[CS1-CSE] Valkenhayn General Discussion

[White]

Repost:

Valkenhayn:

*Rasenwolf command changed to direction + D

With this,the wolf break system has been eliminated apparently.

*2C>6B does not connect on a grounded opponent.

*Nacht rosen>[JB>JA]>2C does not work or its really tight.

Seems like they end up being too low for the 2C to hit.

*JC>air DD is difficult to connect.

Hima isn't sure why.

(Is JC not special cancelable anymore?Is the air DD slower?)

*w.5B does not launch.

w.5B does not cause float on air hit.

*w.5C is a sweep.

*w.JC is a diagonal kick.

Source:jbbs,twitter,hima

Damn it

[Kriegdrache]

dem nerfs ;~;

[Nokita]

Very basic wolf bnb

wolf A > wolf B > wolf C>6D> wolf JA

nachtjager is supposedly impossible to follow up.

EDIT:Courtesy of Hima.

[OrionXElite]

Very basic wolf bnb

wolf A > wolf B > wolf C>6D> wolf JA

nachtjager is supposedly impossible to follow up.

EDIT:Courtesy of Hima.

I'm playing a bit of Theory Fighter here but I bet you could link a Wolf 5B after the j.A for something like this:

[W]5A>5B>5C>6D>j.A>Land 5B>236B>j.236A>j.236B>6D~5D>[H]j.B>dj.B>j.C

Also if you can describe it Nokita, I'd really like to know just how the Wolf j.C hits the opponent, mainly in the air. Is it like Human j.C where is knocks them to the ground or can you do any kind of follow ups from it? I'm assuming the former but I'm still curious.

[Nokita]

I'm playing a bit of Theory Fighter here but I bet you could link a Wolf 5B after the j.A for something like this:

[W]5A>5B>5C>6D>j.A>Land 5B>236B>j.236A>j.236B>6D~5D>[H]j.B>dj.B>j.C

Also if you can describe it Nokita, I'd really like to know just how the Wolf j.C hits the opponent, mainly in the air. Is it like Human j.C where is knocks them to the ground or can you do any kind of follow ups from it? I'm assuming the former but I'm still curious.

There are some issues with following up w5B on airborne opponents as far as I read.

Based on what they say it impossible to follow it up right now like he used to do.

I have no idea how valk's new wolf normals work or look.

Hima is the only one that mentioned them and he kept it pretty short tbh.

EDIT:Japan is getting bodied by that rasen wolf command change.

Lots of execution errors.Accidentally transforming back to human,getting a rasen dash instead of transforming back,stuff like that.

The combo part wj.A>5D>2C is not working.

Hima to the rescue.

j.B>j.B>j.C>air DD works.

Anything else that involves j.C>air DD does not work at the moment.

[BladeOfJustice7]

I know he's being drastically changed in CP (like everyone else except Ragna/Jin) but I still wanna learn this character as a sub. He's been hella fun and he's not as big of a hurdle as I thought he would be, plus the tutorial helped a lot.

But the only thing I can't seem to connect is w.jb>wja>h.2c. I have no problem with the w.jb>w.ja, but I can't connect w.ja>h.2c it always whiffs or I end up doing rasenwolf, I'm not sure what I'm missing in order to get it to connect.

[OrionXElite]

I know he's being drastically changed in CP (like everyone else except Ragna/Jin) but I still wanna learn this character as a sub. He's been hella fun and he's not as big of a hurdle as I thought he would be, plus the tutorial helped a lot.

But the only thing I can't seem to connect is w.jb>wja>h.2c. I have no problem with the w.jb>w.ja, but I can't connect w.ja>h.2c it always whiffs or I end up doing rasenwolf, I'm not sure what I'm missing in order to get it to connect.

Couple of common issues I've seen occur the most with this combo:

1) The height of the j.A, a lot of the time the j.A tends to be too high off the ground meaning more time between the hit and your ability to switch to Human and continue. Mess around with how low to the ground you can really hit the j.A and work from there.

2) I've seen people overestimate the amount of recovery transforming from Wolf to Human. Its surprisingly fast how soon you can act after the Transformation so there is a big possibility its dropping because you're waiting too long before hitting 2C. So try adjusting the timing between Transforming and hitting 2C and see if that fixes the problem.

Other small issues are if you're getting 2C Dash after j.A, it just means you're hitting D too soon and Valk stays in Wolf form. So that just means delay the D a bit later and it should fix itself. Also be sure to keep the opponent about level with Valk during the j.B>j.A part so the rest combo stays consistent. If you have any other troubles, feel free to ask

[samthegreat]

Hey there Valky, happy birthday dawg.

[NickExtreme1]

Hey there Valky, happy birthday dawg.

:toot:

[BladeOfJustice7]

Couple of common issues I've seen occur the most with this combo:

1) The height of the j.A, a lot of the time the j.A tends to be too high off the ground meaning more time between the hit and your ability to switch to Human and continue. Mess around with how low to the ground you can really hit the j.A and work from there.

2) I've seen people overestimate the amount of recovery transforming from Wolf to Human. Its surprisingly fast how soon you can act after the Transformation so there is a big possibility its dropping because you're waiting too long before hitting 2C. So try adjusting the timing between Transforming and hitting 2C and see if that fixes the problem.

Other small issues are if you're getting 2C Dash after j.A, it just means you're hitting D too soon and Valk stays in Wolf form. So that just means delay the D a bit later and it should fix itself. Also be sure to keep the opponent about level with Valk during the j.B>j.A part so the rest combo stays consistent. If you have any other troubles, feel free to ask

Wow, thanks for the response, he seems to be coming along pretty well. I wanna first learn combos/hit confirms before I branch off into movement/pressure. I'm starting to understand his combos and how they work now.

