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LM_Akira

Order-Sol vs. May

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Originally posted by WUT:

She received a tensionless damage options in ^C, HOS became a real char. May can't poke you with anything other than dolphins (in Greed Sever-esque fashion), 5HS, 3K, 2S and j.2HS. Anything else gets destroyed by 5K and 2P. May cannot anti-air you without committing herself (read: dolphin). 5S(f) beats/trades with dolphin from further out; a running 6P either CHs or puts you at neutral ground if she escapes (and starts your offense if she guards). May can't pick anything up after a 2S except a Dolphin; it just stops you from running in. J.HS beats her 6P and j.P beats her in the air. If the May you're fighting likes 3K, Fafnir and enjoy your CH or bait and score a 2D CH. If your May has a penchant for 5HS, don't throw lows and stick to 2S CC (not max range, or you'll get CH). J.2HS has always been a problem, but if she starts it from higher up you can either Storm Viper or GunBlaze and win.

May has no options on your wakeup. SV and GB eliminate anything that isn't 5K; 5HS beats beats 5K on wakeup (yes, it's hysterical). 5HS is always a threat, but if you learn to IB her options after it are limited to what you do. Charged 6HS is an overhead, but she doesn't get anything else after it except a dolphin (around 125 or so damage if you eat it).

If you have to guard, watch for the throw, keep in mind that vertical dolphins are ridiculous Greed Severs if you want to poke (they're freaking grounded and overheads ), and try don't poke after her 5HS. Her 5D/5D low is tricky to guard too. Fear the overhead more than the low in that situation and just watch for the fake. A good visual cue is that her spinning slows down slightly before the high hit even comes out (and she does another spin, as well) during the low variation.

Oh, and never Rock It to get in; you're just begging for a 6P to CH your ass.

You can pretend 5HS and 5S (both close and far) will anti-air May, but they won't. In fact, that's the quickest way for May to score that lovely CH j.HS for 230+ Tensionless damage. If May resigns herself to staying in the air and spamming j.HS and j.2HS, the only "reliable" means of getting her to stop is SV and GB, respectively. If you're wanting to get inside, work on alternating between FD braking, running 6Ps, and the occasional running SV to whiff/stuff May's CH fishing. Personally, I prefer to sit back and Charge, making May come to me.

As a tangent, I'm finding out more and more just how awesome 6P is for poking and closing the gap. It beats or whiffs so much air to ground stuff, and stuffs the most absurd ground pokes (example: both May's Horizontal and Vertical Dolphins, FB'd or not). It's a shame the anti-air CH is so fail, otherwise I'd probably crutch on it to anti-air more than 5HS and SV.

Back on topic: FB Dolphin tick throw is dirty. No escape is guaranteed or even remotely safe. An IB'd backdash attempt can get stuffed by things like 2D (it's active for forever), a running 6P (wtf, you're almost dizzy now), or even a running 3K (not safe at all for May, so not seen as often). If you attempt to SV, you open yourself up for an epic Tensionless punish (as always with SV, but May's punish just hurts so much more because it's both free and knocks down, setting up May's dangerous Oki). If you decide to jump then you open yourself up to an air throw for knockdown + oki (May's fast jump and slightly larger air throw range will net her reaction air throws like this all the time if you get even remotely predictable). And just sitting still, of course, opens you up to continued pressure or OHK. All that being said, it would seem 1F jumping is your safest bet.

There is also lots of discussion of Order-Sol vs. May in this post:

http://www.dustloop.com/forums/showpost.php?p=225225&postcount=10

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just some random things if she gets too predictable with vertical dolphins gunblaze for free CH. j.HS and j.2HS is annoying as fuck. NEVER jump against this unless you're pissed off and feel ballsy by jumping SV. it's real quick and could SOMETIMES get it, but all it really does it give you charge, make her take damage, and reset the situation. (unless you frc into some sort of offense.) if you're on the ground this is where some mind games can begin. run, FD stop, rinse repeat until she makes a mistake. then punish. HOS punishes reaaaaaaaallll well. once she's on the ground she's yours. she has nothing that can stop you except a wakeup super. so remember to either bait or gunblaze more when she has 50% tension. blocking may herself isn't the big problem (as she's not that bad to block, except for her dust which you should either jump, poke, or block into punish) but her going for a tick command grab. that shit hurts. some people get hit by dolphin crossup alot, but I don't think it's that bad. just some random stuff. no mays in NYC. :(

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just some random things

if she gets too predictable with vertical dolphins gunblaze for free CH.

