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Kiba

[P4A] Elizabeth vs Yu

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Discuss the Yu matchup here.

Punishes:

Anti-airing:

Zoning:

Their game plan:

Strategy:

Char specific details:

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Yu's 5B gets beat your 5B.

Slide is dumb in this match-up. will beat 5B clean if done early and goes under Maziodyne(beam) also Mabufudyne trades with slide if you didn't yomi it.

Have to be careful when zoning or you can eat ex Slide and just about die. 2B makes it fair somewhat.

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Yu's 5B gets beat your 5B.

Slide is dumb in this match-up. will beat 5B clean if done early and goes under Maziodyne(beam) also Mabufudyne trades with slide if you didn't yomi it.

Have to be care when zoning or you can eat ex Slide and just about die. 2B makes it fair somewhat.

Slide loses to Garu. If you see slide, do Garu and get a juicy 7k combo.

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Slide loses to Garu. If you see slide, do Garu and get a juicy 7k combo.

Thanks and slide loses to 5D even if he hits you.

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Thanks and slide loses to 5D even if he hits you.

Like, if he slides and you 5D it on reaction it will grab him? That sounds amazing!

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D.Garu will only hit Narukami if he does AoA at point blank. Literally point blank. Just pixels away, the D.Garu punish doesn't work. IB'ing the AoA gives you more room outside of point blank, but if the Narukami has spaced the AoA at max or close to max distance, even IB won't save the D.Garu punish.

Sick combo, though. I was genuinely excited until I found out the spacing necessary for it to work. :/

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D.Garu will only hit Narukami if he does AoA at point blank. Literally point blank. Just pixels away, the D.Garu punish doesn't work. IB'ing the AoA gives you more room outside of point blank, but if the Narukami has spaced the AoA at max or close to max distance, even IB won't save the D.Garu punish.

Sick combo, though. I was genuinely excited until I found out the spacing necessary for it to work. :/

Actually, nevermind. Despite C/D.Garu not connecting on Narukami AoA block outside of point blank range, you can still make this combo work.

Narukami AoA is -23. C.Garu starts up in 11 frames. Even if you block AoA at near-max range, you can do a short dash then C.Garu. The whole combo works, but does 9.2k instead of 9.6k off the D.Garu starter. It's tough. Especially if you block the AoA at max range. I haven't even tested max range. If you mess up, you just get C.Garu, and they can block. Not to mention the combo itself is no piece of cake. Try it at your own risk.

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....Does anyone have tips on fighting Yu? Is this match in our favor or in his favor...?

I swear, I get back to this game after dropping off and I don't know matchups at alllllll. x__x

But I like playing rare characters so...:3

(And Bace, I heard you may have some tips to help out.)

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I may not be the most qualified to speak about the Yu match-up, but it seems to be largely in Yu's favor. His 5B and 2B are all problems that you need to avoid. You typically want to stay out of range of his 5B with things like j.B or zoning specials. The inherent issue with using j.B as a zoning tool against Yu is that he can run up and 2B you most of the time for free. It sucks that Garudyne is worthless in this match-up because Yu's DP blows it up, so you can't really bait anti-airs all too well.

I believe the best way to play this match-up is to wait for Yu to make a mistake, and then punish him hard for it. Like a combo that will do good damage + lead into some sort of shenanigans.

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I may not be the most qualified to speak about the Yu match-up, but it seems to be largely in Yu's favor. His 5B and 2B are all problems that you need to avoid. You typically want to stay out of range of his 5B with things like j.B or zoning specials. The inherent issue with using j.B as a zoning tool against Yu is that he can run up and 2B you most of the time for free. It sucks that Garudyne is worthless in this match-up because Yu's DP blows it up, so you can't really bait anti-airs all too well.

I believe the best way to play this match-up is to wait for Yu to make a mistake, and then punish him hard for it. Like a combo that will do good damage + lead into some sort of shenanigans.

I see...

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This match-up is extremely in Yu's favor and one of the worst in the game. You can't jump in on him because 2B is so good but you can at least go even with his footsies and zoning. I like 5AA > instant air turn dash jA crossup because it will blow up attempts to DP or super through the holes in her strings. Hit him as hard as possible as fast as possible with her lame shit to close out a round - if you get knocked down then you lose, his oki is way too good and Liz has no options or health to deal with it. Always respect his Ziodyne super, especially at full screen distance, because it blows up half of Liz's move list.

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This match-up is extremely in Yu's favor and one of the worst in the game. You can't jump in on him because 2B is so good but you can at least go even with his footsies and zoning. I like 5AA > instant air turn dash jA crossup because it will blow up attempts to DP or super through the holes in her strings. Hit him as hard as possible as fast as possible with her lame shit to close out a round - if you get knocked down then you lose, his oki is way too good and Liz has no options or health to deal with it. Always respect his Ziodyne super, especially at full screen distance, because it blows up half of Liz's move list.

I noticed that. Went 4/9 against a friend today. The minute he picked Yu, the problems began. I need to work on not autopiloting things against him. I had that 'oh shit' look on my face a few times because of that.

