Jump to content

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.

HexaNoid

[CS2/CSE] Lambda Critique And Self-Improvement Thread

Recommended Posts

if you have problems to do 5C->4B(2) (in extend is easier than in cs2, i learned to use it looking at videos and learning the distance, like to do the 236C->5C->6C->236D in the corner, a combo that you don't use), you can also try to do as ryuujinx says (2C->214D/214DC 2B). Yes, do 6C in blockstring is not the best idea, but doing 3C and not doing a single attemp of overhead won't make a change: people will block all low when know that you don't do a single overhead, and you will feel like a ragna.

5C isn't a bad starter...until somebody notices that u use it, and start to punish it, you can't stop the swords quick if you whiff. I used to do that in the past... and my friends started to punish it. Also, it hits mid, so it's easy to block and easy to IB (meter for the rival), now i use 2A/2B/3C/4B(2)/j.2D(jump back) when i am near the opponnent.

Lambda is a char hard to block when you haven't experience in the matchup. But when they have it, you will have problems.

For example, that litchi doesn't know the matchup very well. She failed blocking a lot of easy things, like wheels and random 236C (i only use 236C to take primers when the rival doesn't punish it, is -6 on block (5A of some characers have a startup of 5), hit with it is hard at medium level)

And sometimes, when you have 50 meter and you are under presure in the corner, you can use more the CA. It takes a primer, but expect a hole where you can calamity sword is a bad idea sometimes when you are at low life.

This are my advices, advices from a medium level player of lambda with friends that break throw mixups, 236A mixup throws every time besides throw counter and block every 236C, 236B, 236D, 4DD, double jump every 214D...ARG! they made me learn to do properly mixups and learn to have patiente at far range and with a lead of life: they need to approach, if they keep blocking they will lose. Is easy to block all lambda's stuff at long range if you are quiet, but is hard to block it while moving forward.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Mix up after 5C

-I used to try 4B a lot, but hmmm... don't know why either it doesn't really work for me. Still not sure myself, but the distant sensitive, and combo after it that miss often. but yes, I think 6C look stupid when opponent isn't in the air too. I think I ll try 5C->3C instead. (unless I could master 4B, but dunno how, it never work well to me. "What is the tip for good 4B chance?")

The thing with the 4B is that there's a certain distance that you need to have from the opponent to connect only the second hit and make it more difficult to see the overhead coming, and there's also a certain distance that you need to hit the opponent to continue with 2DD later. After you master the distance, try to mix it up with 3C, 4B is safe on block and can follow up to a combo with a decent damage and 3C if blocked can be cancelled on 214D to keep pressure, and on hit it can be followed up on a 236D for a okizeme or 236B>RC for a combo, so you have a strong mixup on your hands (not to mention that you can cancel 5C into 2C for a even stronger mixup).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

This are my advices, advices from a medium level player of lambda with friends that break throw mixups, 236A mixup throws every time besides throw counter and block every 236C, 236B, 236D, 4DD, double jump every 214D...ARG! they made me learn to do properly mixups and learn to have patiente at far range and with a lead of life:

With that kind of opponent, I m pretty sure you are very good at bait/trap set up to break through. Can you teach me with some of your videos?

For about using 2A 2B often, actually i do them really often nowadays since I m starting to get used to melee combat now, but those video are "vs mid-range players" which is why you would not see me use A/B so often. I think C is easier to confirm in the distant. For 4B, I really not master it lol.. I need to know which combo/pressure would make sure of the good distant for that. I keep getting 4B in the wrong distant.

3C -> 214D got me punish too often by that Lichi, another strong Jin, and good ragna already so I haven't done it for a long time now.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

3C->214D isn't a good idea, i think. 3C->236B is the best, i think, but it can be punishable by DP or Tager. 214D is VERY PUNISHABLE

I've only 2 vids with my friend, and they were in a final of a local tourney with a huge prize, so i was very nervous (my friend more than me, he didn't block a lot of times 4D or 236B lol). But now we have a pvr, so when extend arrives at our homes (in two or three days) we will record a lot of matches to show my little mixup (not very good vs him, because of this i prefer to stay safe at far distance lol)

Also if anybody could advise me about how to improve my gameplay (i know i have done a lot of wrong things, but i was a little nervous ^^ and also my friend was VERY nervous, so i tried to do some random things fishing for a mistake) http://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLBD5288A69D15ABFC&feature=view_all He is a lot better on defense, but at the start he was very nervous.

The 4B were at wrong range because the difference between bbcs2 and extend (i think they would hit in extend at that range)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3C->214D isn't a good idea, i think. 3C->236B is the best, i think, but it can be punishable by DP or Tager. 214D is VERY PUNISHABLE

Not in the distance that only the second hit of 4B would connect. Not only that, but 236B finishes off all of your pressure, while 214D in the worst scenario with most characters you will trade hits (with lambda being able to continue the combo sometimes).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Not in the distance that only the second hit of 4B would connect. Not only that, but 236B finishes off all of your pressure, while 214D in the worst scenario with most characters you will trade hits (with lambda being able to continue the combo sometimes).

There is an 18 frame gap between 3C's blockstun ending and 214D being guarantee'd to come out. A trade shouldn't be happening at all if your opponent isn't hesitating once seeing 214D's start-up or unless there is some lag.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Well I just got done playing CSE against another human for the first time. No videos, but really it just comes down to "play more", I think. I was playing against a Rachel who hasn't played much either, so I was managing to do fairly well, but that has more to do with the fact that I'm more used to Lambda than he's used to Rachel, probably. Anyway...

My big problems were being under pressure/in close range. I could usually backdash out of his blockstrings when they weren't airtight, but trying to poke him out before he even starts them seems like it's just going to get me killed. I was only really having luck with 3C it seems like, and I'm gonna assume Rachel can just do her little spinning hop attack over it so it's probably not something to rely on. There were a few rounds where I had to burst early just because I lost half my life being pressured or getting hit, and from there I was able to bring the match around, but I'm thinking that's really bad if I have to fight a rushdown character.

Midrange I'm pretty confident, I was able to keep him guessing with my swords, and make sure he had trouble getting in at least. I could use more work on using reaction 6D to grab his IADs, but that's about it. I guess I play very cautious though, I wasn't moving in much to start an assault, occasionally I'd use 236B or 236A into a throw to keep him from getting complacent, but I was for the most part keeping my distance with drives. Again, probably not a good universal strategy.

On offense I think I was great though! One knockdown and I was able to pretty nicely control the pace of the match, and Lambda being able to force oki with 236D/214D is really what drew me to her anyway. I think I really just need to practice more, find more mix-ups and nail my combos more. I was getting a lot of bluebeats, sadly. 236236D was what I used to "get the momentum" at neutral if I had the meter, not sure if I should save that more for combos.

Anyway, thoughts? I don't record much since it's a hassle for me, but if I get the time later this week I think I'll be able to. Lambda's definitely the most fun I've had in BB, just her mix-up is amazing and I love her offense. I'm just worried about being on the defensive side of things.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The Rachel should be reaction wind-teching your 236D oki if he doesn't want to block it.

The hardest thing about playing Lambda, IMO, is that (at a high level) there isn't much room for error. If and once they get in, the opponent doesn't have to respect your defensive options nearly as much as other characters. Her defensive weakness isn't going to disappear no matter what level you play at.

I personally don't like 236236D simply because it has such a huge heat cooldown. It is good, however, for Gravity-less corner carry. I think it's useful for a Hail Mary moment if time is running out

For combo's, just focus on getting her basic 236D corner combo down for now, as well as her mid-screen OTG Gravity combo's.

Keep at it!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hey guys, can anyone please analyze my gameplay on these matches?

http://www.twitch.tv/x_revolution/b/312829648

0:45:55

1:00:51

1:06:08

Those are tournament matches and in a tournament that I was hyped for, so I'm playing my best on it. Just please don't tell me to optimize my combos, I know this is an issue and I'm already training it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

When you did j2C whiff->5C against Japa in the corner, was it because you knew he would backdash or was it an accident?

236D oki isn't good against Rachel due to her wind tech.

You should 2D Rachel more so she doesn't summon stuff in the air.

Air throw->5C whiff->4B against their neutral tech looks nice

I think you do 3C->something that isn't 236B too much. 214D or 236D are punishable after it and 236A is only okay if you don't overuse it.

While optimizing is important, you should put some more time into hit-confirming. It didn't seem like you ever really hitconfirmed landing 5DD and had already chosen what you were going to do after it, regardless of whether or not your opponent got hit by it. Same thing with landing 236D.

I also think you use 5C way too much in both pressure, neutral and for oki.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
When you did j2C whiff->5C against Japa in the corner, was it because you knew he would backdash or was it an accident?

I knew he would backdash.

236D oki isn't good against Rachel due to her wind tech.

You should 2D Rachel more so she doesn't summon stuff in the air.

I see, nice tips. In the case on the 236D oki, how does she do the wind tech to escape? It's just that I don't have that much experience against rachel, so I've never seen one using it.

Air throw->5C whiff->4B against their neutral tech looks nice

Yup, it's to make a 3C/4B mixup.

I think you do 3C->something that isn't 236B too much. 214D or 236D are punishable after it and 236A is only okay if you don't overuse it.

If I used 236D after a 3C that was blocked so it was a mistake of mine.

The thing with 236B is that unless I have meter to Rapid Cancel it I lose all my pressure on this attack, I'm safe later, but I can't keep the pressure, and most of the players that I play against respect my 214D (specially because I think not all characters can punish it if they are too far away from you, some can do that only with meter), so I'm fine while they do that.

While optimizing is important, you should put some more time into hit-confirming. It didn't seem like you ever really hitconfirmed landing 5DD and had already chosen what you were going to do after it, regardless of whether or not your opponent got hit by it. Same thing with landing 236D.

Yeah, I usually choose what I will do after 5DD before it hits, so it's really a problem of mine, I will keep it in mind and I will try to hit-confirm more, thanks.

I also think you use 5C way too much in both pressure, neutral and for oki.

Yeah, I love that button. Can you give examples of situations where I used 5C and would be better to not use it or use another attack?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
I see, nice tips. In the case on the 236D oki, how does she do the wind tech to escape? It's just that I don't have that much experience against rachel, so I've never seen one using it.

If I used 236D after a 3C that was blocked so it was a mistake of mine.

The thing with 236B is that unless I have meter to Rapid Cancel it I lose all my pressure on this attack, I'm safe later, but I can't keep the pressure, and most of the players that I play against respect my 214D (specially because I think not all characters can punish it if they are too far away from you, some can do that only with meter), so I'm fine while they do that.

Yeah, I love that button. Can you give examples of situations where I used 5C and would be better to not use it or use another attack?

1) She techs and presses 6D while doing it. She flies out of range of 236D and can punish you for using it.

2) There is an 18 frame gap between 3C and 214D. Every character has a way to deal with it and I'm pretty sure all of them can do it on reaction. You should probably tell the people you play about that so they can start punishing you for doing so. 236B is safe if they block it and you can either 2A or backdash to try to get some momentum afterwards if you don't feel like just blocking (assuming they didn't IB it).

3) I wouldn't recommend using it outside of combos and the occasional 4B/3C mix-up from it. It is better to use jump cancelable moves.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I just skipped through it fast and noticed a few negative points:

-Your opponents were awful.

-Using 2A or fullscreen 4DD during 236D oki is such a waste of opportunity, when you can go for great mixup with 2B, 4B, jumpins, feints and throws.

-Still way too much random use of 5C. Like after airthrow you would just hit 5CCCCC as oki. When instead you could do great mixup/baits/crossunders/optionselects with (dash) 2B.

-Doing RC, j.2DD, 214D so often after your combos is an huge meterwaste. I'd only do that, if they aren't dead after a j.632146D when I have another 50% tension and it would kill them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
1) She techs and presses 6D while doing it. She flies out of range of 236D and can punish you for using it.

2) There is an 18 frame gap between 3C and 214D. Every character has a way to deal with it and I'm pretty sure all of them can do it on reaction. You should probably tell the people you play about that so they can start punishing you for doing so. 236B is safe if they block it and you can either 2A or backdash to try to get some momentum afterwards if you don't feel like just blocking (assuming they didn't IB it).

3) I wouldn't recommend using it outside of combos and the occasional 4B/3C mix-up from it. It is better to use jump cancelable moves.

1) I see, thanks, gonna see if I start using 214D more against her then.

2) Just tried it on training against ragna, he can DP between 236B and 2A and his 2A trade hits with lambda (returning the match to neutral)

3) Well, I still can do 5C>2C>jump cancel, but I will try to use this attack less then.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2) Just tried it on training against ragna, he can DP between 236B and 2A and his 2A trade hits with lambda (returning the match to neutral)

Which is why you backdash in those cases. Ragna doesn't recover fast enough from either one to punish your backdash. He can punish the backdash with dash 5B, but that would lose to Lambda's 2A. Of course, you don't always want to take this risk, but it is an option from 236B and it generally better than continuously doing close range 214D/236D.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

-Your opponents were awful.

Fair enough, though there aren't too many good players on XBL yet.

-Using 2A or fullscreen 4DD during 236D oki is such a waste of opportunity, when you can go for great mixup with 2B, 4B, jumpins, feints and throws.

I was playing casual and slow and didn't feel like putting any effort in with mixups and closeup game (when i used 4DD)

2A however, is amazing for mixups. 2A>5B>6A>2B gives you the option of 4B(2), 3C, or 2C which can lead to TK, jump out, 3C, or TK feint which can lead to even more mixups or pressure reset.

-Still way too much random use of 5C. Like after airthrow you would just hit 5CCCCC as oki. When instead you could do great mixup/baits/crossunders/optionselects with (dash) 2B.

Netplay =/

That few milliseconds of lag screws up my dash buffering so i just completely drop that oki option on netplay.

Other random 5Cs though, yeah i can't break that habit. I like getting my opponent under 5C pressure because i'm lazy and like having time to slowly think. Its a bad habit and I constantly get punished for it.

-Doing RC, j.2DD, 214D so often after your combos is an huge meterwaste. I'd only do that, if they aren't dead after a j.632146D when I have another 50% tension and it would kill them.

I got bored after a while and just wanted to be flashy. I can upload older replays where i actually did those if you want to judge them. I've been ending combos with an air DD ender since way back in CS1. (though I play worse when I actually try due to trying to read my opponent instead of just trolling or using lazy mistimed mixups that cause my opponents to mistime high/lows blocks)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Why would you use 2A for mixup, is what I don't understand. 2B is better. You need to block low for that. 2B > j.214D, if you want. 2B is neutral on block and crescent saber has something like a 20 frame start-up, it's a quick overhead. No need to add a 5B in there. It's not mixup if you're not mixing things up. For more examples you can go with 2B > throw, 2B > 4B[2], 2B > 236A > cross-over...etc. Mix-up. Unless you hit-confirm with 2B or some other starter, I wouldn't recommend 3C for pressure.

If you want to get critiqued properly, it's best if you pick a game where you're not trying to be flashing/trolling/etc, at least that way we can see where you're actually weak at.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

But I play better when i play flashy. I just don't do optimal stuff. I do a lot better at not getting hit though, so it works out better for me. Maybe its just my opponents losing focus due to anger at me not taking things seriously enough.

my mixup that starts with 2A distances perfectly for 4B(2) though. if I do ONLY 2B, the first hit of 4B connects usually, giving my opponent a chance to react. I just like having that instant 4B(2) available.

I suppose I could do that jump>airdash or grounddash mixup when i get wheel pressure.

It DOES have options of airdash>high, Grounddash>High, Airdash>Pause>low, Grounddash Low.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Better reason to use 2B instead. It is a low. If you use it during sickle storm oki pressure, it makes it all the more powerful. Doing 2A won't really give you that because the opponent will be prepared for your non-mixup 5B > 6A > 2B, takes awhile before you actually get to the mix-up. 2B > 4B[2] is character specific, even 2A > 4B[2] would be the same, you have to space it properly to work. 2A also has shorter range, so in some case it's more riskier and it's also -4 on block, whereas 2B is 0 on block. If they instant block your 2A, they can punish you. Just some things to take into account.

You can be flashy and optimal as well. You should try sickle storm oki pressure in the corner. Makes for some flashy combos, especially off j.B. [CH] 6A > dash 3C > 214A, is also flashy and optimal. Just try to work them into your playstyle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Which is why you backdash in those cases. Ragna doesn't recover fast enough from either one to punish your backdash. He can punish the backdash with dash 5B, but that would lose to Lambda's 2A. Of course, you don't always want to take this risk, but it is an option from 236B and it generally better than continuously doing close range 214D/236D.

I think I got it now, gonna make some tests during matches then.

Thanks!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Like AchedSphinx said, asking for gameplay advice on a video were you didn't play serious/like you normally do is kinda useless.

Also being flashy and playing optimal can go hand in hand just fine.

my mixup that starts with 2A distances perfectly for 4B(2) though. if I do ONLY 2B, the first hit of 4B connects usually, giving my opponent a chance to react. I just like having that instant 4B(2) available.

Your opponent just needs to Barrier/InstantBarrier it and your spacing will be off. Better try and learn to judge the right distance in any situation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Yeah I'll just do a dashing 4B when i have 50% meter then. I think i prefer j.214D>Oki to 1040 damage anyways. All my heat is gonna be used for RCing and CAing. Sickle mixup with J.B is pro.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Seem quite low activity going on lately, but I hope I can still get my help in time u_u;

There were a person who always counter/control over my game-play, and he never let it go no matter what strategies I try. long-range/mid-range/close-range/Oki/defensive. So I would like anybody who can help criticize my gameplay help me find the solution.

Well, first I want you to compare my normal game-play (not being control) when I face other players. and then compare with my game-play when I plays with him too. I think it always come out different, but I can't detail it, and I don't know what to change/do to make it better. I guess he could control me either because he is far superior or he just see everything through.

Here is my game play with my normal online skills : please check this first :

(The players I played with here aren't weak either, they all have PSR 500+, some 700)

(show different kind of playing here)

-Ragna

http://youtu.be/Erp2G10Vgcw

-Tsubaki

http://youtu.be/yTq7e2ivCWw

-Tager

http://youtu.be/QRDh61FnPxk

-Platinum

http://youtu.be/fyZ6jtUBv9E

-Relius

http://youtu.be/u2G-Y_9nJOw

Okay, and now, when I fight this person who is main Jin. It become a totally annihilate :

(I tried different way, but all lose )

http://youtu.be/KWwnBBBPato

http://youtu.be/cTHD2NrAx1w

http://youtu.be/p_A4qJr5gWw

http://youtu.be/zNrmrBZoDVw

http://youtu.be/cUcLOCe4yYA

http://youtu.be/XTYAAIOWQsk

http://youtu.be/HpVqrSJhiR8

So what should I do? and how to improve? what strategy should I do against him? Is there any weakness that I should use it for my opportunity that he has? Lastly, I wonder if there is any bad habit he and me like to do which could be turn into advantage/disadvantage? Says if you notice he like to do this after this, then I can counter with xxx. So far, I think he already learned me, but I can't study him.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

×