Lord Knight Report post Posted April 4, 2012 this char is not the 4th worst in extend, lol Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mMarikom Report post Posted April 4, 2012 this char is not the 4th worst in extend, lol What IS the Extend tier list LK? I have no idea I was just going off of what he said... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nakkiel Report post Posted April 4, 2012 Her placing seems somewhat sporadic right now, it doesn't really matter in this game. If you're not in the S-tier, your placement doesn't really change anything. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lord Knight Report post Posted April 4, 2012 i agree with satoshi's list, Ragna Valk Tao Lambda Mu Hakumen Arakune for S, the everyone else is A if you wanna get into semantics, litchi is the worst char, if it makes the low tier hero's feel better Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
mMarikom Report post Posted April 4, 2012 Makes sense Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lord Knight Report post Posted April 4, 2012 snip having a flow chart? im going to switch to valk? really? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fugu Report post Posted April 4, 2012 It's confusing and discouraging because everyone is so high level around here that they treat her casually as a great character when the fact is she's the fourth worst character in the game. This fact is played as irrelevant because nothing seems to be worth discussing below the Highest level of play, which seems to be like, 8 people in our entire country. Those 8 people are all that matters, and they all seem to be right here.It's ironic because the matchup subforum is barren. The lack of information that you perceive to be targeted specifically at low-level players (like I did when I started playing in CT) goes all the way up the ladder. It's not that there's no information though, it's that it's often explained with little context and almost always concernes itself with the "what" and not the "how", which is a method that isn't entirely helpful to new players. But the fact is, the reason people don't focus on the latter is that if you practise enough, you will ultimately figure that out; execution is a lot of trial and error, and while it would be nice if there were more clear explanations of how to do some things, it's not a showstopper and you will figure it out as dozens of Litchi players before you have. I came at CT from basically the lowest possible level (only fighting game experience was Melee). I don't have any magical method to execution or thinking that I didn't develop in the last four years of playing this game, and I've only ever played Litchi. It is definitely possible to utilize these resources -- sparse as they may be -- to become a better player, so long as you are willing to catch yourself when you fall. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
NickExtreme1 Report post Posted April 4, 2012 I've been meaning to ask this for a bit: Has the recovery time / frame advantage of Tsubame changed in EX? It seems I can't punish Litchi as easily with Valkenhayn after it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nakkiel Report post Posted April 4, 2012 I haven't noticed such a thing. You may want to check if you're subconsciously barriering/IB barriering it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Star-Demon Report post Posted April 4, 2012 (edited) snip! Rock on. How do I chill out and stay hydrated? having a flow chart? im going to switch to valk? really? See this thread about a few months ago for flowchart and how "this char is easy".. I remember you saying said you wanted to "play valk...I want to win" in stream a few weeks ago, which marked the increase in comments regarding this character, the best being recent ones in the "ask LK" thread, where you pretty much screwed the pooch with "stupid chars get to stay stupid but my char gets nerfed" and the following "what is dumb" discussion. JP list is the list, from the bottom it was Makoto, Tsubaki, Jin, Litchi. That's 4. She's the fourth worst. There were plenty of Litchis at BlueRevo, so maybe the new list, which I didn't get a look at yet, reflects more experience, but I don't buy it, given S tier's existence. The way we're trying to come up with anything so abstract it doesn't make sense to make litchi sound strong sounds desperate. She's C. How many off-hand comments are going to need to be made in stream and other threads before she gets that C in our lovely tier list thread? Edited April 4, 2012 by Star-Demon Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lord Knight Report post Posted April 4, 2012 litchi is an A tier char, that list was from january Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nakkiel Report post Posted April 4, 2012 Play a different character if you care so much about tier placement. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Star-Demon Report post Posted April 4, 2012 (edited) Play a different character if you care so much about tier placement. You haven't been reading anything I say, have you? This isn't about the tier placement, It's about how deciding if this character is easy/dumb/strong or if she actually has serious disadvantages, and it only looks like nobody can make up their damn mind. One side says "If you can't in two months go home (Moy comes to mind)" and the other's like "It's ok, Litchi is hard, you'll lose more than others at before you get there." No one seems to be able to decide what to say about the character, and I'm just calling everyone out on it; the comments in stream and in the other thread speak for themselves: people don't want to say anything bad officially but then say stuff like "she's hard", "situational", and so on. Why not just be honest with yourselves about it? She got it hard in this version, and not being S really frigging sucks. How you present this to others definitely influences how they treat the game. To me, the last two months have been "she's still really good" and then I hear all these problems and complaints. It just sounds like no one knows what they are talking about or aren't being honest. Now nobody sounds credible enough because of their point of view. Edited April 4, 2012 by Star-Demon Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Lord Knight Report post Posted April 4, 2012 if you cant even combo, why should that stuff matter? it has nothing to do with your goals Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
