[CP] Makoto Nanaya Loketest Changes Thread

[Bibiquadium]

Makoto Nanaya Chrono Phantasma Changes Thread

_______________________________________________________________

Move List:

Makoto

New Move: Cosmic Ray

214A > D, able to charge

New Move: Lander Blow

214A > C > D, able to charge

Changed Move: Shooting Star

Able to perform standalone using 236D

Through Overdrive usage, all her Drives are Level 3.

Notable Changes:

New Artwork

New Voice Actress

Loketest Updates:

New!

Cosmic Ray: A short Mappa that covers some distance. It doesn't give a knockdown on hit, but on CH it blows the opponent away and can wallstick on corner.

Lander Blow: A fast startup body blow. Has slight disadvantage on block; staggers on CH.

Buffs:

+5D untechable time increased; you can follow up 5D(3) with 2C again even after 2A.

+236D (Shooting Star) level 3 wallsticks. 2C > 236D > 6A > 2D (3) > j.B > j.D (3) works.

Nerfs:

-214A~C~B startup increased; can't follow-up on a crouching opponent from Lunatic Upper (214A~C).

-2D(3)'s vector was changed so that 2C no longer links from 2D(3). 5B and 5CC are still ok.

-Similar vector change for PF. Doesn't feel like you can follow up with 2D(3) after two hits.

-3C untechable time decreased; can't follow up with 2D(3) any longer.

-Can't follow up back throw with 2B any longer.

Neutral:

Parry hit (not to be confused w/ Space Counter) staggers backwards.

Cosmic Ray:*A Hell's Fang with more startup but harder to punish.

Lander Blow:*Good move to pressure because there's enough advantage to keep pressuring after it, but its startup is slow.

Got my hands on it so I'll lay out the points I noticed below.

5D's untechable time - long enough that even though I misinput dash 2c and got 3c, the 3c connected

6C> Lunatic Upper > Rush (stop after 1 hit) has become a lot more comfortable but can't pick up even with 5a

Stargazer's wall/turn effect lets you combo from midscreen -> corner with 6C > lunatic upper> star (?)

>5CC>OD>mini dash 5CC connected. During OD, 5CC>2D, 6A> JD as well

Grounded 2D > 2C doesn't work. 5D > 5B>6A>2D>2C is possible, 5B>6A>2D>JD isn't (but is during OD)

Off a High 2D hit, comet probably also works but forgot to check

Comboing Ragna, JD>5B>5CC didn't work. Did the hitbox get lowered? (also possible that it is due to proration)

As usual, with Jin in his slide state near the corner, 5B5C doesn't work

While down, Lunatic upper> stargazer doesn't work

One time I got a CH Corona Upper, the floating seemed higher, maybe it's once again possible to pick up afterwards?

Meteor dive as an ender needs to put in 1 or 2 beats earlier or they'll tech.

New moves seem hard to use during combos

Air throw can easily be followed up with 2b.

Combos I was able to do. May be able to be extended longer, but didn't test.

・2A>5B>5CC>5D>2C>Star>5CC>Corona

・6BC>5D>2C>Star>6A>2D(>6A)>JB>JD>5CC>Corona

・Forward throw>Stargazer>6A>2D>6A>JB>JD>5D>5CC>Corona

Ideas:

・2A>5B>5CC>5D>5CC>JB>JD>微ダ2C>スター>5CC>コロナ

・6BC>5D>2C>スター>5B>dl6A>2D>コメット>5CC>JB>JD>5CC >コロナ

・6投げ>スター>6A>5D>2C>コメット>5CC>JB>JD>2Dor5CC>コロナ

・6BC>5D>OD>2C>スター>5B>6A>2D>JD>スラコメ>5CC>コロナ

Feels like if you search for the right starter

then stargazer and comet both should have workable routes

But from tomorrow, there's no loketest so we can't look for them

Played at the loketest. Makoto seems straight up stonger.

Lander lvl 3 leaves at a slight advantage if blocked I believe

Numerous times, we both jumped afterwards, and I got into the air first.

During matches, after having lander blocked, my moves afterwards were all CHs.

But, Lunatic upper > Lander level 3, got thrown in between, so level 3 doesn't seem like it works to stop mashing.

Cosmic ray as others have written is a rush move. Slightly negative on block and leaves a bit away, cannot be punished. Excellent.

