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FlyingVe

[CS1-CSE] Mu-12 Critique and Self-Improvement Thread

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Pochp covered just about all of it. Not much else to cover.

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http://youtu.be/TaJs_5ysWzo

Mah terribad Mu versus Lunar again. I'm really wish I had videos of matches with other people. :v: (I'm working on it. ;w; )

Anyways I'm well aware that I rush Tsubaki too often. I'm far too comfortable against her at this point, I need to stop that.

Anyways theres probably more that I know of that I already am working on (Hit confirming, missing out on hits that should have done big damage, bad bursting etc etc...) but I don't care, just make a note of anything/everything for mah bag o' tricks.

Edit: http://youtu.be/Oo94cmhk8J4

Adding in another one for anyone who wants to sit through the first derpy Platinum match. Keep in mind I haven't seriously sat down and practiced with platinum in months. So yeah ignore that. :D

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wow huge improvement from last time, congrats! nice stein placement, nice use of 236D, nice use of 3C RC combos. One thing you should do, that has helped me a lot in the tsubaki matchup, is to cancel blocked 5C into 236A, instead of SoD. If you do go into a blocked SoD and have the meter to burn, RC it and go back in for mixup. I'd also say use a bit more 236A at neutral, but maybe that's just the way I play the matchup.

The way I see it, if Tsubaki is fullscreen and starts charging, I'm going to build a laser fortress. Once you start doing that, the times that you actually do decide to go in will be much more efficient, because they'll be a bit less expected. I also often try to punish tsubaki charging with a max range 6C (use this rarely). On block, you can cancel into either a stein or 236A, so it's your advantage, on hit, you get a sweet little combo and oki (or awesome if you RC it), on CH you win the round. Just don't get predictable with it.

(but yeah I was kinda looking at it while my code was compiling at work, so I probably missed a lot of stuff, I didn't watch the second vid either)

reposting these from the video thread, I kinda brain-farted, but yeah if anyone has some advice I'll take it.

pochp vs brice (Tager) (ranbats)

pochp vs Nini Heart (Noel) (ranbats)

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I guess I'll give you my two cents on this one. Not the Tager one though, because I suck at the Tager match-up. :I

There were a couple times where you rushed in but you had no coverage. No steins, no 236A, etc. Make sure you have something set up before you go in against Noel, because she has no reason to respect you otherwise. Sure, Mu's range is better, but Noel gets to be invincible! More use of 236D would benefit you in this matchup, I think. Keeps her locked down, and then you can begin your mixup with coverage.

Okay, I'll go back to lurking now.

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From what I saw from pochp videos, the biggest advice I can give you is to STOP RUSHING IN. You can play mu as a zoner and hit them from far away. Tager and Noel are very limited in terms of full screen and even midscreen options. When you rush in, you're up against their full arsenal of moves and mix up tools if you lose pressure. If you stay full screen, set up steins and zone with habaya, you limit their options of doing damage and even getting in on you. But yea, biggest problem I saw from your play was it also seemed like you lacked a game plan. Go in with one and adjust it for the next game if you lost. So yea....pretty much consider your options vs your opponent's options.

Some other stuff you can work on through playing more: hitconfirms, better decision making, footsies, zoning.

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Hmm. I will say I was on autopilot and nerves pretty badly those games (to explain the hitconfirms and decision making :P) but my game plan is usually to send out either 236A, 214D or 236D and once they're blocking, go in for a mixup and get out. Against noel and tager. Should I just not go in for a mixup period, after 236A/214D and use the blocked projectile to put myself farther from them to keep placing steins and zoning to make their way in harder, and only go in for mixup only after cover by a 236D or ]D[? (and yes 236A against tager from that range was a bad idea, I used to play that guy all the time, so I thought I'd be able to catch him off guard, because I've been recently using that move a lot more than I used to in other matchups, and bait sledge)

Thanks for the advice btw, I didn't think I'd actually get something out of these games where I played pretty badly, but rewatching them with what you guys said in mind got me to notice a few things and made me rethink others. (ex: yes why indeed did I not use 236D against noel? Even though I was autopiloting that specific match, I know I don't use it enough in that matchup in general, it really does counter a lot of her options)

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Here some vids from a small local tourney I went to recently:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVZMqsK1vz4#t=45s vs Carl

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LolCW1-_1ck#t=2m29s vs Tager (sound out of sync for the beginning)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=61yRW3fhVrs#t=2m15s vs Arakune/Hazama

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yH3p5iSYTyM#t=2m50s vs Arakune (ignore my shitty Rachel)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wAdp9IDZpZQ vs Arakune

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sJIUW-HSf3M vs Arakune

I ended up placing first although all my matches were Mu's most favorable matchups. Finals was against a friend who plays a very solid Arakune. Any advice other than "stop dropping combos you scrub"? I think I missed almost every dash link that day, and poor hitconfirms off air unblockables, so my combos were pretty sad.