E3vE3 WAZ HEA Report post Posted April 4, 2012 (edited) cant everyone agree to disagree star: litchi has tools that no matter how bad they nurf her she can never be bad because her oki and mix up are too powerful in the right hands. but not every litchi is going to learn it quickly. everyone seems to be saying that u need a change in additued which is right but you also need a cange in MINDSET. if you keep doubting yourself you will keep losing just try to be positive, take it from someone who always use to doubted himself and still does at times, its not healthy and its not going to help you get better. so suck it up, train, do the best you can and when you lose say to yourself "i may have lost but i know i can do better" and when you win say to yourself "this is what happends when i work hard" now do YOU HAVE WHAT IT TAKES TO GET BETTER OR ARE YOU GOING TO KEEP THE SALT COMING BECAUSE I CAN SUBMIT SOME FRIES IF YOU'D LIKE Edited April 5, 2012 by E3vE3 WAZ HEA Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nakkiel Report post Posted April 5, 2012 I've been reading everything you say and I'm honestly tired of the garbage you post over and over. You don't read a damn thing anyone says to you. Stop looking for attention here. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Romeyurhomey Report post Posted April 5, 2012 Star-demon please, you contradicted yourself in the pass two pages. I'm glad your enthused about the game but man don't cry tears of salt about Litchi. I would like litchi to have better anti-airs, RC her DP, Staff to fly around even if you get hit, and higher damage output but it's NOT gonna happen. Just work with what you got. Well anyways does anybody have any combos midscreen that is 3C CH starter that does more than 3K? Also I know you can cancel itsuu into Four Winds or D but is there anyway you can control that so that it will go vertical/horizontal? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nakkiel Report post Posted April 5, 2012 I really doubt there's a more optimized 3C CH combo than what we have already. 3K is pretty respectable anyways considering you get a lot of corner carry and meter gain from the combo. And the brief time window where you can Shishin or D after Itsuu keeps the staff in 2D set, there's no way to change it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Djudjo Report post Posted April 5, 2012 Well anyways does anybody have any combos midscreen that is 3C CH starter that does more than 3K? Also I know you can cancel itsuu into Four Winds or D but is there anyway you can control that so that it will go vertical/horizontal? 3C CH > Itsuu C > j.C > j.B > air Hatsu > Haku > Chun (now at this point, your opponent should be near the corner) > Haku > Chun > 5B > 6C(1) > aerial If you need a full screen combo: 3C CH > Itsuu C > j.C > j.B > 6C(1) > Chun > 2C > 5C > aerial or 3C CH > Itsuu C > j.C > j.B > 6C(1) > Chun > 5B > 6C(1) > aerial -this one is an 'ok' corner carry, does little damage, tho And no, after Itsuu it'll always come as a 5D Four Winds, if i'm not mistaken as the staff will always be launched vertically. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fugu Report post Posted April 5, 2012 Learning curve and tiers don't always run parallel (see: Tager). Litchi's placement on the tier list is irrelevant to pretty much all of the playing populous, and the fact that she's still being played successfully should indicate this to you pretty clearly. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
kurokage Report post Posted April 5, 2012 I honestly think litchi is a great character, yes her damage is situational but for the most part you can just train to recognize them and matches become al ot more easier IMO. Litchi's oki is scary which I think makes her who she is, underrated yes, bad character I disagree. her mix up is why I play her and even though I may have to think more in a fight about whats going on I personally enjoy it and the reward of hitting a mixup, setup, or juggle with her makes up for the lack of damage. only time will tell about her Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Star-Demon Report post Posted April 5, 2012 3C CH > Itsuu C > j.C > j.B > air Hatsu > Haku > Chun (now at this point, your opponent should be near the corner) > Haku > Chun > 5B > 6C(1) > aerial If you need a full screen combo: 3C CH > Itsuu C > j.C > j.B > 6C(1) > Chun > 2C > 5C > aerial or 3C CH > Itsuu C > j.C > j.B > 6C(1) > Chun > 5B > 6C(1) > aerial -this one is an 'ok' corner carry, does little damage, tho And no, after Itsuu it'll always come as a 5D Four Winds, if i'm not mistaken as the staff will always be launched vertically. Staffless 3C CT combos. :D I don't remember if you could do it in CS2 or not. Don't remember seeing other Litchis do it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cxc8nM5J4s8 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Urichinan Report post Posted April 5, 2012 You didn't see other Litchi's do it because a Staffless 3C CH can lead to actual combos. In CS2 CH 3C 5C > j.BCB x4 was what most people would do. If you were good about hit-confirming you would go for Haku > Chun and the like. In Extend, if the Staff is near by, then you go into the Chun > Staff 2 > TK Chun route, if it's not, then you go 5C > 2C > 6C(1) > Chun > 2C > 5C > Air Ender or you could go with IAD oki by doing 2C > j.B > j.C > Staff Recall/Kote > IAD/Shinshin. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Nakkiel Report post Posted April 5, 2012 3C CH ItsuuC 5D (brief hold) Hatsu Chun staff2 2C 6D/4D corner combo is ideally what you should go for. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Djudjo Report post Posted April 5, 2012 It needs an exact distance from the corner to work perfectly, it's not that reliable. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites