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MikelAL93

[P4A] Yukiko Amagi - Q&A/FAQ Thread

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I've recently retired from P4A/P4U judging from the fact that haven't played this game in a while, but from my perspective, mirror matches don't really mean anything. For information and my notes on Yukiko's mirror matchup, check them out here:

Yukiko Mirror matchup thread

Edited by MikelAL93

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I find that I rarely use maragi c since the startup is so slow.

C Maragi is a good tool, and serves a different purpose from the D variant; which you use depends on the situation and/or what you expect your opponent to do. If you elect to use Maragi as part of a blockstring after having a 5/2C blocked, some opponents may roll right after blocking your normals to avoid D Maragi, Agi, etc. and get in. C Maragi will generally catch them as they come out of it (results may vary depending on spacing; you can always activate it at the appropriate spacing to be sure), giving you one of Yukiko's best damaging starters. Catch someone with this once, and they'll generally think twice about (ab)using that option. It also works great if you can maintain ambiguous roll-crossup spacing in the corner (i.e. if they try to roll to behind you to escape the corner, they'll end up in front of you instead). Of course, you don't want to abuse it either, because if it's expected, you might eat a nasty hit.

It can also work as a general zoning tool from long range if you have time to throw one out; the slower speed is nice for this purpose since it means it'll persist on the screen that much longer. If you knock someone back full screen, you can use Maragi to recall your persona after the usual B Agi xx 3D xx whatever setup (this would be one way to create the situation Ciddy described earlier); especially useful if you failed to drop your persona behind them, though using it in general as part of the setup regardless of where your persona landed isn't a bad idea if you're playing more of a zoning game. Varying your options means your opponent has that much more to think about, which can lead to hesitation, free hits, or both.

There's a lot of theory in this, and things are seldom quite so neat and clean (I also haven't really played in months...). Ultimately, how you approach things depends on the matchup and the opponent that you're fighting. Playing Yukiko requires being able to read your opponent to a certain extent because of how weak she is on defense and how much it hurts to whiff her options, so you'll want to learn to pick up on any tendencies your opponent has (safe/cautious vs aggressive/risk-taking), and adjust your gameplan as needed.

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I'm not sure what you mean by jumping back to IAD forward... Do you mean doing a jump, sideswitch, and then airdashing forward so you get the quick fall of a air backdash?

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The airdash after 5B, 4/5B into j.A? That is timing/spacing/character specific. Are you practicing it on Narukami?

For those kind of combos, I find that the timing issue lies in the 5BB. I've always had to delay the second B or the spacing would be wrong (you can hear a very exaggerated delay in the combo video). You could also swap the second 5B for a 4B and work with the timing on that instead. Just takes practice.

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I know ho to do it. The thing is ith that combo he was too close, so if he jumped in place and try to do it, he would fly pass the opponent. So he jump back to an IAD. Im trying to figure out how the player is jumping back to an IAD. I can't seem to do it.

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According to my input history, the way I do it is 4796, so kinda like an air half-circle motion. The odd thing is that I can only do it on the P2 side.

Edited by Moy_X7

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Thanks, this help. I now know how to move better. I would usually IAD back to a fan which does not come out. I also jump back to a fan toss. But this help me figure out how people like stunedge move so smooth and get swift super jumps to retreat fan tosses. its faster and safer.

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Because I'm playing on pad, I just do a late IAD backwards (delay the last 4 a bit) but yeah, super jump + IAD backwards is the best way to do the retreating fan toss.

Edit: Huh, I was messing around with the 5AA > 5BB > TK j.236A+B > ]A[ > 66 2C > 236D ~ ]B[ > 66 5C > 5BB > 236A/B combo and it's not as impossible to do as I thought. Hard as fuck but not impossible.

Edited by Moy_X7

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The only tricky part with that combo imo is the TK j.236A+B, and that's really only because 5BB has such low hitstop, so you have to do the jump cancel a lot earlier than one would be used to. You actually don't have to dash 2C either; in fact I like just doing a standing 2C instead to make the combo a bit more burst safe. In that case you delay the 236D~]B[ cancel from 2C in order for Maragi to properly connect.

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Okay, I haven't played this game in a very long time and I'm starting to get back into it again. I'm getting the hang of maragi combos. Can they only be done off a counter hit? I can't seem to find any other situations where I'm able to do them.

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Counterhit isn't required for loops that have combos starting with maragi, SB Agi or a corner All-out-attack -> D.

You do need counterhit off of 4/5/6D, though.

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Here goes my question(s) O_o

So what is the best way to practice Yukiko's unblockable Maragi setups? I'm fairly new to P4A and would to use this combo online.

