How to airdash after the Chemical Love

[Pestilence]

VCL has some really weird properties that allow you to airdash from it even when it's not TK or jump installed. do 5K or c.S > VCL and you'll see what I'm talking about

try it

[Diveman]

Ive seen some I-no players do 5k or 5H xx HCL frc AD, what's the trick there? are they TKing the HCL?

[Skorm11]

they tk it in case of HS, and most of the time it's JI in the case of 5K

[ATG Warlord]

Give separating your inputs a go since you have to relearn it on a stick you might as well try.

6+frc 6

will be slower than

6 frc 6

I'm pretty sure your problem (since your already an adept ino player like you say) lies in the last 6 just not being fast enough.

But to answer your question like you want it.

Tap forward with whatever motion you use and let it slide back to neutral then tap it once more (should be faster than dragging it back to neutral to do it again). IMO There is no correct way... just do whatever your comfortable with and do it FAST.

5k > HCL FRC AD on a keyboard would just absolutely blow my mind away. Oh and just a question... Are you playing reload on a keyboard on a slower framerate?

Thanks! That's exactly where my problem was. I thought about the first 6 and tried delaying it and whatnot, but never suspected my last 6 speed until I read your post and gave it a shot. Now my 6FRC6 is very consistent thanks to you.

Edit:

Does HD > AD retain jump install? I find it weird as I sometimes do HD > 96 > j.S > j.H > 5S> 5H > HCL 6FRC6 ... but the airdash seems to come out randomly as opposed to manually JI'ing between 5S & 5H which is much more consistent.

Edited February 3, 2013 by ATG Warlord

[TheRealBobMan]

Well, you're getting your jump options off of HD, but wasting them with the AD, so it's like there's no install left, if that makes sense. If you were to HD > j.H (whiff) > 2P > 2S (bait a tick-throw jump out) > HCL, you'd have the JI and could 6FRC6, assuming you didn't return to neutral when going from the whiffed j.H to 2P. You're probably still getting the 6FRC6 to work because your 632146K input out of the 5H isn't perfectly clean and you're accidentally JI'ing at that spot.

What's funny about that is that with this setup is that you should be able to do the TK version off of the 5H if I'm not mistaken. Might need a 6P in there though to get them airborne. The TK version is more lenient, so I guess use that where applicable?

And that's one of the things I'm looking forward to about +R I-No. If we get 2 airdashes, even if we use one for pressure, the other should still be saved right? So it's possible to do something like note > 66956 j.K > j.S > j.H (whiff) > 2P > 2S > HCL 6FRC6 > combo off of that mixup option.

Edited February 4, 2013 by TheRealBobMan
Typo and adding stuff - posted from work

[ATG Warlord]

i see so AD wastes my jump options. so the times i was 6frc6'ing off airdash might be me accidentally JI'ing the last 5H

[TheRealBobMan]

Eh, I should clarify by saying you're using your jump options. It's not really a waste. When you jump you either get a double jump or an airdash. If you use one of them you wont have the option to use it later. If you cancel a move into a jump, but then cancel into a move before the jump happens (jump install), your jump options are still there if you go airborne via a move like HCL, which normally wouldn't give you those options. If you've used the jump options before you land into something that goes into HCL, you'll have to get them again via another JI.

And apparently JI's hold for a very long time as long as you don't go neutral. I think you can do empty jump > landing 2S > recover > 6H > recover > HCL > 6FRC6 and it'll work even if you're not actually hitting anything, assuming you went into the next move as fast as possible, and assuming you didn't just TK the HCL at the end.

[MoogleKing]

That answers a question I've been holding up. I saw Koichi do HD > 2S > HCL > 6FRC6 one time.

He probably cancelled the HD with HS and I didn't notice the first time I saw.

[Rhannmah]

He probably cancelled the HD with HS and I didn't notice the first time I saw.

Not necessarily. The simple fact of landing from a single jump gives you jump install properties for a couple frames, which allows you to start a gatling with jump install status. I-No's dash just gives you the same properties as a normal jump.

For example, empty single jump 2k > 6p > 2d > HCL 6frc6 will work. When you dash and just land, it's as if you did an empty jump.

[TheRealBobMan]

Any tips on getting better at inputting things like anti-air poke (5P or 6P) > c.S > VCL > 6FRC6 > VCL (backwards input)?

I can get the VCL > 6FRC6 > c.S > VCL on Chipp, but I need to get better at this without c.S in there. That ****s things up against other characters. Then again, that might be because I'm doing 6P > c.S to practice, though I imagine they'll be higher if I actually anti-air.

*edit*

Also, does I-No have any frametraps? It's generally not what she wants to do, though some people let me get away with stuff into STBT(S) for CH, so I figure it might be effective to learn a few legitimate frametraps and not stupid ones that people shouldn't be falling for. Something that I can condition, you know?

So I've been working on my 2S > HCL > 6FRC6, and that got me thinking about what I do when I get in.