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Don't touch my color bitch. :3

Anyways I watched the Bang one, don't really have time to go through everything. I'll just drop a few pointers. Stop rushing in so much on Bang. He's got pretty bad range so stay out of it. You also have a habit of using omohikane as a reversal when her normal DP is just as good and you don't lose meter. I mean It is a good reversal super but you definitely used it very predictably, and too frequently.

But yeah, I can definitely see the Makoto habits in your play with frequent rushing without coverage, so I'm gonna atribute it to the fact that you're still getting used to her.

You had a bunch of opportunities to throw out steins that you didn't take and you really need them against Bang or else he'll quite literally just run circles around you. Use command laser, from what I saw you used it infrequently or not at all. This is especially useful against highly mobile characters like Bang, cause it limits his ability to run all around the damn place. Also you're bursting very early on and quite predictably. You're also not getting out of the corner when you have the chance. When you burst or DP in the corner first dash out and THEN set up steins.

Either way, my biggest advice is just to remember you're a zoner now. Mu can rushdown given the right circumstances, but she's weak up close without protection from her steins. So make sure you remember that her drive is there for a reason. It's a unique drive and takes getting used to so keep at it. :3

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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BEH8wDDD5WY < vs Bang

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D5FBZiAo1X4 < Vs Jin (I switched to Makoto at one point, but yeah.)

I kind of noticed you have the same problem with me at times with the C6 thing (Empty at times). =[ Annoying habbit for me, other than that, awesomeness. :D

For advice, I guess the people here who know more about this stuff can help you~

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Dat' feel when empty 6C ;_; Happens to us all now and then. Never gets any easier...

Liked the Bang game. I can't find much to criticize, against Bang that was cool shit.

ED: As tempting as it is to humiliate them, It's usually best to always combo into Omoi.

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In general, too many reversals and jumping out. Don't be afraid to block. Bang has a command grab, but he can only do it if you haven't been in blockstun for at least 7 frames, so he has to set it up, and if you read it, the reward might be better for you than a successful hit from him, it's a big risk for him to go for it. He didn't even have to. Also, I may be wrong, but I think after moves like DP or SoD hits, you're a bit slow on doing something.

0:12 really common Mu mistake. Look at what you did, you cornered yourself, you have one stein on the screen, there was nothing stopping the bang from running to your face to punch you, and you tried to do something slow, I think. Use a j.236A right before you land if you realize you're going to land without options, but in general, don't be so quick to corner yourself, the bang only used one nail, it whiffed, and you were in a bad situation.

0:16 don't rush in like that. You had a stein there, you could have thrown a 236D before rushing and would have been way more effective. 6A isn't the best move for an approach either, a well spaced sliding 2B is way more effective, although against a character like bang it's not necessarily a good idea either way, especially if it's extremely telegraphed (easy to predict/react to).

0:20 good gatling into a low there, but if you had gone directly into 3C though it would have been a huge combo because you were so close to te wall, something like 3C CH 2B 2C 6C 214Dwhiff 6A 6B SoD dash 5C 2C j.C j.2C for 4k maybe? if you get a knockdown into 3C, you have more options than nothing, I would probably recommend SoD because it would have placed him near the corner, but 236A is what you want if you're going for oki.

0:24 you were pretty close to the corner, dash 6A 6B 6A j.2C j.D 2B 5C 2C j.2C 3C SoD 6A 6C would have been a better combo in that situation, habacan is hard to do when you're so close and it does less damage.

0:40 you see him jump in on you, use an anti air, I'd say 2C in that situation, or backdash if you think he'll throw a c-nail instead, don't jump, that's asking to get airthrown.

0:56 same as first, and this happens a lot as well in the rest. Think about it, this is how you get opened up most of the time.