Also, why do I find that most Yuki players refuse to use Fire Boost? imo it is really essential to her game. I'm excluding Break since they tend to accompany them with supers.

Oh, and I gotta say it's sooo satisfying clearing Score Attack mode--since Yukiko herself congratulates and compliments you for being so skilled with her :)

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To practice Fire Break-Maragi setups, just hit a training mode dummy with them, and set its recovery options appropriately. Depending on the setup, you'll either release Maragi perfectly timed/spaced to catch the opponent as they tech, or you'll manually detonate it so that they tech into the pillar. These setups are messed up by the opponent refusing to tech (they get hit by the Maragi as part of the previous combo, heavily scaled, and are able to tech before you can follow up); if you start getting those opponents, then you should work on the SB Agi unblockables, which can actually lead to a lot more damage in the corner if you know how to work them.

Fire Boost isn't that essential. Yukiko has 2 brands of combos; those that don't utilize many fire attacks (most of her combos not involving a FC, antiair CH, or Maragi start), and those that do (anything into Maragi loops; significantly fewer starters, but much higher damage). Yukiko's smaller combos see little benefit from Fire Boost since there's so few fire attacks that go into them, and when they do, they're usually at the end of the combo, heavily scaled. Maragi loops hurt a lot more, involve a lot of fire attacks (noticeable impact by Fire Boost), and 2-3 of them is enough to KO most opponents. The time put into Fire Boost really isn't worth it when you consider that A) she gets a lot more openings for the smaller combos, B) the damage bonus isn't really palpable until you get to hit 4+, and C) few opponents will allow themselves to be sufficiently zoned to build fire levels quickly enough to matter. Assuming you're not constantly sacrificing momentum for the sake of building levels, by the time you get to a level where it'll make a difference, your opponent should be missing enough health that you won't see any great returns on the time put into Fire Boost. It'd be worth the time investment to build levels if even half of them were retained between rounds, but since everything's lost... It has its uses as a way to make an overly defensive opponent move, but Fire Break is a lot more effective at that.

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One thing to practice with unblockable setups is ending combos with sweep. If you finish with a sweep and go into a Maragi or SB Agi, you can block wakeup attempts while your unblockable hits, and punish wakeup rolls if they happen to clear the Maragi.

Building stocks is good, but not essential. It's a style thing, and certain matchups lend themselves a bit better to you charging up. After a standard combo that ends in B Agi, you have the opportunity to get 2 stocks 'basically' free unless they have wakeup fullscreen options, and sometimes even three. It's really up to you, because by doing so you surrender the wakeup pressure of pinning the opponent with fans or persona.

One of the best ways to build stocks is after fullscreen Persona blockstrings. Most people like to bring their Persona back to them and avoid counterattacks by doing a Maragi, but you could just as easily do one (or even two) boosts, since Fire Boost will also pull the Persona back to Yuki. You can also fire off a C Maragi and detonate it with Fire Boost. This is great against people that like to roll and airdash a lot.

I try to build stocks in the Slab matchup since she has low health, but you have to be wary of reads and j.B. It's very nice to get high stocks, because then you can turn on Fire Break anytime you have 50 meter and be a legitimate threat. Even a simple string to Agi -> Agidyne will do quite a bit of damage, which is really important in matchups where you REALLY WANT to avoid your opponent hitting Awakening (Slab really comes to mind here).

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I'm a huge novice with Yukiko, but here's a question. In pretty much all the Yukiko matches I've seen, the Yukiko will sometimes drop a 1/2/3D after downing the opponent. I know this has to do with unblockable setups since those hit high, but I don't think I've seen 1/2/3D land a hit once. The other player always dodges it or runs past before the Persona drops or something. Why risk a card like that for something with such a low success rate? Or is it just the matches I watched?

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It's probably the matches you watched. With proper spacing in the corner you can punish rolls and DPs with j.B or 5A/2A and jumping won't necessary get them out of the corner. Landing unblockables, however, requires conditioning your opponent and not being predictable when you do your 2D set-up. Sometimes you need to extend your blockstrings or end them quicker to mess with your opponent's blocking so that they end up blocking instead of trying to disrespect your set-up. Sometimes you don't even bother with the set-up and then try to roll or DP in anticipation of the set-up, only for you to just get in a free punish. Just having 2D and the set-up is enough to force responses of some sort, which is important because at the end of the day you choose when you want to do the set-up.