>Throw

2P > |

>2S > HCL

Not a frametrap unless they IB the 2P, but if they try to jump out to beat a throw, 2S works. If they try to DP the throw, they're not holding downback and 2S works.

What about something silly off of 2H? That's +6, so I figure it'd be great for this. Problem is that it pushes you out too far to go for a throw. 2P > 2H leaves a 1-frame gap, so I can run an additional "what is this guy trying to do now?" sort of thing, that generally wouldn't be as good as the 2S/Throw mixup, but if I can get something awesome out of it, why not? There's a refractory period in the brain of some substantial amount of time (I think it was 380 milliseconds, but I'll have to double check that) when people get distracted, and if I condition throw/2S off my 2P well enough, going into 2H should be safe and could lead to something useful. I mean, if I do 2H > Fortissimo, that takes 7 frames to go active, and 2H is +6 without being jump cancelable. In total it takes us 10-11 frames to do TK fortissimo, and they're going to watch the full recovery animation, so they'll expect a chance to get out or some sort of shenanigans. Fortissimo sounds like a decent idea because of the screen/input freeze. If someone without VV were to try to DP there, I'm pretty sure I-No would recover in time to block and punish. Same against most 6Ps I think, and it would definitely be safe against arrogant "I'm going to gold burst out of your frametrap" tactics too.

Anyone have any tricks they use or any ideas here?

Edited February 9, 2013 by TheRealBobMan
Added another question

[Pestilence]

Any tips on getting better at inputting things like anti-air poke (5P or 6P) > c.S > VCL > 6FRC6 > VCL (backwards input)?

I can get the VCL > 6FRC6 > c.S > VCL on Chipp, but I need to get better at this without c.S in there. That ****s things up against other characters. Then again, that might be because I'm doing 6P > c.S to practice, though I imagine they'll be higher if I actually anti-air.

Try it on Jam. That's who we saw U-Zen introduce the sickness to us.

5p cs is my standard go to anti-air. though to be honest i typically follow it with super jump js jh etc.

[TheRealBobMan]

Thanks for the tip. Man, it feels good making time to practice. So what if I only shower every other day now?

[MoogleKing]

Not necessarily. The simple fact of landing from a single jump gives you jump install properties for a couple frames, which allows you to start a gatling with jump install status. I-No's dash just gives you the same properties as a normal jump.

For example, empty single jump 2k > 6p > 2d > HCL 6frc6 will work. When you dash and just land, it's as if you did an empty jump.

Didn't know about that. Thanks a lot.

[Diveman]

OMG this is driving me nuts lol, I can 6FRC6 from jump installed, but I can't do it off 2k 6p 5h TK HCL 6frc6, for some reason I just can't and I'm doing the right motion and (I think) at the right speed. Maybe I should record it and show it to you guys so you can tell me what am I doing wrong.

EDIT: ok here it is, notice how at the end I actually get it just fine. Maybe there's something I'm unconsciously not doing

Edited February 18, 2013 by Diveman

[TheRealBobMan]

I think there are 2 small issues here that are combining to give you a problem. It doesn't look like you're actually leaving the ground before the HCL, so you're doing the JI version which has the smaller window. That alone makes it hard. You say you can do the JI version, so I think the other issue is the timing difference between the lvl2 5K and the lvl5 5H. There is a different amount of hitstop between the two... about 2-3 frames or so. If you're really good at 5K > HCL, but not really used to 5H > HCL, your muscle memory might be messing up there. I wouldn't think it's an issue because you actually get the FRC on the first 2 attempts, so your timing seems to adjust fine (you're probably just doing the 6FRC6 too slow there), but you drop the FRC on the 3rd attempt.

[ATG Warlord]

@Diveman

you're doing the JI version which has stricter timing than the TK'ed one. Your inputs are correct, but I think you're not doing the dash fast enough. Focus on speeding up the second 6 in the 6FRC6 part. I had the same problem recently, but adding more speed to the second 6 solved it. The reason is that I-no falls to ground-state much quicker in JI version, so the timing of the second 6 is very, very tight. If that doesn't work, then you might be inputting the first 6 so early that you're exiting the airdash window which is 12 frames. 7-8 frames before FRC is optimal.

[Pestilence]

To do the TK version instead of the JI, simply input the kick later than your doing. Your cancelling into chemical love too early.

[SIne]

as previously mentioned , it's easier in the case of that combo(6P 5H...etc) to do the 360 method for the chemical love air dash that way you can do the hcl higher and have more time to input 6frc6 ....and don't worry about being driven nuts; i-no does that to a guy... :D

Edited March 6, 2013 by SIne

[Rayzor]

How do I know if I'm doing the JI properly? Is the little dust cloud a good indicator?

And if I need to jump install to do the dash then how do I do the dash in the air?

[Pestilence]

How do I know if I'm doing the JI properly? Is the little dust cloud a good indicator?

And if I need to jump install to do the dash then how do I do the dash in the air?

jump install puts you into a jump state while still being grounded.

if you jump install properly there is no visual indication other then being able to do the desired effects.

