magz Report post Posted August 6, 2012 Taken from Kame's Chie Video Regarding Notation Move names replaced with inputs S66 = Slight Forward Dash RC = OMC (One More Cancel) RCB = OMB (One More Cancel Burst) HKD = Hard Knockdown (2AB and Aerial Hit 5AB) (X%/YYYY) = (Meter%/Damage) Blue Color = Hard Knockdown Red Color = Damage Focus (236236C/D or 236C/D Enders) Video Description Tips Corner 5C > 236B > 236B doesn’t connectTry adding a slight delay to 5C. J8D Land 5AB doesn’t connectDue to JC inertia slowing down landing you should replace JC with JBB. Why do you input JB during the 5AB-C combo?To prevent an accidental air dash. It is not necessary and was thus not included in the combo notation. Why do you turn around when faking a high into a low?Because when you do an air back dash you land faster. Okizeme Standard: HKD 2DDWorks on people who have 5f jabs (Narukami, Chie, Yousuke, Sanada, Aigis) Alternative: HKD 5DDWorks on people who have 6f+ jabs Can be jumped out of but should still hit in air Teddie: HKD 2D whiffs 5B (CH)His reversal beats 2DD cleanly so bait it with 2D which should whiff allowing for 5B punish on his attempted reversal. Corner Mixup (Following HKD 5/2DD) J7/8/9 AD Forward2A > 5AA > 5B > 5C > 2B > 2C > 5B > 2AB (0%@1602) JBB > 5B > 5C > 2B > 236A > 236A > 5B > 5C > 5AB (0%@2545) (On Crouching) JBB > 5B > 5C > 2B > 2C > 236B > 5AA > 5B > 5C >2B > 2C > 5B > 2AB (0%@3374) J8/9 JB > 236AB Land236B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 5C > 5AB (25%@2319)236AB will whiff but Chie will still glow indicating followup potential High/Low order is: JB (High) > 236B[1] (High) > 236B [2] (Low) Can use 236AB Strum B as well. Midscreen Mixup (Following HKD 5/2DD) J9 AD Forward2A > 5AA > 5B > 2B > 2AB (0%@983) JBB > 5B > 2B > 2AB (0%@1458) 66 J9 AD BackJBB > 5B > 5C > 2B > 2C > 5B > 2AB (0%@2331)Switch facing before AD Back (?) 2A > 5B > 5C > 2B > 2C > 5B > 2AB (0%@1636) Do not switch facing and you will land faster (but can be a dead giveaway) Corner Combos 2A > 5B > 5C > 236A > 236A > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 5B > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%@4000) 5B > 2B > 236A > 236A > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 5C > 5AB (0%@3129) 5B > 2B > 236A > 236A > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 214D > 236236D (50%@5095) 5B > 2B > 236A > 236A > 236236A > 5C > 236B > 236B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 214D > 236236D (100%@5718)Also works near corner 5C (CH) > 5B > 2B > 236A > 236A > 5B > 5C > 5AB (0%@2396) 5C (CH) > 5B > 2B > 236A > 236A > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 5B > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%@4756) 5AB-D (FC) > 5B > 5C > 2D > JD > 5AB (0%@2737) 5AB-D (FC) > 5B > 5C > 2D > JD > 236B > 236B > 214D > 236236D (50%@4720) 5BD (CH) > 5B > 5C > 8D > 5AB (0%@2671) 5BD (CH) > 5B > 5C > 8D > 236B > 236B > 214D > 236236D (50%@4722) 214C (FC) > 236236A > S66 5C > 5B > 5C > 2D > 5Cx4 > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 5C > 5B > 5C > 214C > 236236D (100%@7432)Probably need to backdash after each 5C during 5Cx4 [*]214C > 236236A > 5B > 5C > JC > 8D > 236B > 236B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 236236D (100%@5733) [*]214D (FC) > JC > JB > 5C > 44 5C > 66 5B > 5C > 2D > J7D > 236B > 236B > 214C > 236326D (50%@5174) [*]Movie notation incorrectly shows multiple aerial moves instead of grounded moves [*]236A (FC) > 5B > 2AB > JC > JB > 5C > 2D >[walk back] 5C > 44 5C > 44 5C > 44 5C > 66 5B > 236B > 236B > 5C > 5B > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%@7210) [*]Charged up 236A Fatal Counter Only Damage Variety [*]Use when you can guarantee a counter hit Midscreen Combos [*]5AB-C (FC) > JD > S66 5B > 5C > 5AB (0%@2516) [*]5AB-C (FC) > JD > S66 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 214C (D in Corner) > 236236D (50%@4422) [*](Awakened) 5BD (CH) > 214214D > SJ8 > 236D (50%@3363) [*]2B > JB > JC > 8D > 2AB > J7 > AD (Switch Facing?) JB (Crossup) (0%@1716+400+Followup) [*]2B > JBB > 8D > 2AB (0%@1666) [*]Switches sides [*]2B > JBB > 8D > 5AB (0%@1565) [*]2B > JB > JC > 8D > 5B > 2369B (?) > 236A > 214C > 236236D (50%@3878) [*]JB (CH) > 5B > 2B > JBB > 8D > 5AB (0%@1976) [*]JB (CH) > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > S66 5C > 5A > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%@4273) [*]Throw RC > 5C > 236B > 236B > (S66) > 236D (50%@3051) [*]All throws combos work regardless of direction/positioning. [*]Throw (CH) > S66 2A > 5C > 236B > 236B > 236D (0%@3147) [*]Throw (CH) > 2A > 5C > JB > JC > JB > JC > 236C (0%@2764) [*]Use if you have problems with S66 2A [*]Throw RCB > 5C > 236B > 236B > S66 5C > 5A > 5C > 214C > 236236D (0%/Burst@4416) [*]5B > 2B > 236A > 236A RCB > 5C > 236B > 236B > S66 5C > 5A > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%/Burst@5023) [*](On Crouching) 5B > 2B > 236A > 236B > 236D RCB > 5C > 236B > 236B > S66 5C > 5A > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%/Burst@6152) [*]5B (CH) > 2D > S66 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > S66 5C > 5A > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%@5333) [*]Easy 5k off 5B CH [*]5B > 2B > 236A > 236A > 236236A > Dash 5C > 236B > 236B > 236D (50%@4216) [*]Basic Charge A combo [*]5B > 2B > 236A > 236A > 236236A > 5C > 236B > 236B > S66 5C > 5A > 5C > 214C > 236236D (100%@5399) [*]5B > 2B > 236A > 236A > 236236A > 5C > 236B > 236B > 5C > 236B > 236B > 214D > 236236D (100%@5718) [*]Near corner only [*]5A > Block Burst > Dash 5C > 236B > 236B > S66 5C > 5A > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%@4041) [*]Burst Bait [*]214D (FC) > JC > JB > 5C > 44 5C > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > S66 5C > 5A > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%@4980) [*]236236C RC > 2A > 2B > JB > JC > JBB > JC > 236C (100%@4298) [*]Video notation incorrectly shows JB instead of JBB [*]236A (FC) > 5B > 2AB > JC > JB > 5C > 44 5C > 5B > 5C > 2DD > 236B > 236B > S66 5C > 5B > 5C > 5AB (0%@4740) [*]Charged up 236A Fatal Counter Only HKD Variety [*]Use when you can guarantee a counter hit [*]236A (FC) > 5B > 2AB > JC > JB > 5C > 44 5C > 66 5B > 5C > 44 5C > 66 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B > S66 5C > 5B > 5C > 214C > 236236D (50%@6797) [*]Charged up 236A Fatal Counter Only Damage Variety [*]Use when you can guarantee a counter hit Anywhere [*]5B > 2B > 2AB > 236236A > 5C > 5A > 5C > 236B > 236B > S66 5C > 5A > 5C > 214C > 236236D (100%@5548) Disclaimer: There may be some errors in the notation/damage/meter usage but it should be correct for the most part. I didn't notice it at first, but some of the video notation is incorrect so some of the earlier combos in each list may suffer from those types of errors. All combos were tested on Chie. _____________________________________________________________________________________________________ Dakanya just linked me an amazing mixup video: http://www.nicovideo.jp/watch/sm18680585 Setup 1+2 - Double crossup off blocked 5C midscreen 5C (blocked) IAD JC (crossup from back) OMB (crossup from front) If the IAD JC hits and you combo into OMB the combo goes 5B 5C JC JBB J8D land 236B 236B 214D 236236D (50%,4764) If the IAD JC is blocked but OMB hits the combo is the same as above but for 50%, 4801 damage. The third part shows that it beats out Yu's DP (and thus probably a lot of others except maybe Mitsuru?) Burst does not get used if they DP. I did a little testing with the help of Manabe yesterday. It will not beat Mitsuru, Kanji, Yukiko, or Teddie B+D. All other DPs will whiff or lose outright. All counter DPs except Teddie's will be triggered, but they will whiff and are punishable. The 4th and 5th parts show how you can use OMC to do the same type of mixup off 5C midscreen: 5C (blocked) IAD JC OMC falling JB The followup combo is 5B 236A 236A 236236A 66 (under opponent) 5C 44 5B 5C J8D JA Next is a section about a corner crossup setup: 5AAA (blocked+pulls opponent out of corner) IAD JB (crossup) JA 66 5AA 5B 2B JBB JA JC 66 5A 5B 2AB (0%,2228) Note: I think there was some discussion on these forums about how the auto combo pulls the opponent out of the corner but I don't think it was as fleshed out as this. Last section is a blockstring ending in 236A 236A (1) OMC (only works on tall people): 236A 236A (1) OMC JBB JA JC 5B 2B JBB JA JC 5A 5B 5C 214C 236236D (100%,4036) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Kujikawa Report post Posted August 6, 2012 Thank you ever so much for this, your amazing. +1000. This will be a great help and I also want to hug you. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dusk Thanatos Report post Posted August 6, 2012 Give this man a gold medal Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Glenburg89 Report post Posted August 7, 2012 Hey Magz, Thank you for taking the time to breakdown the Oki video. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Zoular Report post Posted August 8, 2012 Good stuff! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Celerity Report post Posted August 8, 2012 Thanks a ton. Was having trouble figuring out some of the combos in this video. Back to the lab! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mystic d Report post Posted August 8, 2012 For people trying to get the timing for the ...236A -> 5B -> 5C -> 236B -> 236B... in the corner, delay your 5C AND 236B inputs the same amount of time to get the 236B follow up to connect. Hope this helps Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Amadeous Report post Posted August 8, 2012 Thanks Magz, I'll get this transferred over to the combo thread ASAP that's done, so we can have it all in one area. Please if you guys have any more comments on this video to help with the techniques in it, keep sharing. If I missed anything in the combo thread, let me know. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JediMindTrick Report post Posted August 8, 2012 For people trying to get the timing for the ...236A -> 5B -> 5C -> 236B -> 236B... in the corner, delay your 5C AND 236B inputs the same amount of time to get the 236B follow up to connect. Hope this helps Does the character height matter? Like would the corner combo works differently on different characters? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Torwegia Report post Posted August 8, 2012 ...236A > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B... Is quite hard for me to get down consistently but it seems like you need to delay the C and rampage as long as possible to get it all to land. Guess I need to keep at it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Mystic d Report post Posted August 9, 2012 JediMindTrick: it seems to work fine against all characters Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
magz Report post Posted August 11, 2012 Edited Throw (CH) > 2A > 5C > JB > JC > JB > JC > 236C (0%@2764) to show 236C instead of 236D which does not work. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
OchiChernye Report post Posted August 14, 2012 ...236A > 5B > 5C > 236B > 236B... Is quite hard for me to get down consistently but it seems like you need to delay the C and rampage as long as possible to get it all to land. Guess I need to keep at it. Yeah I'm actually having a ton of trouble with this as well. 98% of the time my second 236B whiffs ;___; Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dusk Thanatos Report post Posted August 14, 2012 Yeah I'm actually having a ton of trouble with this as well. 98% of the time my second 236B whiffs ;___; Do ...236A>236A>5B>2C>41236B>236B. Push 2 and C at the same time (as in, don't hold 2 during the 5B animation, then input C; input 2C from neutral). This isn't a miracle solution, but it's an easy way to attempt to ingrain the correct delay into your head by making it something active and not something passive. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ayane Report post Posted August 15, 2012 (On Crouching) JBB > 5B > 5C > 2B > 2C > 236B > 5AA > 5B > 5C >2B > 2C > 5B > 2AB (0%@3374) it seems that this one leaves them in a state where they will be air blocking 2DD on recovery, recorded the combo as chie then tested against me recovering/blocking as naru. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dusk Thanatos Report post Posted August 15, 2012 Just do 5A>5B, instead of 5AA>5B It'll give hard knockdown Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ayane Report post Posted August 15, 2012 yup if u omit the 5b b4 the 2AB it will also give HKD edit: yours does abit more dmg tho so im usin that! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TG_Sneak Report post Posted August 15, 2012 I have a question about the oki. I try some of the setups mid match vs some characters but it just seems they can DP right out of my 5DD setup mid-screen and at times in the corner. Is there something I'm doing wrong? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dusk Thanatos Report post Posted August 15, 2012 5DD and 2DD aren't DP safe; they just force the opponent to block (for a loooooooong time) rather than mash jab on wakeup. If people are DPing out, just start Tomoe up, block instead of doing normal mixup (or jump and airblock, if their DP isn't air-unblockable like Yu's, and you want to make it look more like you're doing normal airdash mixup), and punish back into oki. Also, 5DD has more startup than 2DD, so your midscreen oki is much easier to DP/mash out of than your corner oki. Keep that in mind. I /think/ j.2D can be DP safe (read: they can DP and hit Tomoe but you won't get hit) if it's spaced right, so you may want to do j.2D over 5DD for midscreen okizeme sometimes. Need to test that to confirm it, but I'm pretty sure it's accurate. Also, don't try doing 5DD oki on Narukami, Chie, Yousuke, Sanada, or Aigis, if they seem to know their shit; they can just 5A and hit Tomoe before it's active. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TG_Sneak Report post Posted August 15, 2012 Okay I see, so it isn't an execution error compared to just the wrong decision. Thanks again for clarifying. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ayane Report post Posted August 16, 2012 something i just tested that i noticed some of the combos from the movie do. If u have them in the corner and doing 2DD oki; then try to do a airdash fake into a low; it will lose if they are blocking Tomoe and mashing 5A since Tomoe will leave shortly before u land and u still have to land then start up 2A while they can already have 2A starting. I guess the fix for this would b to just jump and do a falling j.B then 5B or jump then just dont j.B and just 2A (Note: you cant j.BB without the airdash) Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dusk Thanatos Report post Posted August 16, 2012 What do you mean by airdash fake? It's either jump>land 2A or jump>low airdash j.BB. Jump>airdash>land 2A is way too long. Secondly, you don't have to hit 2DD immediately after 2D; you can delay it a little, so Tomoe is out longer and covers your mixup better Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ayane Report post Posted August 16, 2012 yea thats what im saying, so if u airdash the opponent knows to stand up since u have to wait until the end of airdash to do j.BB and since they can see the airdash they know that they can mash out if u dont j.BB so im saying if u always just straight jump and never airdash; they have no clue if ur doin an overhead or a low. and u just miss out on the second b of j.bb Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Dusk Thanatos Report post Posted August 16, 2012 yea thats what im saying, so if u airdash the opponent knows to stand up since u have to wait until the end of airdash to do j.BB and since they can see the airdash they know that they can mash out if u dont j.BB so im saying if u always just straight jump and never airdash; they have no clue if ur doin an overhead or a low. and u just miss out on the second b of j.bb That's not how the mixup works at all. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sf4-gYnCgXM That explains why you do airdash j.BB. And you can't react to the airdash, lol. If you could, the mixup wouldn't hit people Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Ayane Report post Posted August 16, 2012 no this is pretty much what i was saying; see but in that vid jam attacks at the same time as she air dashes so ofc u cant see the diff; but for me at least when i do the jbb combo with chie it wasnt letting me j.bb until near the end of the dash; letting the opponent clearly see the dash. doin it wrong i guess; i just watched tetsu do what i was talking about tho. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
