[CT-CS2] Carl Clover Loke Test

[ItemNazo]

:[ The Moko vs Carl was pretty one side.

xxxx

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DFRTlj2fhoE&feature=related

This video is pretty old Ada Anima have Super Armor :V

[BoogE-Man]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XIBDFposzkE

Last match. Carl vs Hazama. Not as bad as the vs Makoto one. Round 3 is the most interesting of the rounds. We see some of the new resets and combos. At one point, Carl uses up over half of Nirvana's meter and only does about 3.2k altogether.

[Ca$$iu$ Check$]

Another notable point, in round 1, just as the brio that hit Hazama and bounced him into the corner connected, a blue exclamation point appeared, like when an opponent tries to normal air block an air-barrier-only anti-air attack. So then what's the deal? I thought others with actual access to the game were stating that it can be blocked exactly the same as CS1.

[Marisa]

I thought others with actual access to the game were stating that it can be blocked exactly the same as CS1.

I've seen most people saying that it was like CT, where it was an unairblockable.

[soujiro seta]

Trying to use google translator for jbbs (lulzy), but if I found some stuff and I tried to interpret them as best as possible.

-"J2C> 5B> 5C> 8D benefits> 5C> Cantabile> 5C> JB> 4D> 5C> hjc> JB> jc> J2C (3D) JC> 3D hit this place in 3500"

j.2C allecan? 5B 5C 8D(bonus proration) cantabile 4C]D[ j.B (4D hits) 5C hjc j.B dj.3C]D[ j.C (3D hits) = 3500

-"2D non-gar> J2C array> (5C> JB> jcJB> JC> 8D) * n I'm still pretty fired. Last 3C> 3D possible.My sister is consumed but there "

2D (starter??) j.2C allecan (5C j.B dj.B dj.C 8D) loop. You can end with 3C 3D. Nirvana broke

-j.A mash xn j.B dj.B dj.C 3D

-Cantabile into 8D for bonus proration (seems to be a good idea to elongate combos)

My take:

8D seems to be the new 4D. Hitting someone with a naked 8D might make it possible to do the volante/4D CS1 comb. I'm really curious as to what 8D's P1 and P2 are.

The first combo only made use of 8D 4D 3D, so atleast you'll have a lot of meter left (assuming she was at 100/75% when you started) to attempt a reset into a solo combo if you don't want nirvana to die after you hit confirm.

After a 2D unblockable, 5C j.B dj.B 8D might be the way to go to do volante/4D like CS1. Since they always fall slowly after getting hit by 8D (hand), you don't have to time it anymore so they get hit by the clap only.

He might not be as bad as I thought (thank goodness), the thing though is at jbbs they made mention of how you have to work much harder now. Since nirvana can die much faster than her CS1 counter part, it makes it hard to approach/zone/defend all at once, like you can in CS1. Something along the lines of "So much effort, not enough reward".

Going by the haz vid, carl looks like character that will be played in short bursts now. Having to constantly stop to recharge and going all out (not to the point that nirvana breaks) when he catches someone. Tao, haz, ara, mu matchups just got worse cause he can't chase them down with nirvana anymore now. He doesn't need the corner to deal damage, obviously, which is good. The main problem is it's going to take a while to trap characters now, and since his damage is lower, the damage from resets and juggles just got even wider. The good thing now is you can end big damage juggles with j.C into 3D for resets. Problem is whether she'll have enough meter to attempt to attempt a reset.

Overall he's shaping up better than I expected. Even if he ends up low, atleast just not so bad he gets blown away by everyone.

[Akanishi]

It's going to take awhile before we see the full potential of CS2 Carl from the looks of it.

Btw J2C seems to be a better cross-up tool now than before, something with the hitbox range. It's possible to not get hit by DPs now, all except jin's dp maybe. Very safe cross-up tool according to the bbs.

[Ca$$iu$ Check$]

I've seen most people saying that it was like CT, where it was an unairblockable.

I was referring to stuff like this:

Also brio returned to CS1 quality...