A+B crush trigger seems to have a swinging down motion (don't remember well)

Slightly delayed activation while gatling did not allow for a cancel.

guard crush state lets you easily do a dash 5c.

Air throw > 2a connected with no gauge.

Other characters have lost lots of jump cancels or gatlings, but all of ours are intact as of now.

But not enough ways to stop mashing. This might be the spot to write about in the survey.

Also planning to go tomorrow, so if there is anything you guys want me to test out, say so.

Learned little but I'll write what I did.

After hitting with 2D(1) and then hitting with 2D(3), as before, same move proration is applied.

A asteroid -> D is surprisingly slow. Particularly, seems hard to use except from long or mid range due to priority.

The below is previously covered, but with the intent of reinforcing it:

5D untechable time is certainly longer

Air throw can be picked up with 2b.

Mid screen to corner slide down doesn't allow for lunatic upper -> stargazer to connect.

Lunatic upper's floating is higher, and you end up whiffing quite a bit below them.

As part of a combo, stargazer doesn't seem usable.

Rush RC > dash 2C>2D still hits. Might be the thing to do midscreen if you have meter?

Aerial > Corona > Lvl 2 meteor dive > RC > purple grab is also doable this time around.

調べられなかった事 (Things I couldn't research)

・２Cに同技補正があるのかどうか。

相手の人に受身取らないように頼んで調べようと思ったけどできんかった＞＜；

２C＞ブレーキ＞２C＞ブレーキ＞２C＞スター

２C＞ブレーキ＞６C＞ブレーキ＞６C＞スター

辺りのダメージ比較をすれば分かると思うので時間のある人お願いします。

J2C is still negative on block.

Asteroid doesn't have projectile invincibility. Neither does the new move cosmic ray.

Lander and cosmic don't seem to be able to be used in combos. With OD maybe there is a chance.

Tried to land a crush trigger on Tager in the middle of a combo. 6A CH > Crush trigger connected, but didn't seem to be able to follow up after that.

Corner slide down/jin against the wall, 5B and 5CC wouldn't connect, but, just in the case of the slide caused by 5D, it was possible to follow up afterwards if you dash right in.

Lunatic upper > gazer wasn't able to be beat with insta block > throw (Report from opponent)

That last bit is quite nice if it is true, but time was up before it could be thoroughly checked.

This time the adjustments seem to be a step forward from EX. Personally, I was quite happy with it.

[Exciel]

Her JP voice actress is actually still Tomomi Isomura, the rest of the JP BB cast should be unchanged as well. source

From a guy who played 1st location test twice:

2回触ってきたよー

新技

コズミックレイ：簡単に言うと移動距離の短いマッパ　ダウンしないけどカウンターで吹っ飛び＋壁貼り付き

ランダーブロー：ボディブロー発生速い、ガードされて5分（or微不利）、カウンターでよろけと主力レベル

変更点

後ろ投げから2Bで追撃できない

3C受け身不能時間減少　2D3は無理だった

5D受け身不能増加　小パンからでもダッシュ2Cが間に合うほど長い

スターlv3が端で壁張り付き　2C>スター>6A>2D3>JB>JD3まで確認

ゲイザー発生鈍化　しゃがみくらいでもルナから繋がらない

ベクトル修正にともない2D3から2Cで拾えない　5B、5CCはOK

パーティカルも同様　裏回り2D3はまず無理っぽい

パリング成立時の打撃（スペカンじゃないほう）カウンターで後退よろけ

覚えてる限りではこんなもん

I don't know how to translate the descriptions for the new moves well so I'll only attempt the changes to old moves.

4Throw - can't be followed up with 2B.

3C - untechable knockdown time decreased. Can't link into 2D L3.

5D - untechable time increased. Enough time to link dash 2C after a whiffed jab(?).

236D (Shooting Star) - Level 3 still wallsticks. 2C>Sh.Star>6A>2D L3>j.B>j.D L3 works

214A~C~B (Star Gazer) - Start up slowed. Can't link on a crouching opponent from Lunatic Upper (214A~C).

2DL3 - vector was changed so that 2C no longer links from 2D L3. 5B and 5CC are still ok.

236236D (Partical Flare) - Similar change for PF. Doesn't feel like you can follow up with 2D L3 after two hits.

46 (Parry) - Parry hit (not to be confused w/ Space Counter) staggers backwards(?).