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I really hate how there's absolutely nothing you can do against a good Narukami once you get knocked down in the corner. You space them out properly and deal with their shenanigans for an enter round, pulling ahead on life...just to get knocked down once and lose.

Getting AA'd once by 2B is likely to end the round as they can just do 2B AA > 2AB half the time. Your only way out being a mistake on the Narukami's part (which isn't even likely at a high level) is just ridiculous. I'm trying to find ways to deal with this matchup but...I only have some advice that you may or may not know at this point.

First, stay out of the air as much as you can. The only times going into the air would be viable is during a BIAD j.A mixup that you do off of a 5A/5AA blockstring, during an air A/B/SB Zio near the ground, or during SB Maragi oki. j.D mixups would also be another place for this, as well as low air-dash air grabs. The recovery on air grab is small enough to where unless he was already pressing a button or predicting the air dash you will often avoid eating a CH AA. This is extremely risky as mistiming it can lead to pressure from Narukami that could put you into 5D oki.

As good as 2B AA is, Narukami can easily get around it and score a knockdown if you just throw it out there. I'd advise you to only use it on a low air-dash that's done from a little less than half a screen away and maybe even a good read (but again, his air options can blow that up as well).

I was talking with Colpevole and watching Bace's matches and realized that a lot of Liz players really don't use 2D as much as they should. It makes this matchup a little easier, but it can make it worse if you just throw it out their on a whim as it can lead to an earlier persona break. Try to condition the opponent enough to where they'll be afraid of getting frame traped by 5C(2) > OMC > 5C(2) or getting caught by a 5D/j.D. Also, 2C > 2D is very useful with 2D's low hitbox. If they hesitate to punish 2C, you get a free 1.2k as long as you avoid getting hit. You can even blow the 50 SP on a OMC to just go for 2D, but that leads to loss of a card and 50 SP so I don't advise it unless you're absolutely sure they won't punish it (but again, that's 50 SP gone that could be spent elsewhere).

Edit: I forgot to mention it for some reason, but 5C(1) > 2D is also really good for this matchup and for matches in general.

I had some other things I wanted to point out, but I can't recall them at the moment. I'll post again when I remember them.

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I really hate how there's absolutely nothing you can do against a good Narukami once you get knocked down in the corner. You space them out properly and deal with their shenanigans for an enter round, pulling ahead on life...just to get knocked down once and lose.

Getting AA'd once by 2B is likely to end the round as they can just do 2B AA > 2AB half the time. Your only way out being a mistake on the Narukami's part (which isn't even likely at a high level) is just ridiculous. I'm trying to find ways to deal with this matchup but...I only have some advice that you may or may not know at this point.

First, stay out of the air as much as you can. The only times going into the air would be viable is during a BIAD j.A mixup that you do off of a 5A/5AA blockstring, during an air A/B/SB Zio near the ground, or during SB Maragi oki. j.D mixups would also be another place for this, as well as low air-dash air grabs. The recovery on air grab is small enough to where unless he was already pressing a button or predicting the air dash you will often avoid eating a CH AA. This is extremely risky as mistiming it can lead to pressure from Narukami that could put you into 5D oki.

As good as 2B AA is, Narukami can easily get around it and score a knockdown if you just throw it out there. I'd advise you to only use it on a low air-dash that's done from a little less than half a screen away and maybe even a good read (but again, his air options can blow that up as well).

I was talking with Colpevole and watching Bace's matches and realized that a lot of Liz players really don't use 2D as much as they should. It makes this matchup a little easier, but it can make it worse if you just throw it out their on a whim as it can lead to an earlier persona break. Try to condition the opponent enough to where they'll be afraid of getting frame traped by 5C(2) > OMC > 5C(2) or getting caught by a 5D/j.D. Also, 2C > 2D is very useful with 2D's low hitbox. If they hesitate to punish 2C, you get a free 1.2k as long as you avoid getting hit. You can even blow the 50 SP on a OMC to just go for 2D, but that leads to loss of a card and 50 SP so I don't advise it unless you're absolutely sure they won't punish it (but again, that's 50 SP gone that could be spent elsewhere).

Edit: I forgot to mention it for some reason, but 5C(1) > 2D is also really good for this matchup and for matches in general.

I had some other things I wanted to point out, but I can't recall them at the moment. I'll post again when I remember them.

Good Narukamis eat me for breakfast, lunch and dinner. But this writeup is helpful. I need to stop jumping against him.

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Good Narukamis eat me for breakfast, lunch and dinner. But this writeup is helpful. I need to stop jumping against him.

No problem. I'll be trying to come up with more things for most of the matchups if I find anything. I'll be focusing on Yu, though, so I'll probably post more in a few days or so.

Edit: 5A/5AA > air turn IAD mixups get blown up hard by Yu's DP if you telegraph it. I forgot to mention that even though both Eshi and I mentioned how effective it can be. It gets to the point where a Narukami will start anticipating the mixup and wait to AA you with DP when you cross him up (since it's air unblockable). Try and alternate between this and just a BIAD to create space.

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