Millia Mixup Blocker [Flash App]

[Vashimus]

man today im slow, my best average was 19.3 something, but my worst was around 24 :/

That's nothing, my best was like 26. Too fast for me.

[Narroo]

The link is broken.

[TheRealBobMan]

For a simple stimulus > reaction situation, like tap button when you see 6K start, 200ms / 12 frames is possible, assuming 6K (or whatever move) telegraphs on frame 1 and you've learned the telegraph. This is assuming only 6K comes out. Now, when you have all these lows, you're assuming you hold downback unless 6K comes out, so it's still the same thing. The problem is that there are multiple overheads, and a low that leaves the ground like one of the overheads does. A complex reaction takes somewhere around 380ms / 23 frames, but that's only assuming 2 stimuli. You're watching for Badmoon and 6K, but also have to avoid the false start on Haircar. Every additional stimuli adds something like 60ms, so these numbers people get are well explained.

The important things to take away are that you need to:

1. Learn the telegraphs for these moves so you can react to them as soon as possible

2. Learn to simplify the reaction type

If I watch for 6K and only 6K, sure, I can block it in time and not have to worry about lows, but then I'm opened up to badmoon. If I watch for badmoon I'm opened up to haircar faults, and wont react to 6K in time.

If I watch Millia's legs and block high when they disappear from being near the ground, I wont fault on Haircar, but I'll react to badmoon! There's still the problem with her hair being similar in color to her legs, so I have to relearn the stimulus for blocking 6K (I guess I'd be fine against various color pallets until I do that though).

Anyway, I totally forgot about this thing. Now I have a way to practice at work!

[Xtra_Zero]

Stuff that makes sense

This is true, but I think the test is a little flawed, in that nobody just sits there for 4 seconds and then randomly does haircar, etc. There's more blocking information that you can glean based on where they are in their blockstring, so you can watch out for a JC on moves that are JCable and you can generally guess about when the mixup will happen. This app doesn't do blockstrings, so it's not quite the same.

[Dusk Thanatos]

Well, this kinda exists to shut up people who think they can block Millia on pure reaction... or to see if they're not just blowing steam

[Teyah]

This is true, but I think the test is a little flawed, in that nobody just sits there for 4 seconds and then randomly does haircar, etc. There's more blocking information that you can glean based on where they are in their blockstring, so you can watch out for a JC on moves that are JCable and you can generally guess about when the mixup will happen. This app doesn't do blockstrings, so it's not quite the same.

Overall this is supposed to just be based around the concept of reaction time. Of course if it were to be a real match mixup simulator there would be a disc above Sol and I'd have to have added other variants of mixup like IAD high/lows, throws, haircar FRC j.K which are either not practical to add in or offer no value for reaction time testing.

As for blockstrings, that's not really something to be overly concerned with since that type of mixup is much less safe and much more limited than her oki, which this app is supposed to approximate.

[sammy5m1th]

So both links seem to be broken, any chance the app can be re-uploaded or something?

[Teyah]

Sure, I've re-uploaded it here: https://www.dropbox.com/s/biqxo8ja7co29at/MilliaBlocker_v0.3.swf

Replacement website to be coming soon.

[sammy5m1th]

Nice, thanks Teyah.

[xenwall]

So, is the frame data for Millia the same for these moves? I'm not proficient enough to calculate the frames for TK Bad Moon with just frame data. I'm getting my friend into GG and adviced Millia for him (he mains Akuma in SSF4 and Millia looks to have high mobility, strong mixups, and great oki) and this tool makes me scared of my own advice.

[OneSanitarium]

IIRC, yes they should be. That was the intention of it.

[Justice7541]

Do we even know when the first frame of animation starts for 6k and bad moon? Most moves don't actually animate on the very first frame. It may take you 20+f after the move begins to react but that doesn't mean it's 20+ after you actually see it.

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[TheRealBobMan]

Yeah, Kliff's 5D is a prime example of that. It looks like crouching for the first X frames, which is why it's hard to deal with. At least he raises his own dizzy modifier (which also increases the odds his dodge will crap out on him) when he uses it.

I don't know where the telegraph starts on 6K, but doesn't seem like it telegraphs as strongly as some other overheads, despite being a front flip with her body completely outstretched. You can react to Millia leaving the ground as an indication that an overhead is coming, which generally works for dealing with Badmoon without getting hit by 2K/2S/2D, but may cause you to block Haircar wrong because they have the same starting telegraph. It also probably wont help with j.K if you're tall enough for it to hit you on the way up since she leaves the ground on frame 3 or 4, and that move is frame 4 I think. It's just like getting hit by fast low, but at least she only gets something off of it if she has a setup, and it wont work one everyone as far as I know.

Watching for her legs disappearing from being near the ground is effective, though alternate color palettes might make this easier/harder. You'll react to Badmoon and wont mess up with Haircar (her legs stay near the ground even though she goes airborne!) while protecting yourself from 2K/2S/2D, but focusing on the Badmoon/Haircar mixup with this trick leaves you more vulnerable to 6K (a color palette with more contrast between her hair and leg color might help). It's also hard to use with a disc covering her legs.