If anyone posted that it was air unblockable I missed it, my bad

[Akanishi]

I assumed that it went to CS1 quality, since it wasn't specified to what it was returned. My bad, should've checked more than one source. I don't know if it's completely air unblockable though, so maybe it can be barrier blocked? Oh well... （´･ω・）ぅｩ

[Ca$$iu$ Check$]

Well in the latest vid that we've seen with Carl vs Hazama, a little blue exclamation point came up when Hazama was hit with Brio near the corner, so I'm thinking that it has to be air barrier blocked. Cause in CS the completely air unblockable 8D didn't make the same exclamation point appear iirc. If you find out anything let us know. Oh and I wasn't picking at you by any means, thanks a ton for all your translations too.

[JG]

After seeing this:

http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm13023209

Im started to think that Carl isnt doomed in Cs2. Actully maybe he can get strog. Im impress when i saw the new j.C, seems cool for performing UB. Maye they want to Carl be similar to Eddie in the unblockeable side, like find a knockdown then UB.

Sad that Nirvana gauge drain so fast... but also her regen speed is really good so maybe the way that it is now isnt so bad.

[Zeero]

I don't think there'll be unblockables just because of that jC, theres no knockdown for you to set up the unblockable, but it does spawn for constant pressure/mixup games... 3d will pick them back up if they don't tech, if they do tech, they're stuck in block stun...except nirvana has no life...

its still hard to say imo, need my hands on that hat to tell

[Mascarpone]

The j.C thing is actually really neat. not gonna lie. Looks like the new sandwich idea is launch -> wake up / reset rather than huge juggles. I still worry tho. Hazama is a footsies kind of thing. Characters with strong (maybe even just moderate) rush down still seem like they're going to cripple carl.

Side note: Platinum is more talkative than Hazama and almost as talkative as Bridget...

<3

[Zoogstin]

I'm really curious as to what 8D's P1 and P2 are.

I posted that a few pages ago.

[Dream Maker]

Hi. I played a few games again today as Hakumen but I fought a good Carl in my local arcade today so I figured I would share some more info for you guys apparently fearing that Carl will fall in the bottom tier. My local arcade's level is far from being exceptional, still there are a few very decent players here and this guy is one of them.

He is doing really good particularly on pressure. I have the feeling that weakened IB's are in fact quite an advantage to Carl as it is even more difficult to break out from pressure as before. Also he was using quite a nasty pressure trick with 8D, now that it breaks 2 primers you really don't want to guard this. So taking advantage of me crounching guard for fearing 8D he was able to relaunch pressure with AD jB, etc... That shit was really really scary and I guess you have to react pretty quickly to avoid eating this, unless you have only 1 primer left in which case standing guard barrier certainly goes without saying.

Also jC knocking down is damn good. Gives Carl a decent okizeme even if Nirvana is not well placed and j2C crossups are still here to annoy your opponent and place yourself in a more favorable position. 3D is a good option as oki if Nirvana is close.

Also this guy's Nirvana did not die a single time even though I was trying hard to break her. He manages his nirvana gauge really well, reliying on cantabile combos when its low. Cantabile combo do low damage but now a little more extandable than before thanks to jB, j2C gatling = good to let some time to nirvana for charging and gives decent oki thanks to jC whether nirvana is here or not.

The big downside seems to be damage really... The guy didn't do many big combos, mostly between 2000-3000,　could only get close to 4000 or a little above from a good starter with old style juggle and super if enough nirvana gauge but his combos were not really optimized yet.

PS: Also ate a 6D counter while being in air which resulted in a wallbounce. I don't think this change has been mentioned yet.

[ZONG_one]

the 6D change has been mentioned a while back.

How was he able to capitalize on the CH? Was the untechable time long on the wallbounce?

Good shit, keep posting. :]

I'd like to hear all of this stuff first hand from people like you. <3

[ioKain]

Agreed, thx for the info. Any chance you can get us some vids on Carl?

[soujiro seta]

I posted that a few pages ago.

Oh so sorry I forgot about that cause it's a couple pages back.

snip

Thanks, all your first hand input is definitely appreciated. Problem though, with the meter thing, is in the haku vs carl matchup it's very easy to conserve meter. I really wanna see him vs rushdown/zoning character(besides haku) where he's going to have to have her active more often.

Picked out some things from jbbs, I'll always post the original version cause my translation can most likely be way off.

"5B2B> 6B + sister called> 5C +4 D distance> JC> (4D hits)> before the system> 5C> JBJ2C> JB> jc> JBJ2C> (8D release)> JBJC> 8D2 hit> (Landing)> J2C> JBJC 3500 about this."