It has gaps though. Teddie gets out of the set-up easily and Chie can at the very least get herself out of the corner. Without Agi in place alot of characters can easily disrespect it even if you space yourself correctly. If you're too close you can't punish rolls nearly as well.

And it also depends on the context. What I've said above it mostly for corner so the set-up is very practical in the corner, but in mid-screen 2D mostly functions as a zoning tool and to extend her pressure. After Agi B 2D allows Yukiko to extend her pressure with her C moves for some full-screen pressure and zoning.

Edited by Etherlight

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The way I see it, using 2D or j.D for that matter is a good way to reset pressure or you can use it as a bit of an Oki tool. 2D is really plus on block and being an overhead is a bonus. Midscreen there are some pseudo unblockables you can do such as... Sweep > j.D > Low Fan. I mainly use it if they're snoozing on defense 5B>2D. The setup is not absolute but if they choose to roll you can tag them with a 2A on recovery or throw if you feel like it will catch, if you space it right you can bait their DP with 2D also and if they block you just reset your pressure by +20~ at least. In the corner, 2D/j.D is probably your best friend because you have legitimate unblockables that are pretty tight with an Agi set in place. Even without the Agi you can use it with fans to call out rolls and other escape attempts.

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I'm learning to love 2D/j.D like a child. I've noticed too that if I send it out too far behind the enemy, they tend to just rush forward and forget about it, allowing me to bring my persona in behind with 5D and put in pressure that way if I get an opening. People forget about the persona a lot if it isn't in their face in my experience, but that's probably just because I haven't fought anyone that had a ton of Yukiko experience yet. Or I just play her weird. Regardless, it's great for pressure and/or for covering my ass if I need to keep the enemy away from me. I have that right, don't I?

Another question (sorry if the answer is in the OP): Are there many safe ways to set up Fire Break? My go-to guaranteed setup is to use C Maragidyne to push the opponent away, forcing a block or just outright smacking them with it, and Fire Break during that. Then I either use D Maragidyne to pull them back in with damage or sit on it until I have an opportunity for C Agidyne instead. That's nice and I've never seen anyone dodge through Maragidyne or superjump over it, but it costs 50 meter and requires awakening to do. Is it possible to set up Agis and Maragis to cover myself long enough to do it without a good chance of the enemy slipping through and nailing me?

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After an Agidyne C in the corner. Mid SB Agi combo, after a sweep (this one is iffy). If you're fullscreen and they block a C maragi or something. Look for oppurtunities.

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So it's just something I have to experiment with and feel out for myself? Thanks.

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One of my struggles is that I don't know what to do when I run out of cards. I normally resort to the following:
A) Super jumping and throwing fans
B) Autocombo into sweep (5A, 5A, 2AB) and then go into doing plan A

Anything I can do other than this? Sometimes I see Stunedge do the same thing, but I feel there's gotta be something better and less predictable. 
~Thanks  :)

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One of my struggles is that I don't know what to do when I run out of cards. I normally resort to the following:

A) Super jumping and throwing fans

B) Autocombo into sweep (5A, 5A, 2AB) and then go into doing plan A

Anything I can do other than this? Sometimes I see Stunedge do the same thing, but I feel there's gotta be something better and less predictable. 

~Thanks  :)

 

 

Without Persona, Yukiko is really limited, but you can still do some stuff :

 

- If you've got the right spacing, you can go for 5A>5AA>5BB>3B>5BB>IAD>jA*3>5A>5AA>Sweep. you get more damage, some corner carry, and some time to get your persona back

 

- If your opponent is good at chasing your backdashes and super jumps, you can just sit and throw fans to slow him down. At certain heights, xB air counter hits gives you a auto-combo follow-up if you don't have your persona. You can also try and slip airthrows here and there if the opponent is airdashing recklessly

 

- Jumping after a sweep makes a safe jump if the opponent choses to instant tech, so you can surprise him by playing  a mini-vortex game (not for too long though) revolving about jA safe jump, empty jump 2A/throw or jump airdash near the ground jA*3 or jA*2 j4B (the j4B should hit low if you do it correctly) or reposition yourself using airdash> airturn jB or jump >air turn > airdash jA (should hit overhead cross-up)

 

As  you've said, be unpredictable and try to adapt quickly to what your opponent does : You'll mostly try to run away to gain some time, but the options I have mentioned are still valid ones to add some variance to your game

 

 

Another question (sorry if the answer is in the OP): Are there many safe ways to set up Fire Break?

 

 

What Mikhail said, plus, when in awakening,  combo>236B>214214D> run forward>Fire Break> SB agi UB : this one is a little tricky but with the right confirms and MU knowledge, it is a deadly one

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