The thing is, if you predict exactly what move is coming, you really only need about 12 frames of telegraph time to react. 20+ is more for an either/or reaction. In any case, focusing that much to be able to block a specific move or set of specific moves opens you up to all kinds of brain lag when something other than what you expected pops up. Even a tick-throw with a lvl 1 move gives you 11 frames of hit-stop to realize that "this move that's a great set-up for tick throws just came out", besides whatever other time is spent on the remaining active frames + recovery frames, and then the additional 5 frames before they can grab you out of block-stun. It's just not possible to reaction block Millia 100% of the time if all of Millia's tools are being used well.

But since you bring it up, it might actually be nice to have mention of when the telegraph starts on moves that don't telegraph strongly on the first frame, or when the telegraph changes and becomes distinctive to a move when it looks like another move the character has in their arsenal. It's not terribly important, but I'm always happy to have more data to work with.

[Justice7541]

Well, distinguishing the move is part of the reaction time. What I'm talking about is stuff that literally doesn't animate till a few frames in. Like a jump startup or something where you just look like you're standing still for 3-4 frames then you're in the air.

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[TheRealBobMan]

"Well, distinguishing the move is part of the reaction time."

I wouldn't say it quite like that. If two moves start nearly identically, but one is an overhead and one is a low, you can't distinguish them until the frame that one sets itself apart from the other at the earliest. This is when the reaction actually starts, and it takes around 380ms or about 23 frames, for a complex reaction involving 2 stimuli with different desired outputs/reactions. I'm just splitting hairs though since you are right.

But yeah, a move that is simply delayed in starting is different than what I was talking about. I think Fritz has that going for him in Akatsuki Blitzkampf. He has a few somewhat slow moves, but he animates quickly when doing them, making it harder to react to his actions. I think his 5C is in the 17-20 frame range for startup time, but it happens so fast after a delayed startup that it would be difficult to block on reaction.

[Shining Aquas]

It's around 1 in the morning and I'm tired as hell, but my average was still around 27.5 seconds.

Should I give up Guilty Gear, cause this is basically telling me I will auto lose to every Millia player once I get knocked down once.

Mostly kidding, but also kinda...not.

[Ronove]

It's around 1 in the morning and I'm tired as hell, but my average was still around 27.5 seconds.

Should I give up Guilty Gear, cause this is basically telling me I will auto lose to every Millia player once I get knocked down once.

Mostly kidding, but also kinda...not.

With all the things she can do as part of her oki I don't think you should focus too much on just blocking 6K or TK Badmoon on reaction anyway. :P

[TheRealBobMan]

It's around 1 in the morning and I'm tired as hell, but my average was still around 27.5 seconds.

Should I give up Guilty Gear, cause this is basically telling me I will auto lose to every Millia player once I get knocked down once.

Mostly kidding, but also kinda...not.

I hope people don't mind that I keep repeating the same information, but I hate it when I see people say this kind of thing. I'm also pretty sure it didn't take you 1/2 a minute to react. You should give up on not getting hit by cars if that's the case.

There are simple reactions, and complex reactions.

This tool tests complex reactions. When you have to react to 2+ different stimuli with different responses, the average reaction time for just 2 is 380ms. Adding more increases this time by like 60ms each.

Simple reactions are the ones that average around 180-200ms. See light, push button. Simple right?

This test throws one of like 5 different stimuli at you, some of which have the same startup (TK badmoon / haircar) yet require different responses, and just about all of which have a startup of about 300ms or less. Good fucking luck trying to consistently block all of that on reaction, especially without training yourself. Even after you've figured out a good system, you still need an element of prediction to get through Millia's mixup. Everyone has about the same capacity for reaction speed. Neurons can only fire so fast.

You get like 3-6 chances to not fuck up once Millia gets going, which is good enough. Just practice until you recognize her moves earlier in their animations, and figure out ways to use your tools to get out of her oki. Some of her traps involve attacking late, some involve meaties, etc. Everything has some kind of weakness, even if it's to only one of your options. Sometimes the right option is to just block, and you can't be afraid to use it.

[Teyah]

IT'S BACK

 

http://www.teyah.net/milliablocker.html

 

 

(sorry it was down for so long)

[ESG Jagged]

yeah noone can block 7 frames, the human mind verifies visual ques @ 1/4th of a second, which in the 60FPS gaming world translates to 15frames. thats not counting Muscular reaction to the brain. after you verify there is a given time period that it takes for your brain to send a signal to your muscles to react to what you see.

 

i might note that our reaction to sound is much faster than Visual reaction

human reaction to Sound is 13 frames.

 

this doesnt mean we cant Block a 15 frame attack!

there are many types of reactions that we use in a fighting game:

Prediction being the main one we fall on in a heated fight.

when you block a move that is below 15 frames, thats Prediction reaction, either they have a set of moves that they do in loop, or they only have so many options given the situation, your brain automatically remembers this and reacts before the visual recognition process is complete

[ESG Jagged]

can someone make a Mortal Kombat X Version of the Millia Blocker v0.3

[Mumm-Ra]

When'x Xrd version?