[CSE] Jin Gameplay Discussion

[Yuushiro]

so , first hand impression of first day Jin in BBCSEX...

-nerf to 6C really sux..., now can't really combo decently off it....

must do a different thing off air throw or 3 ice if it's not corner.

-jC almost doesn't lead to anything now..., Tetsu can combo off 2D against ren coz the angle was really close, otherwise can't..

-seems can't really combo a lot off air hit either....,

-DP B seems a bit more usable outside combo, but still doesn't make up for the nerf...

- I still yet have to learn proper combos, right now I am resorting to CS1 stuff....

-the ice car a wallbounce causing me to swap side a lot of time in the corner, seems you have to adjust your position.

-I did like 5-6k in the corner, ending it with DP D> Ice arrow....

-2D is super punishable now..., if you whiff it..., on the other hand ppl at my arcade keep forgetting that it breaks primer now...

-I do CS1 midscreen combo with hj2C>jD>air dash > j2C>jC and then do >5B>3C... some character could tech after that but it seems that it'll net the most dmg that way also most consistent.

-so to get the most meter and dmg midscreen seems sekkajin is necessary, if you are near corner then you prolly can do 6C> dash in>jC>ice car a wall bounce..., otherwise no...

-his dmg nerf is really bad I thinkj.., both touga and ice arrow dmg nerf... was pretty bad... imo

-can't really combo anything after Ice arrow, I try to do DP B , maybe air combo..., seems won't get anything off CH Ice arrow either, they tech pretty quickly...., not as rewarding..., even yukikaze prolly better if you can or just DP RC you get about the same amount of dmg for reversal.

-I keep messing up throw combo lol..., freeze time now not as long so special cancel is a must if you want to get a combo.

-6A proration is a bit better, I still need to find a better corner specific combo for it though...

-2B not jump cancellable kinda sux..., I used to use it all the time since CS1..., I keep forgetting about that too...., now I guess I need to use 2B>5B more for variety.

-2C is quite a decent anti air, I can feel the head invul is nice..., on fatal CH you can combo to 6D midscreen I think as anti air.., use 6C in the corner...

-I can feel why tetsu switched lol..., it's really so much more work to win with Jin now feels like rofl...., Tager and Relius seems troublesome..., tager seems have so much more dmg out of anything, while we lost a lot of our option..., no more jC(CH)> 2D..

if you are close enough you can prolly get 5B>5C> sekka, but yea, not so good for us.

-6C CH still combos decently if you are pretty close to the corner... 6C CH > 3-dash> 6C works if you are really close to the corner....

[Yuushiro]

oh no more corner swap out of dash in 6C in the corner or ice arrow CH...

I guess that's obvious..., you can still use EX fireball to do it..., it's kind of worth it since it unlocks our true potential combo-wise in the corner......

edit: oh 1 thing..., if you get jC CH close to you , you can prolly do 5C > j2C > jD ...., so jC CH combos is really situational depends on where you get a hit seems like

[kirk]

They nerfed touga too? Also does yukikaze really catch low now?

Oh and if you get the time, could you try if a 3c>214a(first time) could link to a ground 236D? kinda curious if it does lol

Edit : and yeah you should be able to combo off a CH jC with an airdash jC>jD too saw kaqn do it xD

[Yuushiro]

yea, yukikaze seems to catch low..., seems that'll be a preferrable reversal now....

touga is nerfed pretty bad..., that base guarantee dmg is kinda nice but still doesn't make up for it..., DP D> touga seems to be nerfed even more now.

I dont think 3c>214A>ex fireball would combo, but I'll try anyway.

and jC on normal jump I can't do air dash

[Moy_X7]

Try j.C CH > dashing 6C > 2D on grounded opponents and see if that works. For an air j.C CH, you wanna do j.C CH > dashing 5C > 2C > 2D.

[Yuushiro]

they'll tech before 6C could hit them... after jC CH either ground or air...

I can't seem to get that to hit at all.

I'll try the 5C>2C combo

[xlolxlolx]

mori balance is too godlike

[Yuushiro]

so unfair... we only get to experience top tier BBCS2 Jin in less than 6 months....

BBCS1 and this one prolly gonna last longer... at least till september next yr, coz of SBO most likely.