[SIne]

How do I know if I'm doing the JI properly? Is the little dust cloud a good indicator?

And if I need to jump install to do the dash then how do I do the dash in the air?

you can tell if you jump installed properly by two ways: first use input display in training mode and if you do for example 5p,8, 5s(close) and i-no only jumps after the 5s(close) has completed then you have jump installed correctly ...the second way is if you are able to super jump then jump again after the 5s has connected then you know you did it right other than that there is no way to really tell....but once you have familiarized yourself with the timing then... it becomes easy... and also keep in mind you can only jump install after jump cancel-able moves... if you want to hcl air dash right after a non jump cancel-able you have to jump install somewhere in the string before (ex 66 land 2k 2s hcl 6frc6...or 5s 8 2s hcl 6frc6 )

As for the second part of your question, the method for this is quite simple really 6frc6 ...this is key...the dash happens cause of the 6frc6 input and if you do it quickly and at the correct time it should be consistent...ofcourse you can still do frc66 but that method is not recommended.... jump install is like the game system is saying " lol, you are in a jumping state even though you didn't jump so you can still air dash , lol":eng101:

Edited June 5, 2013 by SIne

[Essay]

Trying every timing in the book until you start to really get accustomed to 5K>HCL>6FRC6: 3 months.

Discovering that, when successful, the inputs on your arcade stick play out to the tune of "Bibbidi-Bobbidi-Boo": Priceless.

I-No is such a witch.

[Pestilence]

for those of u struggling with timing, do it as 66FRC6. Do the first forward motion immediately after releasing k. pretend u have to airdash before u hit FRC. once u get it, u'll easily be able to reduce it to 6FRC6. if this doesn't help, then go into extra mode & enable the FRC window to be 20 frames. Same process, get it then refine it to pin point execution.

As an additional tip, stop looking at the screen. Look at your hands, and do it by feel. Often times the roadblock is that u have a habit of doing something similar (5H HCL I'm looking at u) and think it's the same or are used to visual queues (especially as freestyle as I-No is ). Looking at your hands will see how accurately u r imputing things and help u learn the actual timing in muscle memory. It took me roughly 100 hours in training mode before I could pull it off. So it's not easy or overnight.

Edited June 30, 2013 by Pestilence

[zombieG]

I got blown up by Marlinpie playing some +R at TFC. Decided I wouldn't be emasculated, again so I picked up I-no and started grinding it out because j.D is the coolest move in fighting game history.

I've been doing HCL 6FRC6 in bits and chunks for the past few months, but I've run into a brick wall trying to pull off 41236+s 5k hcl 6frc6 and can't really figure out why. I read over this thread again because I've lurked it for quite some time and have a couple of questions.

1. Does 360 K alter the 6frc6 timing compared to JI? I spent a good little bit trying this and still couldn't get an airdash after FRC. I'm using the negative edge method, so it would be 41236+s, 6[k]32147896]k[ (6frc6 hs vcl presuming it worked). I buffer the 360 in early because I'm garbage at 63214[k] input.

2. If I try to JI this sequence, what do I need to JI? 5k or HCL? I managed to pull it off a handful of times, but the frequency makes me think it's luck based and not me actually doing it correctly.

Sorry for raising this thread from the dead. Making me pull my hair out, spent a good bit of time working on bumblefuck clownshoe HCL 6frc6 air combos for a good few weeks burning the timing into my muscle memory. Also huge thanks to Buckles and Undoing Ruin, you guys are godsends.

[9TNine]

I got blown up by Marlinpie playing some +R at TFC. Decided I wouldn't be emasculated, again so I picked up I-no and started grinding it out because j.D is the coolest move in fighting game history.

I've been doing HCL 6FRC6 in bits and chunks for the past few months, but I've run into a brick wall trying to pull off 41236+s 5k hcl 6frc6 and can't really figure out why. I read over this thread again because I've lurked it for quite some time and have a couple of questions.

1. Does 360 K alter the 6frc6 timing compared to JI? I spent a good little bit trying this and still couldn't get an airdash after FRC. I'm using the negative edge method, so it would be 41236+s, 6[k]32147896]k[ (6frc6 hs vcl presuming it worked). I buffer the 360 in early because I'm garbage at 63214[k] input.

2. If I try to JI this sequence, what do I need to JI? 5k or HCL? I managed to pull it off a handful of times, but the frequency makes me think it's luck based and not me actually doing it correctly.

Sorry for raising this thread from the dead. Making me pull my hair out, spent a good bit of time working on bumblefuck clownshoe HCL 6frc6 air combos for a good few weeks burning the timing into my muscle memory. Also huge thanks to Buckles and Undoing Ruin, you guys are godsends.

1. 360K (if you mean TK instead of JI) would give you more time to input 6FRC6, as you are higher off the ground.

2. You'd need to JI the 5K. STBT S isn't jump cancelable, and neither is HCL (it's a projectile). Basically, you're jumping out of 5K but cancelling that into HCL.

-9

Edited December 3, 2013 by 9TNine