[Arc Raizen]

Can the backthrow not be followed up at all because of this? What else would work?

Either way, having 5D > 2C back, Shooting Star having Corner Bounce/Stick back is great, and the nerfs are't terrible and provide some decent balance while she retains her power. If we can confirm a fix to Lightning Arrow to have it floor bounce again and more info on her 2 new moves, I am starting to get excited for this after the atrocity that was Extend.

[Bibiquadium]

so far so bad, any info about orb oki?

[HiagoX]

Wow I fucking hate you guys for having me panic while reading "New Voice Actress".

2回触ってきたよー

新技

コズミックレイ：簡単に言うと移動距離の短いマッパ　ダウンしないけどカウンターで吹っ飛び＋ 壁貼り付き

Cosmic Ray: A short Mappa that covers some distance. It doesn't give a knockdown on hit, but on CH it blows the opponent away and can wallstick on corner.

ランダーブロー：ボディブロー発生速い、ガードされて5分（or微不利）、カウンターでよろけ と主力レベル

Lander Blow: A fast startup body blow. Has slight disadvantage on block; staggers on CH.

変更点

後ろ投げから2Bで追撃できない

-Can't follow up back throw with 2B any longer.

3C受け身不能時間減少　2D3は無理だった

-3C untechable time decreased; can't follow up with 2D(3) any longer.

5D受け身不能増加　小パンからでもダッシュ2Cが間に合うほど長い

+5D untechable time increased; you can follow up 5D(3) with 2C again even after 2A.

スターlv3が端で壁張り付き　2C>スター>6A>2D3>JB>JD3まで確認

+236D (Shooting Star) level 3 wallsticks. 2C > 236D > 6A > 2D (3) > j.B > j.D (3) works.

ゲイザー発生鈍化　しゃがみくらいでもルナから繋がらない

-214A~C~B startup increased; can't follow-up on a crouching opponent from Lunatic Upper (214A~C).

ベクトル修正にともない2D3から2Cで拾えない　5B、5CCはOK

-2D(3)'s vector was changed so that 2C no longer links from 2D(3). 5B and 5CC are still ok.

パーティカルも同様　裏回り2D3はまず無理っぽい

-Similar vector change for PF. Doesn't feel like you can follow up with 2D(3) after two hits.

パリング成立時の打撃（スペカンじゃないほう）カウンターで後退よろけ

Parry hit (not to be confused w/ Space Counter) staggers backwards.

Translated what wasn't translated yet and corrected any mistakes (in bold). Feel free to bring more info, I'll translate it.

About the changes, most of them were nerfs but whatever buffs we got were pretty good - I'm actually satisfied. Very excited about her new moves too.

[Bibiquadium]

Can't wait to see actual footage/stream to analyze it all.

[Arc Raizen]

Those were my same thoughts, then NOPE; no vids or pics allowed. Maybe someone can sneak something or they'll just keep it quiet for the first day or two. Even so, any video is likely to be focused on Amane, Bullet and Azrael. Everyone stopped caring about Makoto after Extend.

[Bibiquadium]

Except Goro and some of us here.

[Lusterleon]

Need some footage to shine some light on these nerfs....

[Teutonicknight]

Great, more nerfs... But new moves are always welcome. I hope she's more flexible this time around, then I'll be happy. But that new Cosmic Ray move... How much distance does it cover? Half-screen perhaps? Maybe 1/3?

[OmniSScythe]

Do remember guys these are just loke test changes, nothing is final just yet.

[Eshi]

I will say that CS2 Noel's loctest changes also looked like mostly a bunch of nerfs and that obviously turned out to not be the case.

with that said, it still looks like a bunch of stupid nerfs to an already bad character. Maybe it's hidden in the frame data. I wonder if the new shooting star wall bounces from midscreen like the old 236AD?

[Bibiquadium]

Must also take into account the major changes in game mechanic with wall bound and wall bounce removed and all being wall stick and apparently her moves are relatively fast and has diversity for wall stick.

[HiagoX]

I will say that CS2 Noel's loctest changes also looked like mostly a bunch of nerfs and that obviously turned out to not be the case.

with that said, it still looks like a bunch of stupid nerfs to an already bad character. Maybe it's hidden in the frame data. I wonder if the new shooting star wall bounces from midscreen like the old 236AD?

It doesn't wallbounce anymore, though. Apparently it just wallsticks so I'd say corner only.