EDIT: Nick, philly, isn't too far from me, do you press buttons in this game online?

[NickExtreme1]

Wow, thanks for the response, he seems to be coming along pretty well. I wanna first learn combos/hit confirms before I branch off into movement/pressure. I'm starting to understand his combos and how they work now.

EDIT: Nick, philly, isn't too far from me, do you press buttons in this game online?

I don't have my XBL Account Gold. I'm not sure when that is going to change, but I hope it is soon depending on whenever college wants to give me a break :/

[BladeOfJustice7]

Nick you broke my heart

Anyways, this guys execution is pretty high lol.

[BladeOfJustice7]

I woudl like to update you guys that I can finally perform A valk combo, the timing of wja>h2c is VERY tight and height specific. I find myself double tapping 2c after cancelling wja into human form because it typically just whiffs even though I got the right height for wjb after natchrosen.

Though I'm gonna keep my combo short after 7c>d and shorten the combo to jb>jb>jc as opposed to 7c/d>jc>h2a>h5b>h2c>hjb>hjb>hjc. I'm simply not on that level yet, and I wanna move onto his movement since that's what intrigues me the most about him, followed by his high damage output.

[PerishEvil]

If you look closely, Valkenhayn's wolf form has floppy ears; a trait that is geneticly linked to domestication in canines(and foxes). I wonder if his designers realized this.

[TerrorMe]

What would you guys say a new valkenhayn should strive for in gameplay cuz i know all my combos resets and oki to a point of were i just need to grind out matches , but what i feel im lacking is in my wolf movement like i know what it is but dont know when i should be using it i guess wat im asking is what make a good valkenhayn at the core of the character so i can hieghten my playlevel?

[BladeOfJustice7]

You need to avoid having patterns and be as random and spontaneous as possible, in my opinion, I'm still learning him. But players like Zekuso, and Masashi really show how to be offensive and completely unpredictable in their offense.

Not knowing how your opponent is going to try and get in close on you and pressure you is a scary thing. A way of developing this fear is through things like dash cancels and fake outs, it keeps them guessing since they are left uncertain as to when you will actually commit to homing in on them. valk's dash cancel fake outs have 7 frames of invincibility making them even more scary, by using those and managing your wolf meter it allows you to evade your opponents attacks and punish them for it, either by forcing them to block your pressure or they're still in recovery from the last attack they sent out hoping it would hit you.

Fake outs are a key to his neutral game. Along with using the wolf cancel properties off some of his normals and specials, making it even harder for your opponent to block your pressure. This is currently something I haven't gotten used to with Valk, since Hakumen isn't about being random in the way he plays, other than some street fighter mechanics (empty jumps and such)

[Sahgren]

You should also get used to controlling space and moving on the ground in both human and wolf form. Running on the ground in wolf form is fairly fast and doesn't cost nearly as much meter as command dashing, and it's all too easy to get used to just airdashing and jumping everywhere, allowing the opponent to just prepare to anti-air to shut you down. Walking/hopping/running and abusing the long reaching human form ground normals forces the opponent to not get complacent while you're grounded.

[GenoWhirl]

http://es-es.twitch.tv/central804/b/341817071match at 2:05:00. Nothing too great though, justh im getting stomped Another at 2:11:00. Seems a W.A hit confirm will yield us 2.1k+ midscreen at least

5C > Schwarz works on standing hit, non CH. Weiss doesn't wall stick?

[TerrorMe]

hey can someone give me examples of some of valks best oki set ups i have most of the combo enders down but atm all i seem to have for oki is j.c rc j.c or 3c/6b any help would be great thanks

[Sahgren]

A fairly easy one to use is ([w]5B or [h]2C > super jump j.D) > [w]j.A > dj.D > [h]j.C > falling j.C. This does the same thing as j.C > RC > j.C without having to spend meter.

For something more complicated, you can also use Joker's ender (super jump w[j.A > j.B > j.A > 5B > j.A > j.A > j.A > j.B> 3C > j.B] > dj.D > falling [h]j.C). It's a safe jump setup that allows you to both prevent rolls and be safe from wake up reversals.

Edit: Realizing that I completely misread the question.

I'd say that [h]2B is a bit better on their wakeup than 3C due to 2B allowing you to gatling into 5B, 5C, 2C, and 3C and allows for more time for you to hitconfirm than 3C. 3C doesn't leave you anywhere to go outside of 236X, leaving you without many options if they block it and 3C > 236A at most if it lands.

Wolf form in general is also fairly useful on the opponent's wakeup if you have the wolf meter to follow up on it. You can do [w]5C~C or [w]1/2/3C~C > j.A for an instant overhead, [w]5A for a low, and 236D for a c-grab. As an added bonus, both j.A and 5A can catch rolls and quick get ups into full combos.

[GenoWhirl]

fml nobody plays valk

[STenSatsu]

Check out the OgreLive archive. It has Hima + another 8dan Valk. Then there is like an hour of Hima v everbody footage after the tourney.

[samthegreat]

Jesus Hima is godlike.

[GenoWhirl]

3C > 236A > 2A > 2C > 6C works, woo. Actually 236A seems to be doing just fine

[Dreize]

Finally starting to become a more competent Valky player, sadly I'm no where near where I want to be.

I really don't know how Hima makes it look so easy, especially in neutral.