1:21 never finish a blockstring with 3C, either jump cancel it, cancel into 236A, or even SoD if you hit from far.

2:30 you finished an air combo with j.2C and landed, you can cancel it into steins before landing, it's a good thing to do (except against hakumen).

3:18 5D 236D is pretty average, might as well do 6D 236D if you immediately know you're gonna do 236D afterwards because you get more out of your laser.

3:20 6C, cancel that shit into either 236A, xD or SoD. 236D if you have steins out.

3:23 I don't think any of your moves would have worked (except DP, not a good idea) in this situation, backdash instead. Use more backdash in general.

3:26 wakeup 5C, I hope that was a missed DP input. 5C's hurtbox is terrible, it gets stuffed by any move the opponent would have done before. Wakeup>backdash>5C is waaay better. Also, cancel that shit on block, either 6C, 236A, 236D, xD>jc...

3:30 you got him with a DP, great! But you need a better plan for that situation. Dashing in without cover is not a good choice, go for like 6D 236A 236D and then rush in, or something like that. (this "setup" is far from flawless, he can airdash over 236A and CH you out of 236D, so you need to have a few at your disposal, so he doesn't have a free ticket back in your face)

3:42 more or less around here, you could have gone for a j.236D and gone in for a mixup, just pointing out situations. You're doing your j.236A's a bit high, the opponent can dash under or over from that height if he's on the ground. (air to air it's cool, and this is not exclusive to bang's 3C, but especially true in this scenario)

4:58 blocked j.C from that height is really punishable, cancel into j.236A.

5:10 you hit him with a super, got a knockdown and did nothing. Use either 236A, 236D, 214D or something, you have time. 236A is generally safe to reversals if you do it fast enough, so you can use it to bait them.

8:30 try to be aware of your steins, don't stick them together too much, to get the most out of your 236D. Not really something to worry about, but think about it and gradually get better at it, it really makes a difference when you get used to it.

8:50 cancelling 6C into SoD, don't delay it too much, bang can drive on reaction, or stay out and punish the recovery. Release immediately unless you've conditionned your opponent, but generally cancel 6C into something else, in this matchup.

9:06 j.2C has 20f landing recovery, don't use it if you're too high and the opponent isn't at the same height as you. Not worth the risk-reward.

9:10 5C again, really think about cancelling this move, especally into 236A.

9:14 SoD? hope it was a missed DP or 2C somehow. Not awesome in that situation even if it worked.

9:18 you had him cornered and you let him out, try to focus about keeping your opponent there, the pressure is on him, not you. Place steins, whiff fast recovery moves, etc.

9:39 you're cornered and the opponent is high over you? Dash under him, turn the situation around in an instant!

vs jin

0:10 he's crouching, confirm into 6C instead, better oki/damage.

0:29 think about your mobility, you could have moved out of the corner many times.

0:36 air-dash back xN, not the best idea, you're cornering yourself with negative warning, at least do something.

0:49 again, hit with a super, no oki, at least you "cornered" him, but didn't take advantage of it.

1:20 the combo is ...j.2C 2B 2C 6C habacan...

1:38 punish with either 3C or 2C CH if you don't have meter, or 5C CH > 6C RC etc... (6C would be best, but it's so slow and has min range, so you can't rely on it for this when you have to take a quick decision)

Alright I'm gonna stop here but I think you get the idea. Priority, think about not cornering yourself so easily and don't be afraid to block. These are things I got told a lot too, so really try to work on them, I can tell you from experience it makes you win more.

Now I'm going to post a few more videos, this is 1-match (as in not 2/3 matches) tournament play, I controlled my nerves a bit more, but I still make sooo many mistakes due to them. If someone has advice for me, even if it's something small I'll take it, I thought about the stuff you guys told me last time, it helped. I also make some mistakes I pointed out above as well lol, nerves...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pYJAuVSr6uI vs jin 8/11

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ENakdjI0r4o vs haz 8/11

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjEfjUSxMnI vs tager 8/18

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pkf3kXK0xH4 vs haz 8/18

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Is there a reason you don't use 6B in blockstrings against hazama, or tick throws? running up 2b 5b 5c (3c) 236A gets a bit predictable, and isn't completely safe as proven by the jayoku.