Also, I don't think it matters but her Overdrive is named "G-Impact" (G stands for Galaxian).

[Bibiquadium]

5D tech time increase and form of midscreen combo ability removed its gonna be a corner only thing... 6B 5D 236D whiff 5A run to corner get hype.

[Eshi]

Must also take into account the major changes in game mechanic with wall bound and wall bounce removed and all being wall stick and apparently her moves are relatively fast and has diversity for wall stick.

there's only wall stick now? that's interesting.

[StarGazer]

The game undergoes a big change now, its hard to tell how good Makoto will be from reading the changes or even from first day thoughts. I can see what they are trying to do with most of these changes but nerfing the backthrow like this is weird.

[Teutonicknight]

What they did to her in Extend was overkill.

[Bibiquadium]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFx5aFKte58

Not much to see.

[Arc Raizen]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PFx5aFKte58

Not much to see.

Plenty to see:

1) 2D doesn't send enemy as high as before @ 1:56

2) 2D > 6C in the corner @1:57

3) 5D > 6C pickup in the corner @ 2:04

4) Shooting Star wall stick @ 2:06

5) 6C > 214A~C > Shooting Star (maybe Lander Blow?) still works @ 2:54

5) Look at the back-step range on Shooting Star @ 3:32

Sure, we could have seen more, but that's a pretty good start.

[Bibiquadium]

I must be blind then because clearly I could hardly see charge levels inputs and whatnot, but then again I'm watching on my cellphone.

[StarGazer]

Must be your cellphone because the quality is okay for me.

Lander Blow is laaame, i expected something new to have fun with not the same move we had but with a different name (Maybe it doesn't share the SMP with Shooting Star 236D?)

We don't need to be at a very close range to the corner to start our corner combos now thanks to 5D untechable time buff and 214ACD Wallstick (but it seems we lost 5D > 214ACB )

214ACB is slower, we can't put it in our combos or use it on crouching confirm combos anymore.

Its not only 2D that launches lower now, the whole game gravity feels increased now.

Until now all the changes revolves around Makoto's reward.

Someone translate the stuff on JBBS Makoto boards please :3

http://jbbs.livedoor.jp/bbs/read.cgi/game/45148/1330224487/830

http://jbbs.livedoor.jp/bbs/read.cgi/game/45148/1330224487/832

http://jbbs.livedoor.jp/bbs/read.cgi/game/45148/1330224487/839

http://jbbs.livedoor.jp/bbs/read.cgi/game/45148/1330224487/847

And more out there but these posts feels more important.

Apparently 214ACCCCC > 5A Still doesn't work

[something_GNU]

I don't think that's Lander Blow

I believe you can still input 236D for Shooting Star during the A Asteroid Series? If I recall reading off of Makoto's movelist on the PDF

[Arc Raizen]

Lander Blow is laaame, i expected something new to have fun with not the same move we had but with a different name (Maybe it doesn't share the SMP with Shooting Star 236D?)

And more out there but these posts feels more important.

Apparently 214ACCCCC > 5A Still doesn't work

How sure are you that Lander Blow really is Shooting Star, just during Asteroid Vision (even though it always WAS during AV...stupid change then).

I was really hoping that, from how the name implies, it might have been a sort of ground-pound or punch a-la Crimson Viper since she had a very noticeable attack in story mode that nearly killed Carl and cratered the ground. If it functioned as a sort of AoE shockwave on either side of her and/or was a new launch possibilty, I thought it would be really cool. But, apparently I cannot guess stuff like that solely off of attack names.

Does 214ACCCCC > 2A work? Not letting us combo off of that not only feels, but also looks awkward. We've never been able to get much off it, they're just hating on Makoto...

I don't think that's Lander Blow

I believe you can still input 236D for Shooting Star during the A Asteroid Series? If I recall reading off of Makoto's movelist on the PDF

I don't think that Shooting Star was listed under Asteroid Vision on her movelist PDF at all, but without someone specifically telling me 'yes' or 'no,' I can only guess whether or not Shooting Star is useable/cancelable out of Asteroid Vision or no.

[StarGazer]

Because in the video Makoto used it after Lunatic Upper, and Lunatic Upper follow ups are Mars/Star Gazer/Infinite Rush/Lander Blow so it must be Lander Blow unless Lunatic Upper can go into Shooting Star without our know.