[kirk]

Btw, Which feels better? CS1 or CSE jin? and yeah lol I just noticed you got msn.. Mind if i add you?

[xlolxlolx]

just saw a few vids....try CH JC>dash 5C>2C>hjc>JD>air dash>J2C>JC>dash 5C>mash>6C>214C

[Yuushiro]

it depends..., seems a lot of CSEX Jin abare wise will be undeterministic and situational , I don't really like that..., I guess I have to experiment myself to get the best combo out of every hits.

CS1 feels better coz I like consistency...,

also 6C nerf was unnecessary I think..., it makes midscreen combo harder..., I think I need to learn tetsu stylized combo of j2C>jC>sekka for those situation....

and yea, u can add me...

just saw a few vids....try CH JC>dash 5C>2C>hjc>JD>air dash>J2C>JC>dash 5C>mash>6C>214C

anything for ground hit jC CH??? on a long range??? I guess that'll be just uncomboable most of the time?

[kirk]

Yeah from the looks of it CS1 looks better.

I really do hate the 6C nerf. Are corner DP loops still do-able? Japs seem to go with 6c> jc>214a combos instead.

Added you btw.

[xlolxlolx]

uhhh im thinking if you get pretty close up and pretty low then you can do 5C stuff if youre lucky lol, long range probably not....unless air ice sword startup is faster.....but you'd needa RC for some ghetto looking version of ky's SE FRC air dash combo

the corner A ice car crap looks like you need to sideswap dash it....sooo im guessing something likeee 5B>5C>mash>dash 6C>DC>JC>J214A>sideswap>5C>2C>JD>5B>5C>3C>623B>214C or 5C>623B>6C>623C>5A>5C>2C>JD>stuff, no idea if youll be able to pick up after all that stuff though.

uhhh test if that 6A knockdown crap works, might be able to use it for some midscreen stuff

[kirk]

lol now that you mentioned it.... i wonder if 5B(CH?)/5CCH AA> 6A > 2B > 5C >hj2c jD> stuff or something would work... xD

[Shinsyn]

Man, these changes don't look so hot... just hearing about them and hearing that Tager is going to be a problem is just plain... UGH! Fighting AXIS is gonna be such a pain in the ass now.

[Solex]

...why is fighting tager a pain now?

but you'd needa RC for some ghetto looking version of ky's SE FRC air dash combo

thatd be hype and probably be worth it at some point

lastly i thought touga got a damage buff not a nerf

[Yuushiro]

touga only do 2.2, 2.1 raw now instead of 2.3 base dmg by itself..., it has a better minimum dmg guarantee but overall it got nerfed..., as I said DP D> touga is even less dmg now...

Tager is a pain because he does so much more dmg, his normal feels better, all his new tool actually quite decent and annoying.

Prolly I haven't find a tager specific combo that's decent, but even still, feels like he can do 3-4k so easily midscreen while we don't get that except for corner and it's riskier even now.

[Shinsyn]

...why is fighting tager a pain now?

thatd be hype and probably be worth it at some point

lastly i thought touga got a damage buff not a nerf

Touga got a buff for miminum damage IIRC. And Tager is an annoyance because his normals are better and his combos are doing 3k+ midscreen with ease while we work harder for it.

EDIT: Ninja'd by over 3 hours, that's what I get for falling asleep with my computer on Go Advanced...

[Moy_X7]

Gay, that j.C nerf seems so unnecessary and now even j.C CH > dashing 6C is impossible. It's not like j.C was OP, we could only get some decent damage out of it on CH. I'm guessing that the only thing we can get out of a j.C CH on a grounded opponent is a dashing 5B > Sekkajin combo if we're close enough or a dashing 5C > 5D > 214D > corner stuff if we're too far and I'm not too happy about spending meter to do damage, we already have 6A for that. I could live with the 6C nerf if it only affected the 6C > DC > 5C combo path but now 6C > 2D is situational too.

[Jourdal]

So it was worse off than we thought, these changes seem so unnecessary in a lot of cases. And everytime i think midscreen nerf is universal..i start hearing X character can do Xabove average amount midscreen.....4k midscreen tager combos...ragna getting close to 4k off a 5B on crouching come to mind.

[Rewenger]

anything for ground hit jC CH??? on a long range??? I guess that'll be just uncomboable most of the time?

214C/D? lol

Also may be j.236D, dunno.

Hearing all this stuff with a lot of ellipsis makes kinda depressed. Especially that Jin got robbed of his stable gameplay.

By the way, new Touga should do as a decent combo finisher against Tager, he eats about 7 hits == 1400 min dmg.

[Solex]

^shhh dont tell them that kind of thing. just let them wallow in their sadness

but touga is just a good midscreen ender now. in corner ice arrow is probably better

about tager he may have gotten better normals/damage but we can zone him he will just be scary when he gets in...you know like a real grappler character

does anyone have the specific frames of how long someone is untechable after 214a. i was thinking that there is some cool things you could get with a random air hit j.c/j.b/j.2c hitconfirms near the corner

EDIT: in all seriousness though you guys are way to sad about cse jin he is still good and doesn't deserve this kind of attitude, only one character in cse does deserve this much sadness and thats mokoto because she is laughable

[kirk]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xMRZOGxZKyE#t=3m40s

Seems like Hiyoku Getsumei is drive special cancellable. didn't know that.

[Yuushiro]

no, he wait till the animation finished....

btw report on day 2 EX Jin

-3c>214a>ex fireball doesn't work,, too slow...

I get better intuition now to combo after jC..., I can get another jC on CH, or 5C or 2d if I am really close to the ground..., it's not super hopeless.., on normal hit if you are close enough I train myself to jD.

-the side swap from 6c>jC>214A is hard to do..., I keep messing it up and do a backdash instead.. I prolly need some tips on this..., , I am not sure how to do the 5C>6C>6D sideswap either like YENGE,

-oh new corner side swap is blah>5b>5c>sekka> 5c>2c>2d> swap > ground ender....

-I keep messing up this combo, seems can't be done, my enemy keep teching out, [ 3c>214A>5c>DP B>6C > DP C> (can't do the 5b or 5a) follow up ] after this one..., I stop trying it and just do something else most of the time.

-I sometimes end the combo with no knockdown and just fire up EX fireball and it push them back and it'll be in 2D range..., after they burst this is an effective method to drain their barrier me thinks...., do it sparringly though...

- can't pick up with 2B after 6A seems like, only 3C works.

[oh unrelated notes, pozer complained about ragna's 6D changes now that it propel them forward..., now can't do the CS2 combo out of fatal or guard break]

- oh 2C fatal follow up seems varies.., if the enemy is airborne u can do 6D if u used it as anti air, if they are grounded do 6B, if it's corner 6C still the best choice....

- I did 5k something almost 6k with 6c ch near corner. using the pseudo old corner loop.

I am still doing fine overall with Jin, maybe coz of my fundamentals...., I got 17 wins streak at most today, while only pozerwolf still give me the most trouble..., got decent wins if I am fighting anyone else....

seems the matchup against ragna feels worse too now..., also hazama.., jC zoning game doesn't work that well against them anymore because of the nerf to that move.... so I try

to use more ground game now..., like stunedge says, jumping without reason just feel unreasonable with Jin now. They can predict our jump since now there's only so much ground normal that's jump cancellable(5b, 5c, 2a, 5a) that's it....

-Still practicing to do j2C>jC>sekka too..., seems have to mash C really early for that to work.

- the throw combo that ren does in the corner doesn't work with everyone..., I know it doesn't work for tager...

the combo is (throw(2)>214A(whiff)>DP B> 2C> 6C> DP C blah...) that doesn't work, I just do

(throw) > DP B > 66C> DP C> 5a>5c>2C>DP C instead.

ending the first throw combo with ice arrow give 3.4 instead of 3.1 with DP D... worth it if you gonna get the kill..., but only 300 more dmg with a 50% meter.., man that nerf to ice arrow is pretty bad...

I also try to end the ice arrow combo with DP C in the corner if possible..., if u get too many hits before it will whiff and be punishable though, not sure what's the cutoff yet....

-also for bnb midscreen, I like to do tetsu style blah> sekka> 6>jump>jC>j2C>jD> ground...,

instead of the CS1 variant..., seems the net dmg about the same..., we'll see...

[kirk]

Oh I see, My bad.