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I'm conditioning my opponent to block low and push him towards the corner, usually I go 2b 5b 6B after 1 or 2 reps if he keeps blocking. I could have baited the jayoku but I didn't, got a bit greedy there. I should do more tick throws though. Some of my opponents just tech them all the time even when I mix it up with TRM, so I lost the habit of throwing, but I guess just not using it is pretty bad :psyduck:

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I'm conditioning my opponent to block low and push him towards the corner, usually I go 2b 5b 6B after 1 or 2 reps if he keeps blocking. I could have baited the jayoku but I didn't, got a bit greedy there. I should do more tick throws though. Some of my opponents just tech them all the time even when I mix it up with TRM, so I lost the habit of throwing, but I guess just not using it is pretty bad :psyduck:

If you hide your throws really well, no one will tech them, because people can only tech a throw when they see it coming. Some people just subconsciously process the possibility that you'll throw them, this is what some people claim to be "teching on reaction".

I would recommend throwing with Mu regardless, because in the case that they tech it, you're in advantage positioning wise, and it doesn't cost a resource.

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Mu can corner carry on any hit due to SOD, so generally in a blockstring I'm more concerned about getting a hit then pushing towards the corner. but in terms of conditioning, he looked very happy downbacking, and you probably could've capitalized on it sooner.

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@pochp Eventhough i am not that good of a mu player , here is what i thought with your match against that tager

You were using 6c too much after a 5c in a blockstring and you got punished by a sledge in the 2nd round for it. After finding out the hard way my self , i started using 3c or 2c after my 5c because those moves are safer because you can jump away if everything is blocked. On hit you can still use a furu no tsurugi to knock him in the corner or atleast away.

Using furu no tsurugi all the time as a blockstring finisher is not safe at close range or magnetized , because the tagers can hit you with a 360 or even 720. You were almost hit by a 360 in that match when using it in the first round

Habaya against tager is not something that i like to use because it doesn't lead into anything and it has a long recovery and it can be sledged through if they see it through. I

think habaya is mostly used to prevent people approaching you, but tager is already quite immobile and mu has better tools to keep tager away.

Maybe it's my preferences, but i like to throw out steins and let them explode on tager at long and mid range. If he tries to sledge through the explosions (his sledge followup also has projectile invincibility) you might get a counter 5c combo, eventhough you can get hit by his sledge sometimes if you mistime your 5c.

edit: after watching the rest of the videos i agree with bloodyrootbeers, your lack of 6b overheads in blockstrings and tickthrows is making other people simply blocking low to stop everything

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thanks for the advice, guys. I guess I really should use more overheads/trhows against some opponents, and I need to rethink my options against tager a bit. If someone has comments advice concerning the Hazama and Jin matchup, I'd really appreciate it, I'm not sure I'm playing these matchups correctly.

The reason I use habaya against tager is because it slows down the match, it gives me time to calm down and evaluate the situation, deal with nerves a bit. From a safe range, if he tries to B-sledge it, I can punish, A-Sledge doesn't make him move forward a lot, so if he goes for that, I can take the time to place steins, put more distance between us, fish for a 5C CH or something. It doesn't accomplish anything in itself really, because it gives me a lot of recovery, and it barely does any block stun, so I don't get any advantage from it in game, this is for outside the game reasons. If you're able to think clearly at all times and don't want to give your opponent time to think, don't use this too much in the matchup, there are more rewarding options.

Oh and in case you were wondering, j.2C-236A (720'd) was supposed to be j.2Cxxj.236A (bait 720) but I timed it wrong.

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Maybe some advice against your match against jin, because i used to main jin at the beginning of CS1 and 2:

You were too much pressured by jin's 6b. His 6b is +3 on block and because it's airborn after a few frames, he generally can't be thrown out of it unless you yomi it and airthrow him out of it (lol). You don't want it to counter hit you after a whiffed throw because it's one of Jin's most damaging combo starter. If he get's too predicable you can use 5a (or anything quick that is not a low attack , because his 6b is slow with 25f startup), your dp , a good timed backdash or an arial barrier guard to prevent his 6b or tick throw guessing game.

Like what you have done in the first round, jin can be zoned by mu and you want jin in your mid or long range. But at mid range be carefull of his 2d and at long range try to avoid his ice swords or your steins won't fire. Also when he has meter, try to zone more carefully, because his icewave super and drive version of his icecar are quite fast and might hit you. in the 3rd round when you tried to rush down jin, you didn't have your lasers covering you (totsuka), which was very dangerious, because jin is better at close range than you.

Against Hazama,

In the 8/11 match you were hit by his chains too much. Don't be afraid blocking or avoiding his chains instead of throwing out steins/totsuka. At long range , he can't really mix you up with anything after it so you can simply avoid or block the rest of his stuff after he swings to you. When he swings too predictable, you can hit him out of it with 6a or 2c, but when he baits your anti air you will hit by another chain and a combo after it.

In 8/18 match you were exploding your steins with habakiri against hazama, which is not that usefull because of his good mobility and totsuka was a better choice if you were at long range . When he has 50 meter, you should not follow up anything in your blockstring after 2c or 3c and go for a jump cancel instead, because his jayoku but you found that in the last round.

In general you can't mash 5a or 2a against hazama, because his are faster than yours. And don't be afraid to use your counter assault more often to get of his pressure.

And the no throwing and no mid block string 6b was also hurting your mix ups in both matches

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More vids from another local tourney. Only like 8 people this time but still some exciting matches. I made it to finals again, against Noel. Tell me what I can improve on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vEEm9Tpv4s8#t=47s vs Lambda

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xv-BDITr30o#t=1m30s vs Tager

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y238P4PROb8#t=41s vs Tsubaki

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_r-Cqapdx6k#t=1m20s vs Noel

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s9FhIPwGzRY vs Noel

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vKJ-m1pOdq4 vs Noel

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More vids from another local tourney. Only like 8 people this time but still some exciting matches. I made it to finals again, against Noel. Tell me what I can improve on.

Hmm, I don't see much matchup specifics to cover, cept that you can DP her out of optic barrel A every time. Keep an eye on that one. Also, no real reason to ever go in on tager, ever, put yourself into negative penalty, it's not like he can hit you. Believe me I learned that the hard way.

I feel that you use command laser very well, that's definitely your strongest point.

However your movement is sluggish, enough so that you might want to practice movement options like superjump IAD and perfecting the timing on when steins become dash/jump cancelable. So much of your playstyle is dependent on manipulating your opponent, it would benefit most from learning how to outposition them, which you're going to need really fast and accurate movement for. While you most certainly outmaneuvered your opponents in the local tournies, I honestly think you played a lot smarter overall at Evo.

For something immediate that you can apply, definitely practice the bigger midscreen combos, her C normals are too savagely good for you to do anything but optimal damage off of them. I'm not talking about like, the CMV stuff either, but rather that you have a habit of using A and B normals for hitconfirm off big CH's, or rapid canceling into really suboptimal pickups. I realize it's probably a tick you've picked up at some point, but it's really seamed it's way into your play, and if you can uproot it, you could be picking up these random hits into really scary damage.

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Thanks. :) Yeah, I really gotta play the Tager matchup more lame. My friend is definitely not afraid to 360 me either. I dunno, something about Tager's hitbox just makes me want to get up in his ass and break all those guard primers.

I'm still practicing the sjIAD. It feels like learning to regular IAD all over again haha. I guess I'll get it over time. And yeah, I definitely need to practice the JC/airdash timing on all the different steins; I'm still dropping "...5D JC j2C..." combos.

My hitconfirming is definitely bad. At least, I've always thought it's my weakest point (I do autopilot strings a lot). I definitely need to grind the 2C 5C (w) 5C...pickups off 2C CH, especially since they may be removing the JC off it in the next game. As for RC combos, I kind of just make them up sometimes cause I don't know the best hitconfirms off stuff with 2A/2B ...(crouching) 5C 6C but I want to do more damage/get more orbs than just doing SoD when they're low on life or I need the life lead. Same thing with (2A 2B)...3C RC combos. Maybe I should just save the meter unless it's a (5C) 6C RC starter?

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Anything worse than 2b I wouldn't recommend, but you can get a clean 4k and strong oki/carry off 2b 5c 6c crouching or 2b 5c 3c standing RC combos, they're definitely worth it the majority of the time.

Thing is Mu has a plethora of meter, and nothing to spend it on besides omohikane most of the time, so I have a habit of burning RCs all day in order to extend my momentum in a match, because it allows me to pick up a small 2b frametrap hit into something considerable and gain the upper ground in positioning.

Don't worry too much about combos, they're not super critical to the character, so long as you can confirm something something 6c something something 6b something j.2c hahahahah oki you'll be good to go.

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