Never ever do this if she has 25% meter, she will Force Break her dolphin and you will eat it.

You can deal with some vertical dolphin shenanigans by using j.P. If she tries to do silly stuff like whiffed SVD into OHK grab, you can j.P it on reaction for a free short juggle. You have to be careful, though. Again, be wary of Force Breaks.

One other annoying thing is that if you use Storm Viper on vertical dolphins, the Force Break version will usually beat you out (and sometimes if you do it too late, she can block anyway without having to use the FB). You can fix this by changing the timing, ie doing the uppercut later. If the May player isn't paying attention, they'll fall right into your SV. She can still FD though, so this will only catch them if they are sleeping.

j.HS and j.2HS is annoying as fuck. NEVER jump against this unless you're pissed off and feel ballsy by jumping SV. it's real quick and could SOMETIMES get it, but all it really does it give you charge, make her take damage, and reset the situation. (unless you frc into some sort of offense.)

Unfortunately you are going to have to live with this. You can fight May on the ground somewhat, but May is perfectly capable of spending the majority of the fight in the air. She can jump out of a lot of your pressure pretty easily, so resign yourself to going for the occasional Storm Viper to stop her bullshit.

Ryan-Bill informed me that it is possible to jump up and IB her j.HS and then throw her. This CAN work, but you have to be below her in order for it to be effective; if she is low enough to the ground, she will land and be able to defend or attack before you gain any real initiative.

BTW, IBing poorly spaced/spammed air normals and punishing is pretty effective in general.

once she's on the ground she's yours. she has nothing that can stop you except a wakeup super. so remember to either bait or gunblaze more when she has 50% tension.

Just getting May on the ground isn't enough, you have to get her into a lockdown and consistenly punish her for attempting to jump out of your pressure. Avoid typical frame traps you would use on other characters because her quick floaty jump will make it very easy for her to escape your usual fare. Again, lockdowns if possible and try to force a 50/50 on her while she is blocking.

blocking may herself isn't the big problem (as she's not that bad to block, except for her dust which you should either jump, poke, or block into punish)

Her Dust can be fuzzy guarded by guarding high first, then guarding low a split second later. This way you will be able to guard both the normal attack and the feint. Ideally you want them to use the normal version since you can punish that; don't attack after blocking the feint since it is JCable.

but her going for a tick command grab. that shit hurts. some people get hit by dolphin crossup alot, but I don't think it's that bad.

Command grab is 4 frames, which makes it as fast as your punches. The good news is the range on it is pretty small, so she doesn't get as many chances to go for it as she might like; running in from a distance gives you an opportunity to see her go for it and poke her first. Backdash and 1F jump work well to escape it.

Dolphin crossups are easy to deal with as long as you can remember which way you're facing when you get up from knockdowns.

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Originally posted by WUT:

Oh, and never Rock It to get in; you're just begging for a 6P to CH your ass.

Oh, and never Rock It to get in; you're just begging for a 6P to CH your ass.

Oh, and never Rock It to get in; you're just begging for a 6P to CH your ass.

Oh, and never Rock It to get in; you're just begging for a 6P to CH your ass.

Oh, and never Rock It to get in; you're just begging for a 6P to CH your ass.

Oh, and never Rock It to get in; you're just begging for a 6P to CH your ass.

Oh, and never Rock It to get in; you're just begging for a 6P to CH your ass.

Oh, and never Rock It to get in; you're just begging for a 6P to CH your ass.

Oh, and never Rock It to get in; you're just begging for a 6P to CH your ass.

http://www.dustloop.com/forums/showpost.php?p=225225&postcount=10

:mad:

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Everyone's 6P can be dealt with crouching attacks. After seeing footage of you Sesshryu, you seem to have a problem with 6Ps in general.

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