. Pretty much from the above the millia player seems to need to work a lot harder than the baiken player for pressure and damage and needs to do a lot more guesswork. Hence it is not just a slightly bad matchup, it should at least be a 6-4 for baiken. If the baiken player is smart, they only have to play patiently and they have a high chance to win against millia.

[Hellmonkey]

It's 5-5 If Baiken manages to get hits in, even off her counters, it will do big damage. Millia has the speed and moves required to deal with counters, and Baiken takes enough damage that she doesn't need to get in many times to win. Generally, whoever gets momentum in the match will win it, the pin is a pain to deal with as Baiken because it can't be countered at all if used correctly, giving Millia at least one free mixup if she catches Baiken in the wrong spot. Baiken doesn't have the height or speed to poke Millia very well out of the air. Both players have to be extremely careful. It's retarded to say that the Baiken just needs to be patient. She needs to actively make sure that she won't get caught in bad positions where Millia can mix her up, and watching for counters too much will just get her thrown and dead quickly. Throwing pokes out at the right times and predicting Millia's movement in general is the best way to get hits in. Millia losing her pin gives Baiken a big advantage in poking, so the Millia player needs to be careful not to waste it stupidly. Baiken can't jump in at Millia on the ground safely at all while poking, so any decent Millia who notices a Baiken doing that can punish her hard.

[Helter Skelter]

Isn't A.B.A vs Baiken, alot worse than Millia vs Baiken? Anyway good job so far on the lists, can you do A.B.A's next. Thanks.

[Kane]

Millia dies if she's predictable in any match-up, you have to be especially unpredictable vs Bacon (i.e: step your game up?) I'm also happy with these lists, nice one!

[reaVer]

Like I said, what destroys Millia vs Baiken as with any mixup character vs Baiken is that Baiken cannot be stringed, overheads cannot be used to full effect, so the high-low game there is already gone. Now, a lot of characters aren't really hurt by this as their main source of damage is from damage and heavy hitting normals(OS is a mixture of both mixup and attack vs throw kinda, so he's affected but not as much as any standard mixup character). But Millia has to do a lot of guessing work since she also lacks confirms and a way to deal with the impending counters. That's the idea I have of both characters. And of course, Millia can guess right lots of the time, but Baiken tips 200 dmg with no effort and that's justa normal character like Sol.

[Doomscyther]

Overheads can be used to full effect.........you can still have a High-low game on baiken. Baiken just cant counter everything and its safe. Knowing when to do it and which one is better for the situation is key. Last time I checked, millia can do easy damage from an oki, even on baiken. Edit: Damage for both of them is situational.

[TGS]

Like I said, what destroys Millia vs Baiken as with any mixup character vs Baiken is that Baiken cannot be stringed, overheads cannot be used to full effect, so the high-low game there is already gone. Now, a lot of characters aren't really hurt by this as their main source of damage is from damage and heavy hitting normals(OS is a mixture of both mixup and attack vs throw kinda, so he's affected but not as much as any standard mixup character). But Millia has to do a lot of guessing work since she also lacks confirms and a way to deal with the impending counters. That's the idea I have of both characters. And of course, Millia can guess right lots of the time, but Baiken tips 200 dmg with no effort and that's justa normal character like Sol.

...Go back on timeout.

[AKA]

Millia is nothing but autopilot hitchecks and safe 50/50's. If you make a mistake in your movement patterns, you'll get snatched and lose a lot of life. Otherwise, no character in the game can catch her unless it's on a big guess move and you were an idiot (pretty easy to do if you get greedy).

The amount of damage she can do off of a mixup in the corner is preposterous for how difficult it is to get out of. Any connected hit except for a straight-up knockdown leads to that mixup.

As far as Millia vs. Baiken, Millia can run away all day. Guessing j.K's as pre-emptive AA, then reacting on whiff to a safe retreat stops Baiken from jumping forward. The only way to beat that is if she does a j.S on the way up in HER jump, and if you happened to not do anything, she's 6P bait on anything she does except airdash back tatami. The pin mixup (throwing it or not) is as strong as it is against any other character. First-generation mixup is all Millia needs because her lockdown isn't exceptionally strong, and Baiken is susceptible just like anyone else. Counters shouldn't even be an issue because on block she gets killed, and most of the time they're guess counters. 6K is your primary overhead because of the bufferability (counter-safety), 2D is your primary poke at max range (beats all of Baiken's moves due to invincibility window, range is an issue), and you throw a lot. You throw a LOT. Unless the Baiken in question has pefect knowledge of where she can option-select counter and do it without thinking, forcing her to make mistakes isn't a big deal.

Ouren is really the only thing in this match that allows Baiken to "run away forever and do lots of damage", but if she's looking for Ouren you just need to be throwing more (like any other counter).

Baiken vs. Millia is dead even, but just like anyone else, Baiken has to out-guess Millia and stay on the ground unless she can safely control the space in front of her (which is basically at full screen without taking risks). Millia doesn't get greedy on her offense (just like anyone else), and if her first-gen mixup is blocked then you need to start mixing in throws constantly. Dash-braking and faking at the range of her far S and sweep are amazing because it gets people to whiff, then to freeze, which is throw bait.

My thoughts aren't coming together very well because I'm nursing a hangover today. No hating, but it's not a very good post and I'm seeing a lot of misinformation.

[Memorick]

Now, a lot of characters aren't really hurt by this as their main source of damage is from damage and...

What?

[reaVer]

lol:P throw vs normal mixups, not damage.

[koogy]

lol:P throw vs normal mixups, not damage.

WHAT