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KayEff

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there are a few exceptions to where SMP won't force immediate tech. the only example so far (someone can correct me on this) is some of hazama's moves.

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I'm trying to get a SF-based friend into BB (I'm a newbie myself at BB), and while his execution and dedication are up to par, he's wary about long combos for some reason. I suppose from a SF background it's a bit foreign for a combo to go beyond light -> light -> medium/heavy xx special move. My question to you guys is, which characters get away with smaller combos? He's already expressed disinterest in Tager, if that's a possibility for smaller combos. Play style doesn't mean much, though he prefers solid characters or dive kick type characters. Super jumps are fine mid-combo, microdashes and tiger knee instant-air motions are probably beyond his capabilities right now. Anyone help?

Think hes screwed in the sense that pretty much nobody is combo-less, so i guess he'd want to go with people with the easiest to execute...?

In which case i'd say start Ragna or Noel. Ragna's combos are pretty basic, and i dont know about newer noel, but learning her Silencer loop really trained my fingers for everything else.

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i actually never noticed that this thread existed

just a heads up, i'm moving all of these posts about "less execution extensive" stuff to the FAQ thread.

Edited by KayEff

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there are a few exceptions to where SMP won't force immediate tech. the only example so far (someone can correct me on this) is some of hazama's moves.

It probably depends on the properties of the move and how severe the smp is on that move. Like mu's 6c has "only" a SMP of 50% and an attack level of 5 it's possible to use 3 times (maybe more on FC) in your combo depending on your starter.

Even in CP Mu's 6c can't be immediately teched if used twice (unless very late in a combo), but you won't be able combo it much further

Edited by bakahyl

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I think in CP the "super SMP" only applies to Special moves. But i could be easily be wrong. I just feel I've seen a lot of "Same Attack Combos" that proc'ed on normals that still worked. Usually 6C or 3C. They weren't good combos, obviously, but they still worked, just like in CSE. A good example is how in CSE Tager's 6C has SMP properties but you can still 6C > ... > 6C > MTW

Hazama of course just breaks all the rules.

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i think the only difference is taht SMP now triggers a visual effect, otherwise it's the same as the older games (minus the smp glitch i hope!)

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Rachel's 5cc, which is a normal, wallsticks, and is level 5, has repeat prorate and the foe is able to immediately tech when two are done, no matter how close to the wall the foe is. I think something else is at work here than what you guys suggested. Something sinister...

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Are we talking about CP. Because it's clear that SMP has no affect on damage in CP and the best combos I've seen are ones stacking SMP moves because the SMP doesn't prevent the combo from continuing.

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SMP did retain the same properties in CP. The issue is that in EX the hitstun was determined by proration of a combo. Whereas in the next version (CP) the hitstun is determined by time limit based on your starter. So hypothetically speaking for every 1 second that passes in your combo, hitstun is reduced by like 7frames(This is just hypothetical) If you were to do a move that has SMP in the beginning of your combo in CP, then the opponent would not tech directly after being hit. In some cases they might not tech till they hit the ground. However if you were to activate SMP during the middle of a combo let say 5seconds (5seconds x 7frames= 35frames of hitstun lost), because of how much time has pass and how much hitstun has been reduced they will tech instantly after being hit.

However this is more of what I think than something that is absolute. Based off of what we all have seen in videos its the only logical explanation.

Because I have seen combos where a person would use SMP in the beginning and they did a small Air combo directly afterwards. I also believe that some moves during OD are immune to hitstun reduction (Hazama OD combos) which allows them to use them multiple times during one combo..... However this is just me placing the pieces together, no indefinite proof.. Just a educated guess.

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i think the only difference is taht SMP now triggers a visual effect, otherwise it's the same as the older games (minus the smp glitch i hope!)

i'm pretty sure SMP glitch has no damage/proration penalties anymore. this explains why hazama's OD combos with repeated chains and jayokus still do a shit ton of damage.

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SMP did retain the same properties in CP. The issue is that in EX the hitstun was determined by proration of a combo. Whereas in the next version (CP) the hitstun is determined by time limit based on your starter. So hypothetically speaking for every 1 second that passes in your combo, hitstun is reduced by like 7frames(This is just hypothetical) If you were to do a move that has SMP in the beginning of your combo in CP, then the opponent would not tech directly after being hit. In some cases they might not tech till they hit the ground. However if you were to activate SMP during the middle of a combo let say 5seconds (5seconds x 7frames= 35frames of hitstun lost), because of how much time has pass and how much hitstun has been reduced they will tech instantly after being hit.

However this is more of what I think than something that is absolute. Based off of what we all have seen in videos its the only logical explanation.

Because I have seen combos where a person would use SMP in the beginning and they did a small Air combo directly afterwards. I also believe that some moves during OD are immune to hitstun reduction (Hazama OD combos) which allows them to use them multiple times during one combo..... However this is just me placing the pieces together, no indefinite proof.. Just a educated guess.

Actually... This makes a lot of sense

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I've been out of the CP loop for a while now, so I'd just like to ask.

I've seen an indication in some fights that says "Same attack combo" or something along those lines

No surprise it happens when a player uses the same attack twice in a combo but I'd just like to ask is it a penalty or a bonus?

What does it do exactly?

Ok, let us recap for our friend who asked a very simple question.

We call this concept same move proration or SMP for short. It is an additional proration penalty (proration being how damage scaling is determined) triggered by using certain moves more than one time in the same combo.

For example, Tager's 4D gets a nice wall bound type effect on an air hit in the corner, but because it has SMP doing 4D 5C 4D would have very very bad proration.