5B>2B>6B>cantabile>22D>4C]D[??>j.C>(4D hits)>66??>5C>j.B>j.2C>j.B>dj.B>dj.2C>dj.B>dj.C>2hit 8D(clap and hand or 2 hit wave?)>land>j.2C>j.B>j.C about 3500

"-6A unbeatable ease of use and wide

-2B reach is extended

-B Viba time increases upper body invincible.

-sister walking speed is faster

-8D added bonus compensation portion of the hand, can trigger guard and Bali. Gadopuraima collapsed two (the part of the hand, one by one part of the wave

-3D wall-bound side of the screen and be hit with much brio and forced to stand against the sky and hit down

-Cantata generation is faster"

-6A easier to use

-2B reach is extended (thank goodness)

-Upper body invincibility increased on B vivace

-Faster nirvana walk speed

-8D has bonus proration on the hand (so that's where it is), and can guard break. Takes 2 primers (uhh does that mean that both the wave and hand take 1 primer each?)

-After hitting opponent with brio near the corner and forcing wallbound, if you time it right you can use 3D force standing right before they hit the ground.

-Cantata generation is faster

Bonus on 8D hand is very nice. I guess now we'll have to delay combos a bit, or combo a bit closer to nirvana if we want that bonus. Atleast they always fall slow after it hits so that's good.

The fact that 5C j.B j.2C is connecting might mean that j.2C's hitbox was increased, cause iirc in CS1 you would need a sjc for that or a character with a good hitbox such as jin/ragna for it to work, or be very close to the opponent when in the air. That also explained why someone, don't remember who exactly, said j.2C crossup was safer. Although they didn't say what character that combo worked on, unless it's universal ofcourse.

[Zoogstin]

Yo guys good/bad news depending on how you look at it. In case you guys didn't already know if you start a combo off with a gold burst the burst will put a 65% proration on your combo so you can't do much. HOWEVER if you use a burst mid-combo you get a 110% combo proration on it. So if you can do 2 gold bursts in one combo we're talking a lot of damage. Observe:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-LIvq2Zymc

Carl can easily combo into a gold burst due to Nirvana. So we're gonna be seeing a lot of cool/retarded combos from not just Carl and Hazama but any character who can combo into a burst. The good news for us is that we'll be one of those characters. The bad news is combos like the one I posted will kill carl in one combo.

[soujiro seta]

lol, my bad j.B doesn't gatling into j.2C in CS1, i was going more on a "if it did it wouldn't work on most characters unless those conditions were met". Sorry to confuse

[soujiro seta]

Yo guys good/bad news depending on how you look at it. In case you guys didn't already know if you start a combo off with a gold burst the burst will put a 65% proration on your combo so you can't do much. HOWEVER if you use a burst mid-combo you get a 110% combo proration on it. So if you can do 2 gold bursts in one combo we're talking a lot of damage. Observe:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h-LIvq2Zymc

Carl can easily combo into a gold burst due to Nirvana. So we're gonna be seeing a lot of cool/retarded combos from not just Carl and Hazama but any character who can combo into a burst. The good news for us is that we'll be one of those characters. The bad news is combos like the one I posted will kill carl in one combo.

j.2C allecan 5B 5C cantabile 8D hand (bonus) gold burst (bonus x2)

Now image the damage if your opponent got hit by 8D hand as a starter into goldburst

[ZONG_one]

so does 6B > 5C now?

soujiro, I'm confused lol.

That'd be gdlk.

[soujiro seta]

so does 6B > 5C now?

soujiro, I'm confused lol.

That'd be gdlk.

lmao, my bad. I'm assuming they mean 6B cantabile 22D 5C....I'll make the edit. Thanks for the correction. I get so confused in trying to understand google's translations at times that I end up writing things the way google tranlate would.

[ioKain]

LOL, I know what I wanna try in CS2. Any combo into cantabile, input astral, combo them into the air and slap em right down back at Nirvana as she explodes. XD

Shit would be hilarious.

[Mascarpone]

LOL, I know what I wanna try in CS2. Any combo into cantabile, input astral, combo them into the air and slap em right down back at Nirvana as she explodes. XD

Shit would be hilarious.

i feel like a combo that would hold them in the air even close to that long would cary them far away, especially with j.c knock down so ud have to face the corner.

[Zeero]

Now image the damage if your opponent got hit by 8D hand as a starter into goldburst

this would be nice

except...

8D is no longer unblockable =(