The amount of proration added on is different on a move to move basis, but they are always penalties.

Also wild speculation should not be an acceptable answer to a question like this. What happened guys?

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ok so I need to know when the new BB is going to drop for the 360 and the ps3? Also what is new about the game?

Right it's only planned for PS3, and no one knows when it's going to drop. And everything you need to know are in the Blazblue Gameplay forums.

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ok so I need to know when the new BB is going to drop for the 360 and the ps3? Also what is new about the game?

From what we know about Console launch, it's looking like Chrono Phantasma will only be available for the PS3, and the release date is to be announced.

Chrono Phantasma storywise, takes places a month or two after the events in Kagutsuchi, and mostly takes places in the Ikaruga Federation. CP also introduces the androgynous performer Amane Nishiki, the mercenary girl Bullet, and Sector Seven's mad dog, Azreal, and Tsubaki's true form, Izayoi. Returning characters have had their past move properties altered, and new moves added. Noel also has a new costume, and Tsubaki has a new default color scheme.

The Overdrive function has also been added to replace gold bursts, which in essence, powers up the character's drive attacks or move sets in some way. Guard Primers have also been removed for the Crush Trigger. With 25 Heat, you can preform a move that crushes you're opponents guard, and can deplete the Barrier Gauge.

I think that sums it all up.

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From what I can tell it could go either way with 360 release. I mean on one hand it has not been announced yet for the 360, but then again every blazblue gets announced for the ps3 first and then the 360 a little later. This case is a bit odd though. Any news of a 360 release has been delayed if its going to happen. But then again, they've been extremely tight lipped about everything after the initial info they gave out prior to arcade release. I'd say if we don't hear of one by a month at the latest of the time they give out the release date, its not going to happen, until then its up in the air in my book.

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I think the idea that it'll be PS3 exclusive in Japan, but have a 360 port elsewhere, makes the most sense. Now, this may be a load of crap and I have no idea what I'm talking about, but there are plenty of BB players in the west who don't own both systems and only a 360, whereas that is definitely not the case in Japan. They would not lose much money from not bringing it to the 360 in Japan, but over here, that would cut down on a sizeable amount of profit and would alienate a lot of the fanbase, especially since not everybody who plays BlazBlue is going to buy a brand new system just to play the next game(I admittedly would). This would hardly be the first case of "PS3 only in the east, both consoles in the west" occurring, too. Now, if we get an official release date for America and there's no mention of the 360, THEN I think we should be worried about it there.

Of course, it what I just said is all bullshit and I'm talking out my ass, then I'm sorry for the confusion and/or acting like I know what I'm talking about.

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To know if there is a frame gap in between two attacks you look at 2 things:

1.) Blockstun of the first attack - Blockstun is determined by the attack's level. If you are on the dustloop wiki then go to the offense (In system explanation/mechanics) section at the very bottom of the page there should be a chart for each level attack and its blockstun.

2.) The startup of the followup attack. If the startup is 1 - 4 frames longer than the blockstun of the first move then it is considered a frame trap because it will beat out the fastest jabs (5 frames).

You could also go into training mode, record a string and try to mash out of it.

Let me know if you have any further questions or if I did not explain it well enough.

Edited by Dark Ranger88

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thanks for the quick reply. this is very helpful sir. i own a psp and the blazblue extend is in JPN,i dont understand japanese so maybe you can help me on the training menu to where can i find the option to set some strings.

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Hmm...I'll see what I can do about the language problem just give me a little bit. I wonder if this is a common thing?

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Don't quote me on this but if you put Block on "First Hit Only" you should be able to tell if it is a legit blockstring or not, which will tell you if it is a frametrap.

What will happen is even though it says "First Hit Only", it will actually block a whole string if it is frame tight. To make it even more realistic, if you turn on Counter Hit, it will allow you to properly confirm the combos as if the opponent was actually mashing and got hit by the frametrap.

So for example with Bang, if I do 5A>2A>2A the opponent will block that whole string, if I do 5B after that 2A he'll get hit because 2A>5B isn't frame tight. Bang's 5A>2B is a typical frametrap for him.

Can't help you with the menu translation though.

EDIT: Assuming the menu is exactly the same (which I don't know)

-Hit R1 3 times

-Down 4 times (should be on Blocking now)

-Right 3 times (should turn on "First Hit Only")

Otherwise you can just mess with the settings til you find what does that.

Counter Hit should be the 1st item in the 3rd menu, so R1 2 times.

Edited by zeth07

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I'm in a relatively good mood. Plus, I had an old copy of BlazBlue lying around on my PSP. So here you go, translations that pertain to the inside of each menu. The hyphen's are the equivalent of a space. If you're unsure of what some of this stuff means, Google is always good option (or you can just ask your question here). You'll have to do a bit of trial and error as well since I only outlined the default menu options; but it's still much better then nothing. Good luck.

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Bare in mind that instant block can ruin frame traps. For example: Makoto's 5CC > 6B have a 4 frames gap which makes it a frame trap by nature, however, if the 5CC is instant blocked then the gap becomes 7 frames which is a wide enough gap for a 5A to come out and beat Makoto. So... Best frame traps are usually of 1~3 frames gap.

Also, awesome stuff you got there Dreize.

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Wow I was gonna do this when I got off work, but you guys took care of business. Kudos.

And about using 'first hit only,' Be careful because the dummy will also get hit by attacks that leave a gap large enough to be poked out of. If you think you've discovered a frametrap in training mode, you should make sure using the frame data.

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